Should TSA Etc relax restrictions?

[SpyderEdgeForever]

The events of September 11th, 2001 were horrific beyond my words, as are all other incidents like that. My sincere compassion and thanks to all First Responders and families of victims.

I had a chat with a man who has the "Let's err on the side of freedom" viewpoint, and he said there should be no restrictions on what civilians can carry onto airlines and museums and any other secured location open to the public, except for firearms, explosives, dangerous chemicals, and bladed weapons of very large size, like machetes and swords, and stuff like crossbows.
I asked his opinion.

He said the ban on folding pocket and even smaller fixed blade knives, scissors and clippers on planes is overboard and instead civilians and military and law enforcement should work together to use self defense force to stop criminals and terrorists, instead of banning items.

As an example, I told him I like Spyderco and Cold Steel knives. He said a plane load of good passengers could use knives and clubs like leather steel filled saps to stop even determined terrorists with box cutter razors.

Do you all agree or disagree with him?

I see both sides.

On his side I can imagine 10 or 20 people with Millie and Voyager folders and Mora knives making short work of say a small group of terrorists or even more, but I welcome your views.

[Naperville]

Just my 2 cents.

I do not fly a lot, maybe once every 10 to 15 years now. Funny because I completed ground school at Ft McCoy Wisconsin with the Army when I was 16 or 17 in a Summer program. I even had some flight hours when I was a teen.

In any case, if I was getting on a plane, I would want some agency that extensively checks people out for weapons and anything that goes BOOM. The only person on a plane that should have a weapon is a US Marshal. I do not think even pilots should have a weapon. They have doors that are impenetrable and if they want to take the plane down there isn't anything stopping them. Maybe there should be breathalyzers on planes for pilots and they should be flown by a carefully selected committee.

In everyday society I think weapons should be carried everywhere by everyone that is not in prison, and not Chicago legal length blades but knuckles, swords, rifles, handguns, saps, etc. If you are not in prison, I say do what you want. Keep the bad apples in prison.

[James Y]

I think restrictions should be relaxed a little, but I don't feel that restrictions should be completely relaxed.

Have you seen some of the freakouts that some people have been having on planes in recent years? These freakouts seem to be happening more and more, and not just because everybody has a camera on their phones now to capture footage of them.

I know it's popular for knife people to say that "everyone needs to carry a knife." But I disagree. There are certain people who should NOT be carrying knives: Those who are mentally deranged, irresponsible, suicidal, etc.

Also, contrary to popular self-images that many guys have about themselves, the vast majority of people are not heroes, and in a dire moment, most probably wouldn't be, even if they had knives, and their lives depended on it.

Jim

[Scandi Grind]

I think you have to be careful with planes. It would take a lot more research than I have done to form a solid opinion on this, but in general I think the security measures currently in place make a fair amount of sense in that particular context. I believe it is better for law abiding citizens to be able to carry most any tool in public locations, but I can see the extra security for planes being helpful. As long as I can re-arm myself once I am on the ground I think I am pretty comfortable with the current system.

[Ankerson]

Absolutely not.

Other than law enforcement nobody should be carrying any weapons on a plane period for any reason whatsoever.

Want to carry a weapon then drive or take a train, or a bus.

There are also idiots out there that believe that private citizens should be able to own nuclear weapons too.

Yes, I have actually witnessed and was part of a conversation on that topic.

There really are people out there that are that stupid for real, and they own guns too... Tragic as that really is when you think about it.

IMO those types shouldn't be able to own a plastic spork, much less any weapon at all.

(They should be in a padded room ideally instead of walking around)

[Ankerson]

I think restrictions should be relaxed a little, but I don't feel that restrictions should be completely relaxed.

Have you seen some of the freakouts that some people have been having on planes in recent years? These freakouts seem to be happening more and more, and not just because everybody has a camera on their phones now to capture footage of them.

I know it's popular for knife people to say that "everyone needs to carry a knife." But I disagree. There are certain people who should NOT be carrying knives: Those who are mentally deranged, irresponsible, suicidal, etc.

