What's A Real Knife Attack Like?

[stonyman]

I have said this before and I will say it again. I feel that all law enforcement officers should be exposed to working in a prison institution. Jimid, I started out my law enforcement career working at the state prison. Folks these stories are real! My first chance meeting with prison life happened on my first day of orientation. It was eight of us that day. First of all for the tough guys let me backtrack. We entered the prison(maximum security) at the front gate. You walk through 4 very large electronic gates that slams shut behind you. Before you even get to the first checkin point with the metal detector to get on the inside of the prison. Once you past the check point and able to gain entry. You past two more gates that close like a vault and with a loud clang behind you. The pucker factor is definitely on high. Now we enter the main corridor of the prison and once again walk several feet and clang!!! another gate open and shut. Now you come to the realization that your freedom and safety is in serious trouble. At this point we approach the entrance door to the cafeteria. An officer opens the locked door the cafeteria. Fine no sweat until one minute later the first of nearly 150 of the worst criminals in the state begin to file into this hall with approximately 4 officers not including us newbies. Once the last of the inmates files in the door is locked shut from the outside so we are now locked in this chow hall with the worst of the worst with horrible odds. One poor young kid beside me was so scared that he literally clung to the rail next to the food line turning more pale by the minute. Everything was going smoothly until about 10 minutes or so this one inmate had just left the food line with his tray and sat his food down on the table and proceeded to go to the rear of the cafeteria where the drinks were. As he was walking he had the biggest smile on his face laughing and joking with some guys as he passed and as he approached this one guy who was facing away with his back to the isle, out comes this shank from this inmates person as he stabbed this guy who was seated facing away from him. The seated man did not know what hit him as he just fell into a heap on the floor. This was my first day and I could not believe that this guy did not so much as frown one time as he killed this guy! By the time the help arrived and the door flung open with about 15-20 C.O.'s. Six of the eight people in our orientation group left never to be seen again. Hey remember this was one incident on my first day of four years as a c.o. several years ago. There are so many incidents that can be talked about, let's just say that there is no accident that I have a fond apreciation and passion to learn and continue to make people more aware of violent encounters. This incident was one that was observed there were several where I or one of my teammates at the time were the object of a convicts attack. Jimid and to all of my law enforcement forumites please stay safe and prayerful out there. To those who are not in these guys shoes just keep them in your prayers because you are always in mine!

[Jimd]

Stony...you had a crappy first day on the job, man! But honestly, that's exactly how the prison where I work was when I started. Fights were a several-times-per-day event, and stabbings went anywhere from a couple a day to a couple a week. The thing is, the place is so huge that we sometimes wouldn't even hear about major events, as they happened all the way on the other side of the prison.

Stony, you mention the Front Gates of the prison. Yep, that's basicall how ours is, too! And the Main Corridor...ours is around 1/4-mile long. I've had to run it more times over the years that I can count, responding to fights, officer-down calls, etc.

Ed Meinel...the books coming out when I get off my lazy *** and finally get the final draft typed up. God knows when that'll be, lol!

To SMC and Zen...regarding the fallen officer and not leaving him....I did what I hope anyone will do for me when I go down, and that's stick by the fallen comrade. I couldn't leave him. I called for help, and it flooded in. And let me tell you...when the fecal matter has hit the ventillator, there's nothing...and I mean, NOTHING...like seeing dozens of officers coming through that door, hearing the jingling of their keys, and seeing them all running as fast as they humanly can, will to knock each other down and leap over the fallen ones, coming to my aid. Just typing it brings tears to my eyes.

Not all the officers I work with will do that for you; some run very slowly, so slowly, you wouldn't even believe it if I told you. But we've been eating in the chow hall on occasions, when a call for assistance goes out, and believe me; tables and chairs literally fly through the air (sometimes people do, too) in the ensuing response. Those guys freakin' FLIP OUT when a call goes out, and literally will run over each other in the most brutal fashion to get out the door to help comrades in need. It's a sight that I can't even really describe, and the feeling...well, my writing abilities don't come close to describing that.

