DO the rods on your SharpMaker move or do they fit tight?

[Sir Joe]

Hi guys,

I have received the SharpMaker and started experimenting. I am pleased with the results, I was able to bring knives to cutting paper level, which for being a total beginner is a good result for me. I would not expect being already able to reach the popping hair level.
But, I am having problems because the rods move quite a lot, or it seems a lot to me.
I was expecting them to stay still, very tight fixed in the hole. But when I sharpen the rods move towards me, and when I place again the knife at the top of the rod the rod is pushed away from me.
This makes the sharpening more difficult, specially when using the flat side of the rods: I have to be slow and pay lot of attention that the knife ic really placed on the whole surface (1m) of the rod. If it would be more tight, it would be easier to keep the knife attached to the rod.

Is this normal? Are your SharpMaker also so? :confused:

[Evil D]

Seems normal to me, or at least mine does the same if I try to wiggle the stone from the top. But, if you're pressing straight down into the stone, they shouldn't move when actually making passes. If they do, I'd double check that you aren't doing something wrong. I'm also fairly new to using the SM, but I haven't had any issues with the stone moving while actually sharpening. Also make sure you aren't using too much pressure in general, you want a very light tough when using the SM, that could be your problem.

[vlawson]

All of the above...

I put all four of my rods, in all the holes, in all directions possible one evening (snicker snicker...)

What I found was some positions were loose, some were perfect and some were almost not possible to even get them in (and once forced in, took considerable effort to get out!)

So each rod fits in each hole 12 different ways, right? So there are 192 possible configurations. At first I was bummed and considered sending it back, but then I decided, given the large amount of positions, if it was too tight or too loose, I'd just change positions and keep going...

um, what are we talking about again?

[SG89]

All of the above...

I put all four of my rods, in all the holes, in all directions possible one evening (snicker snicker...)

What I found was some positions were loose, some were perfect and some were almost not possible to even get them in (and once forced in, took considerable effort to get out!)

So each rod fits in each hole 12 different ways, right? So there are 192 possible configurations. At first I was bummed and considered sending it back, but then I decided, given the large amount of positions, if it was too tight or too loose, I'd just change positions and keep going...

um, what are we talking about again?

This is all so funny :p

[Surfingringo]

OP, yes, that is normal and my advice is don't worry about it. I am able to bring all my knives to hair whittling edges regardless of which rod is in which hole and the play has no discernible effect on sharpening. Keep at it, but let go of the idea that that play is going to prevent you from bringing your knives to extreme levels of sharpness. It won't. :)

[dbcad]

I've noticed this but also noticed a trend. The brown stones fit tightly while the white stones fit loosely. Think about what you are doing to the edge and it makes sense :)

Then I got the CBN rods, they fit loosely. I guess the CBN rods don't give a flip :eek: :rolleyes:

The angle difference is minute compared to the sharpener anyway :eek:

Charlie

[Surfingringo]

All of the above...

I put all four of my rods, in all the holes, in all directions possible one evening (snicker snicker...)

What I found was some positions were loose, some were perfect and some were almost not possible to even get them in (and once forced in, took considerable effort to get out!)

So each rod fits in each hole 12 different ways, right? So there are 192 possible configurations.

Hmm...I am having a hard time following your math. I only see 144 combinations, assuming we are only talking about one set of rods and are never using a flat with a corner.

[bh49]

Mine were loose, since the first day, which was 10 years ago and which is irrelevant. In free state all of the are sitting at about the same angle +/- 30 minutes. I never had any problem with my sharpmaker. Great tool.

[Sir Joe]

Well, 192 positions is almost a kamasutra of sharpening.
Not sure I need all of them.
I would be happy with the typical missionary, rod in the hole, tight fit.
Anyway, I do not understand how should I press "straight down". I am supposed to pull the knife toward me, to sharpen the whole blade in its entire length. And if I do, the rod moves too.
I will try with less pressure.

Surfingringo, yeah, that is my worry.
When you mean that this is not an issue, do you mean because with time and practice one becomes able to make the blade stay in perfect contact with the rod also in step 2 and 4 (flat side)? Or because you believe a proper contact is not needed?
My understanding was that on step 1 and 3 we use the edge for a more aggressive sharpening, and on 2 and 4 we use a larger surface for better polishing.
If the blade do not make good contact with the rod on step 2 and 4, we are still using only an edge, not a flat surface, right?
This is what I mean. So, I am not worried of a "variation on the angle". I am worried that if the rods move on step 2 and 4, the blade will not make contact with the whole width of the rod, but only with an edge.
To let the blade make contact I have to be slow and careful because of this movement.
A tighter fit would make it easier.
Does this make any sense to you or am I completely wrong?