Also, contrary to popular self-images that many guys have about themselves, the vast majority of people are not heroes, and in a dire moment, most probably wouldn't be, even if they had knives, and their lives depended on it.

Jim

Jim,

Dead on here.

They think they are Rambo or something...

Reality is of course much different than their own deluded self-images of themselves.

Jim

[akapennypincher]

Don't care, donate fly, have not flown since 1997. Never felt Commercial Aviation is safe, or Air Port Security is worth much in USA. Isreal takes Airport Security serious.

[dsvirsky]

Two points and I'm outta here:

1) Knives with blades under 6cm have been allowed on flights in Canada (both domestic and international, except to the United States) since November 27, 2017.

2) Most of us who would like to be able to carry a small knife with them while flying want to carry a useful tool, not a weapon.

[Naperville]

Depending on who you trained with anything can be used as a weapon, that is why they strip you down to the bare minimum.

Some of us are just looking to go from A to B, and others are whack-jobs.

[Doc Dan]

I don't want some of these back jobs having a knife large enough to take me out. I'm getting older and I'm getting slower and it would be harder to defend myself or others. I don't wanna have to do that. A little tiny knife like a Victorinox classic or a Spyderco roadie would be fine with me but nothing else or even a pair of small small scissors. One change I would like to see is air marshals on every flight and the air marshal should be able to call and get a code to unlock the pilot door in case the plane was taken over by the pilot like on MH 370.

[Ankerson]

I don't want some of these back jobs having a knife large enough to take me out. I'm getting older and I'm getting slower and it would be harder to defend myself or others. I don't wanna have to do that. A little tiny knife like a Victorinox classic or a Spyderco roadie would be fine with me but nothing else or even a pair of small small scissors. One change I would like to see is air marshals on every flight and the air marshal should be able to call and get a code to unlock the pilot door in case the plane was taken over by the pilot like on MH 370.

I wouldn't want to crack open the door again at all, leave it nailed shut, weld it closed forever.

Stick with the zero weapons period, too many whack jobs out there.

I agree with the air marshal thing.

[Scandi Grind]

One change I would like to see is air marshals on every flight and the air marshal should be able to call and get a code to unlock the pilot door in case the plane was taken over by the pilot like on MH 370.

I am inclined to think that this isn't a bad idea. I guess they don't do it because then you have to pay someone to be security on every flight. The thing is that you don't need a weapon to cause a problem. Even with limited experience in fighting it's very feasible for someone to do lethal damage without a weapon if that was their goal, so having security on each flight seems like it could be a good addition.

I guess unless it becomes a frequent problem though, comercial airlines are not going to want to pay for extra security.

[Ankerson]

One change I would like to see is air marshals on every flight and the air marshal should be able to call and get a code to unlock the pilot door in case the plane was taken over by the pilot like on MH 370.

I am inclined to think that this isn't a bad idea. I guess they don't do it because then you have to pay someone to be security on every flight. The thing is that you don't need a weapon to cause a problem. Even with limited experience in fighting it's very feasible for someone to do lethal damage without a weapon if that was their goal, so having security on each flight seems like it could be a good addition.

I guess unless it becomes a frequent problem though, comercial airlines are not going to want to pay for extra security.

Commerical Airliners are nothing more than flying bombs.

I believe air marshals are on quite a few flights.

[SpyderEdgeForever]

You have all made great points. I agree with most of it.
Doc and Ankerson and others, the growing problem of violent and beligerrant people on planes is a big problem.

Naperville my friend and Doc and others:
Without getting political about it, how can we have a societal balance where people are free but safe, where criminals are stopped but law abiding people can be armed without draconian anti weapon laws?

[James Y]

I personally carry knives as tools. During the years I lived in Asia, my only EDC knife was a Victorinox Spartan SAK, which I used to carry on flights, no problem. But that was back in the '80s into the '90s. Those days are gone forever.

I would be happy if small to medium SAKs were allowed, at least on domestic flights in the US, but that'll never happen again. Several years back, there was some consideration to once again allow small pocket knives, like smaller SAKs again on flights, but there was too much pushback, and it was scrapped.