Watching over a fallen comrade is just doing my job. Thanks for the kudos on that one, but it was nothing special. ****, I couldn't run anyway; they'd have gotten me before I made it ten feet, so I figured what the ****, might was well protect my brother as long as I was able. I'm thankful, because after he went down, I dove across, helped tackle one of the cretins who was fighting, and cuffed him. In the time when I was occupied, none of the crooks hurt my brother officer who was downed.

As a sad ending to that story, the same officer who was down with six broken ribs died a few years back. He was having a heart attack while on duty. Rather than call an ambulance, the prison administration detailed a sergeant to take this officer to the hospital in a state vehicle with no medical people along. Officer Carl Unis died enroute to the hospital. Rest in peace, Officer Unis.

Needless to say, we were enraged; if an inmate was having a heart attack, they'd NEVER take him in a state vehicle, but would call an ambulance. We figured the least they could do would be treat us at least as well as they treat the inmates. But they never have, and probably never will.

[Jimd]

Jimd, I am sure it felt somewhat Like a Weight Lifted from your chest my friend, sharing that story with this "Family". It gives just a hint of an idea of what it is really like behind that wall.

Like mentioned previously, Jimd is good at what he does as is DAYWALKER. Zen Mentioned that DAYWALKER doesn't have that Tunnel Vision anymore. I believe that comes from experience and remembering where they're at. Jimd and DAYWALKER pay attention to their surroundings. They always know where they are (aware of their environment), what/who is around them, what the inmates are doing, and what is in reach (scanning). They Pay Attention to the Training (when they get it ), and They Have to Remain in Survival Mode All Of The Time.

Jimd, Thank You for Sharing, and reminding us to "Always Keep A Heads Up"! Remember we are here for you. Feel Free to PM me anytime bro. Take Care and Prayers Sent to You and Yours. Remember also.........The Lord Has Your 6.

God Bless :)


-raven-

Raven, thanks for the PM offer, brother!
Venting here does somewhat lift a weight from my chest. However, I'll tell you what's really going to lift that weight: When I walk into Barnes & Noble and see my book on their shelves. Getting the story out there, for the country, **** the world, to read, will be a weight off my soul. I want to be able to turn to someone in that aisle and tell them, "That's my book! I wrote it! Would you like me to autograph it for you?" That'll be my moment of final success.

Another of my wishes is that somehow, posting my stories here, might help someone else, in some way. Maybe one of my stories will just remind others to stay alert, or watch the other guy's hands or something.

I am good at what I do, I'm not afraid to say it. But not necessarily because I'm "alert". I believe it's because I interact so well with the inmate population. I can't walk ten feet in the prison without being greeted by an inmate who's happy to spend a few minutes talking to me, shooting the breeze, and once in a while, giving up some valuable intel..

Tiny things, like getting an inmate a blanket for the cold months, or helping him get into commissary, or some other seemingly trivial (to us) thing means the world to them. They remember it when you help them, and it can build relationships that last decades, literally. I've actually had inmates pull me aside and tell me, "Be careful when you go on D-Block, there's going to be trouble today." Many of them don't want to see me get hurt because they respect me. Not because I bend over and let them have their way with me, either. I'll bust their *** if I catch them with weapons, money, or drugs so fast their head doesn't have time to spin. And they respect that.

But I don't hardass them about trivial stuff, either. I might see them take an extra tray at lunch time and not say anything, small stuff like that. Why make an enemy or get into something that gets you stabbed over something so stupid? But I know a lot of officers who'll do just that, and their respect is ZERO, they're hated, and they usually wind up not only getting themselves injured, but those of us who have to respond to it.

In short, I know how to talk to people in a way that makes them not want to kill me. You need to establish trust and respect, while maintaining firmness and doing your job. It's an art form. And I believe I'm one of the best at it that there is. I don't often toot my own horn for my skills, but that's one area where I'll take a little credit. That, and my shooting abilities. I wish I could draw as well as I could shoot!

[JoeKansas]

Jimd, thanks for the job you're doing. It sounds to me that you handled that situation really well! I was curious, you said that this incident happened when you first started. Now that you have many more experiences under your belt, what more could you do in the same situation now?

