Your Favorite Edge Angle for Sharpening?

[vivi]

I don't know specific measurements, but I like my edges in the ballpark of 4-6 degrees per side on the back bevel and 10 degrees per side for a microbevel. This is how I grind my EDC's.




This is much thinner than most people grind their edges. However I've found very few people (Actually none come to mind off the top of my head) that have used these types of edges and found they disliked them.

For everyone grinding their back bevels at 10 degrees per side or thicker, have you ever tried thinner back bevels? If so, why did you not keep using them? Were there any specific uses you did where the edge simply would not hold up?

I ask this because it seems most people have never tried taking a knife this thin. I suggest anyone who hasn't buy an FRN Byrd (Less than 20$) and give it a shot. I originally took a Cara Cara flat to the stone and ever since that's the only way I like my edges to be.

If you think these edges are weak, then here are two videos for you to watch of the knife pictured above:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=2io7hAL0mcc
http://youtube.com/watch?v=yDdk0IJYXyQ

I still haven't found out how thin is too thin for my typical uses, which includes cardboard, food, thin rope, whittling and shaping wood and touching up missed spots from shaving.

So, why is the general consensus to grind back bevels at 30 degrees per side? I have axes and large kuhkuris thinner than this and they do not fail when chopping down trees.

More thinned out edges: http://raum.10gbfreehost.com/gallery.html

[Bolster]

Been awhile since we collected data on this, so bumping for folks who have joined in the past couple years.

[Jet B]

I just have a Sharpmaker so 20 per side is easy to maintain. If I had an edgepro, I would probably try some thinner bevels. It's just too slow removing a lot of metal even with the diamond rods.

[dbcad]

I generally go for 15 per side. Backbevels vary although I shoot for slightly lower than the actual edge.

[chuck_roxas45]

I used to go for thinner angles(a little less than 30 for ease of touchups on the SM) but I find that my ham handedness is just a bit much for that kind of edge. Now I just mostly put a 36/40 edge on my knives and accept the loss of cutting performance for the durability gained.

[SQSAR]

+1 with Chuck. I used to be enticed by the cutting ability of uber-thin edges, but have backed off a bit for sake of edge durability. Of course this is all predicated on the fact that the actual edge angle I settle on varies depending on the type of steel I'm working with at the time.

[ChapmanPreferred]

I usually sharpen until my edges fail, with the way I use a knife; then strengthen the angle until it gives good service...Take Care...Ed

Hi Ed,
It is always good to read your posts. I hope you are doing well. What sharpening media/method (stones, Sharpmaker freehand, sand paper, belts on a grinder) do you typically use to accomplish your sharpening?
Sincerely,
Doug

PS: This was the only picture that came out clear. Sorry for the bad lighting. He loves the shirt!

[Frapiscide]

So far I've used around 15 per side for my knives and works fine w/o any edge damage. My H1 ladybug I raise a little more on the stones because of it being softer, probably around 17~20 degrees per side. The M4 that's coming in tomorrow will probably be set around 15 per side once I need to resharpen.

[Evil D]

Oops, i voted 30 and read it too fast, i do about 25-30 inclusive, not per side.

[razorsharp]

12 back, 17 micro :D

[Bill1170]

15º per side for most knives, 20º per side on soft kitchen knives that get used by family. A few knives even lower than 15º per side, like the ZDP Delica for instance at 10º per side.

[Ankerson]

I use 20, 18, 15 and 12 degrees per side depending on the knife and steel.

[jackknifeh]

I chose 17.5 and 20 deg. per side. As requested these are the angles right on the edge. I call it the edge bevel. The back bevel as I call it (I think these are Spyderco's terms so I use them to provide a standard vocabulary) I will put at 15 or 12.5. The higher edge bevels are to make it easier and faster to touch-up an edge. I recently sharpened my Gayle Bradley to 15 deg. per side using one bevel. Now as I touch it up I'll use 18 deg. per side. 20 deg. per side for the edge bevel is ok too and the setting recommended by Spyderco and the Sharpmaker setting for the edge bevel. I use 20 deg. per side for ZDP-189. The higher angle reduces chipping some. This is one example of the steel, not the cutting needs has a big determining factor in my decision. The better steels can hold up to lower angles than I use but I don't really need them that low and I have the security of a little added edge strength. What I'm really looking for in better steels is edge retention, not very low angles. My cutting needs don't require super low angles.

I've had this conversation about common edge angles a couple of times with Ben Dale (Edge Pro inventor) also and the previously stated angle from him is exactly what he told me also. I think pocket knives are sharpened at slightly higher angles for ease and consistancy in manufacturing and so the buyers won't roll the edge right out of the box when using it hard. With the newer and better steels available in the past few years I believe the standard for angles can be lowered because the steel will hold up better with lower angles.

Jack

[.357 mag]

I started something new a week ago.