Jim

[Ankerson]

I personally carry knives as tools. During the years I lived in Asia, my only EDC knife was a Victorinox Spartan SAK, which I used to carry on flights, no problem. But that was back in the '80s into the '90s. Those days are gone forever.

I would be happy if small to medium SAKs were allowed, at least on domestic flights in the US, but that'll never happen again. Several years back, there was some consideration to once again allow small pocket knives, like smaller SAKs again on flights, but there was too much pushback, and it was scrapped.

Jim

Jim,

As it should be, never again as things only tend to get worse with time, not better.

There is absolutely zero reason to allow weapons of any kind on commercial airliners....


Jim

[James Y]

I personally carry knives as tools. During the years I lived in Asia, my only EDC knife was a Victorinox Spartan SAK, which I used to carry on flights, no problem. But that was back in the '80s into the '90s. Those days are gone forever.

I would be happy if small to medium SAKs were allowed, at least on domestic flights in the US, but that'll never happen again. Several years back, there was some consideration to once again allow small pocket knives, like smaller SAKs again on flights, but there was too much pushback, and it was scrapped.

Jim

Jim,

As it should be, never again as things only tend to get worse with time, not better.

There is absolutely zero reason to allow weapons of any kind on commercial airliners....


Jim

Yes. But I do miss the times before people started going wacko in the numbers they have been in recent years.

Jim

[Ankerson]

I personally carry knives as tools. During the years I lived in Asia, my only EDC knife was a Victorinox Spartan SAK, which I used to carry on flights, no problem. But that was back in the '80s into the '90s. Those days are gone forever.

I would be happy if small to medium SAKs were allowed, at least on domestic flights in the US, but that'll never happen again. Several years back, there was some consideration to once again allow small pocket knives, like smaller SAKs again on flights, but there was too much pushback, and it was scrapped.

Jim

Jim,

As it should be, never again as things only tend to get worse with time, not better.

There is absolutely zero reason to allow weapons of any kind on commercial airliners....


Jim

Yes. But I do miss the times before people started going wacko in the numbers they have been in recent years.

Jim

Jim,

What you mean all the times that planes were highjacked, it was a very common back in the day.

Jim

[James Y]

I personally carry knives as tools. During the years I lived in Asia, my only EDC knife was a Victorinox Spartan SAK, which I used to carry on flights, no problem. But that was back in the '80s into the '90s. Those days are gone forever.

I would be happy if small to medium SAKs were allowed, at least on domestic flights in the US, but that'll never happen again. Several years back, there was some consideration to once again allow small pocket knives, like smaller SAKs again on flights, but there was too much pushback, and it was scrapped.

Jim

Jim,

As it should be, never again as things only tend to get worse with time, not better.

There is absolutely zero reason to allow weapons of any kind on commercial airliners....


Jim

Yes. But I do miss the times before people started going wacko in the numbers they have been in recent years.

Jim

Jim,

What you mean all the times that planes were highjacked, it was a very common back in the day.

Jim

Maybe. But they weren't happening as many times as ordinary people simply flipping out and running amok on flights nowadays, at least in this part of the world. Back then, an ordinary person could be trusted to carry an ordinary pocket knife on a flight. I've never heard of a SAK skyjacking.

Jim

[Ankerson]

Jim,

As it should be, never again as things only tend to get worse with time, not better.

There is absolutely zero reason to allow weapons of any kind on commercial airliners....


Jim

Yes. But I do miss the times before people started going wacko in the numbers they have been in recent years.

Jim

Jim,

What you mean all the times that planes were highjacked, it was a very common back in the day.

Jim

Maybe. But they weren't happening as many times as ordinary people simply flipping out and running amok on flights nowadays, at least in this part of the world. Back then, an ordinary person could be trusted to carry an ordinary pocket knife on a flight. I've never heard of a SAK skyjacking.

Jim

Jim,

Just boxcutters.

With a 1/4" blade none the less.

And yes one can absolutely take someone out with an SAK without much of a issue.

One can process game with one.

TSA is aware of this, they aren't stupid.

Jim