Thanks again,

Joe

[Jimd]

Jimd, thanks for the job you're doing. It sounds to me that you handled that situation really well! I was curious, you said that this incident happened when you first started. Now that you have many more experiences under your belt, what more could you do in the same situation now?

Thanks again,

Joe

Joe, I'm not sure that I'd do much very differently than I did then. When knives are flying, I'm not very apt to dive into the fray. It just kind of turns me off, y'know? :D

The most important thing is communication, and letting other units and the control center know that there's a problem. These days, many more officers have radios, so it's easier to do.

My hope is that, with being more experienced, I'd be able to see the attack coming sooner, and be able to get out of the way more quickly.

[dskmanch]

jimd - thanks for sharing.

i just want to let you and all those who do your type of job know that i have the utmost respect for you all. reading your stories leaves me speechless with admiration - courage and integrity are rare commodities indeed and you'd seem to have both in large amounts.

it sure puts into perspective the trivialness of the small problems most of us have while we're at work.

all the best man

regards
david

[raven]

Jimd, To Get Respect, You Have To Earn It. To Earn Respect, You Have To Give It. I understand my friend. Just the littlest things go along way for these guys. It is Respect You Have, Well Deserved. I worked Detention for some time before they put on Patrol. December 25, 1997........Ho, Ho, Ho, Merry Christmas to me :rolleyes: . I can't imagine what you see where you're at, but I can understand the Respect part of it from the experiece I've had with inmates here and the people I've arrested. The littlest things go a awful long way to some of these people. Mind you, we deal with criminals that have never been respected or had respect thrown their way once in their lives. So, when you show just a little, it does mean alot to them.

Let me Know when your book is out. It be an Honor to have one (Autographed To :D :D ). Take Good Care My Friend and Brother.

God Bless :)


-raven-

[rainman]

VW, a guide to force. Well done. Thanks for sharnig that.

[Jimd]

jimd - thanks for sharing.

it sure puts into perspective the trivialness of the small problems most of us have while we're at work.

all the best man

regards
david

David, as odd as it may seem, this actually becomes a problem on the Outside. I'll explain....

I deal with so many dire, important, and deadly problems throughout my workday, that not much fazes me when I'm at home.

Problems that make everyday people (such as my wife) freak out don't get me excited. Things like the dishwasher needing to be emptied, the floors needing to be swept, the back steps needing to be painted.

My response to these tasks: All in due time, no rush, they're super-trivial items.

Her response: I can't stand Jim's procrastination! He's so **** lazy!

Two different worlds collide. And stress really helps things a lot. NOT!

[zenheretic]

David, as odd as it may seem, this actually becomes a problem on the Outside. I'll explain....

I deal with so many dire, important, and deadly problems throughout my workday, that not much fazes me when I'm at home.

Problems that make everyday people (such as my wife) freak out don't get me excited. Things like the dishwasher needing to be emptied, the floors needing to be swept, the back steps needing to be painted.

My response to these tasks: All in due time, no rush, they're super-trivial items.

Her response: I can't stand Jim's procrastination! He's so **** lazy!

Two different worlds collide. And stress really helps things a lot. NOT!

Sorry Jim, I don't think you are the only one to suffer at the hands of super trivial things that freak out a spouse...seems to go with the territory on many cases. I can't write about knifings but I'm a battle scarred Veteran to the psychic war you speak of... :D

[dskmanch]

David, as odd as it may seem, this actually becomes a problem on the Outside. I'll explain....

I deal with so many dire, important, and deadly problems throughout my workday, that not much fazes me when I'm at home.

Problems that make everyday people (such as my wife) freak out don't get me excited. Things like the dishwasher needing to be emptied, the floors needing to be swept, the back steps needing to be painted.

My response to these tasks: All in due time, no rush, they're super-trivial items.

Her response: I can't stand Jim's procrastination! He's so **** lazy!

Two different worlds collide. And stress really helps things a lot. NOT!

:D :D :D

i can only say i empathise with you :) (i'm quite sure most men would). keep on smiling my friend