[bh49]

So each rod fits in each hole 12 different ways, right? So there are 192 possible configurations.

You are not correct about 12, it is 24 for each Rod. And 576 for most people. Of cause you can increase this number by using coarse rod with fine and corners with flats. But this is really wild. :D

[Surfingringo]

Hey joe, my rods don't really move in a way that affects how the edge contacts them....not that I notice anyway. To answer your questions, I would say first that it is not essential that the edge makes perfect contact with the flat in every moment. It is preferred but this is not going to have a massive effect on your edges. Secondly, yes, you will get better with practice holding the knife at the right angle.

FWIW, I have several knives that I don't even use the flats on. The corners of the brown rods give a significantly more aggressive edge than the flats and I finish a lot of my high carbide steels like that. I also maintain my fillet knives on those corners. (That's if I touch them up on he sm. Normally I just freehand my fillets on diamond stones.)

[Surfingringo]

So each rod fits in each hole 12 different ways, right? So there are 192 possible configurations.

You are not correct about 12, it is 24 for each Rod. And 576 for most people. Of cause you can increase this number by using coarse rod with fine and corners with flats. But this is really wild. :D

Ok, now you're getting crazy and using both sets of rods on both angle settings!! :cool: Let's go ahead and throw in the diamonds and make it 864. Actually, I want someone to run the numbers and see how many combinations using all 4 sets of rods, using every combination of grit and flat/corner. I'm too lazy to do it but I'll give you a hint. There are going to be an impressive number of digits in the answer. :D

[Waco]

I guess I never noticed any movement.

[bh49]

Actually, I want someone to run the numbers and see how many combinations using all 4 sets of rods, using every combination of grit and flat/corner. :D

Did you forget UF rods, there are 5 sets, let's go really wild :D :D :D

[Surfingringo]

Actually, I want someone to run the numbers and see how many combinations using all 4 sets of rods, using every combination of grit and flat/corner. :D

Did you forget UF rods, there are 5 sets, let's go really wild :D :D :D

5 sets of rods, using every possible combination and orientation of grit/flat/corner and both the 30 and 40 degree angles, I believe there are 51,840 possible configurations. :)

Edit: I believe there is an error in my above calculation. The correct answer is 25,920 (I think). I would go back and check but I'm bored with it now. :cool:

[Niles]

Mine have never moved. Primarily because I never use them. They stay nice and snug in their horizontal slots.

[Donut]

Cliff made a thread a while back about the angles being produced by the rods not being consistent and that there is a variation of approximately 1 degree with the rods in each hole.

Some times while sharpening, you will not be making progress and think that your bevel is messed up.

I find that if you're having trouble just swapping the rods, left to right and right to left, typically gets you back to where you want to be.

[The Deacon]

Just checked my Sharpmaker. I only have the standard grey and white rods, but all 4 can be wiggled around 1/4" at the top of the rod no matter how I orient them.

I don't consider that a problem, but I'm not what you'd call a sharpening perfectionist by any means.

Truth is, I only use the Sharpmaker for my serrated knives, and there are only a few of those. Probably 95% or more of my sharpening involves PE blades, and those get sharpened on a flat DMT diamond stone. Most of the time that's done while watching TV, with the stone held in one hand and the knife in the other. Not what you'd call a high precision operation. :D

[Donut]

Truth is, I only use the Sharpmaker for my serrated knives, and there are only a few of those. Probably 95% or more of my sharpening involves PE blades, and those get sharpened on a flat DMT diamond stone. Most of the time that's done while watching TV, with the stone held in one hand and the knife in the other. Not what you'd call a high precision operation. :D

Man, you could really use one of those TV Dinner folding tables and something to hold your stone.

What I use is one of my Spyderco stones in the case (they have REALLY sticky feet) with a mousepad on top, then lay the DMT stone on top of that. :p

[remnar]

Actually, I want someone to run the numbers and see how many combinations using all 4 sets of rods, using every combination of grit and flat/corner. :D

Did you forget UF rods, there are 5 sets, let's go really wild :D :D :D

5 sets of rods, using every possible combination and orientation of grit/flat/corner and both the 30 and 40 degree angles, I believe there are 51,840 possible configurations. :)

Edit: I believe there is an error in my above calculation. The correct answer is 25,920 (I think). I would go back and check but I'm bored with it now. :cool:

Assuming we're using one right slot and one left slot, I get a total of 32,832 combinations. One thing to remember is that only one end of the diamond and CBN rods can be inserted into the slots so there are only 6 positions per slot for each of those rods. I tried calculating this several times and made several mistakes but I think this is correct now. :D

Edit: I found another mistake and corrected my number. :p