I've had my EP for about a year now and when I first got it, I ran a full polished (3000 grit) 15 degree edge. Then I got the Congress stones and ran the same degree edge out to 600 grit. Then last week, I started a 15 degree,600 grit backbevel and a 20 degree, 1000 grit micro bevel. I like the this one the best so far.

[jackknifeh]

I started something new a week ago.

I've had my EP for about a year now and when I first got it, I ran a full polished (3000 grit) 15 degree edge. Then I got the Congress stones and ran the same degree edge out to 600 grit. Then last week, I started a 15 degree,600 grit backbevel and a 20 degree, 1000 grit micro bevel. I like the this one the best so far.

How wide is the micro bevel. I normally use the term micro when I just hit the edge with as few strokes as possible to create a higher angle (like 20 per side) right at the edge. At first glance you might not even see that there is a micro bevel. Then as I touch up the edge over time the micro bevel turns into what I'd call the edge bevel. It is no longer a micro bevel after it becomes wider. When the edge bevel gets large enough (long time) it would be time to use the 15 degree setting again to "lower" the back bevel making the blade thinner at the edge. In doing this the 15 deg bevel will get wider and the 20 degree edge bevel would get thinner and I'd call it a micro bevel again. That's how I think about and refer to the edge angles.

Jack

[.357 mag]

Just what you said Jack. I hit the edge just enough to raise a burr on both sides. Right now I can't see the micro bevel at all. Over time it will get larger.

[phillipsted]

I use a WEPS for most of my work - with a collection of stock and custom stones, polishing tapes and strops. I also have a couple of nice bench stones and strops.

I typically set the primary bevel at 17 degrees for most knives - but take it down to 15 degrees for ZDP-189 blades. I'm not a big fan of microbevels - I prefer to hone the edge with strops. 17 wasn't an option on the survey, so I selected 17.5. :-)

TedP

P.S. - I also have a first edition SharpMaker (with only one sharpening angle) and an ancient Lansky system. Neither of these get much use any more...

[unit]

My "favorite" angle is the lowest one I have ever attempted (3.5 degrees per side). It is my favorite because I have never been able to use it without a giant grin. And YES, it is somewhat delicate, so it only gets used for certain tasks(but the tasks are harder than many people would guess for an edge that survives at this angle)

On a more practical note. The grind angle I use MOST of the time, is 15 degrees per side. If anyone told me that they think a 15 per side is too low, I would have to laugh at them a bit. I am not sure how some people use their knives, but I have choppers that are at 15 per side and we punish these edges ruthlessly and they work and work!

[ICSK]

Interesting thoughts on how people base their sharpening angles. Here are my thoughts:

I like to keep my EDC knives at a "high" 20 degrees per side. Don't get me wrong, these edges are stropped on cardboard so I get a fair amount of cutting performance for the edge angle. My thinking behind the 20 dps is that I have yet to come across an EDC situation where this edge has not provided an environment where I felt I did not have enough control over the blade to use it safely while slicing and it makes for easy maintenance on the SharpMaker. In addition to this, I generally don't dabble in high-end steels on my knives. For me, it's all about a functional design over blade steel. All of the steels I use hold an edge for a fairly lengthy time at 20 dps. My one exception in an EDC scenario is when I want to add some diversity to a VERY small knife collection. Taking the edge to 15 dps just makes you fall in love with the knife all over again. It reminds you why you bought it and provides such an enjoyable cutting experience.

Of course, all of this thinking is thrown completely out the window when I have a specialized task. Take for instance my chisel and mason's hammer that I use for fossil collecting. Since most of the time they're only splitting soft shale I have no objections to giving them a 10 - 20 degree inclusive edge. The shale doesn't degrade the edge very much even at that low angle and they're made out of tool steel (though which one is not specified. Still better than most stainless steels).


So, to sum up, 20 degrees for EDC scenarios where cutting tasks can vary greatly. 15 or lower for fun or specialized tasks.

[Bolster]

I've been using 15 dps for the edge (back bevel around 12 dps) for years with Spydercos and have not had problems with edge failure, even in "humble" VG-10. That's why I keep using 15--no failures, and easy to touch up with the sharpmaker. Plus, it's the most popular edge put on by enthusiasts here, so how could all these guys be wrong??? (If I were using say, 440A steel or something, then I would probably angle up for a weaker steel.)

However I do use my knives for cutting and slicing, not hacking or digging. I recently ground a hatchet edge to 30 degrees inclusive (a one sided chisel grind, so dps doesn't really make sense, but functionally the same as a two-sided 15 dps), and had failures all over the place! Reset that edge to 50 included, but felt rather foolish asking an axe to hold an edge I put on my Spydercos.

My "favorite" angle is the lowest one I have ever attempted (3.5 degrees per side).

GET OUTTA HERE! Seriously? Can we see photos?