Manix 2 without a choil

[Holzfaeller]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but appears that the Manix 2 could be made without the choil and gain more useful egde in the process. In fact, it seems that the Para 2 could also be made without the choil. Since I never feel a need to put my finger on the blade, this design change would suit me well indeed.

[Liquid Cobra]

Both of those knives are iconic designs in the Spyderco lineup. They sell pretty well as is. I like choils myself so I'm happy with the way they currently are. Of course, there will always be people who like things the other way. Not better, just different right? Choils seem to be something that knife afi's prefer and seeing as how both the manix and para are relatively expensive knives compared to those the regular market buys the choils should probably stay.

[Evil D]

Wars have started for saying less than this

[demoncase]

As with the thread on the Delica-needs-a-choil:

There's plenty of choil-less Spydercos in the catalogue to choose from....Would it still be a PM2 or M2 without the choil?

[Waco]

I'm becoming more pro-choil all the time.

[Mic1]

Choilless Manix 2 mmmm let me think........ nope no thank you then it's not a Manix 2

The only change I would make is put a notch in the blade instead of that little unsharpend bit in front of the choil. Or just sharpen it but do something.

[zhyla]

It's pretty rare I cut something 3" deep and wish for another 1/4" of edge on my Manix 2's. I mean, at some point you have to go get a machete or a tree saw, is that extra edge going to get you that much farther?

What we do need is a FFG SE variant. So disappointed by that.

[bearfacedkiller]

Take a look at the Centofante3. It has an amazing blade to handle ratio and the blade is all edge. It is a great blade and it is a steal at the price it usually sells for. The Southard is great in that dept too.

[apollo]

Choilless Manix 2 mmmm let me think........ nope no thank you then it's not a Manix 2

The only change I would make is put a notch in the blade instead of that little unsharpend bit in front of the choil. Or just sharpen it but do something.

That is the only idea spyderco should use on all there designs! for the rest they are perfect like they are. :)

[Donut]

I wouldn't mind if they picked one model and take out the choil to see if choil or no choil sold better.

I think with the Spyderco standards, this model would have a different name.

I first thought it would work funny. Holding my Manix 2 in hand, it might eliminate the need of choking up if you give more edge closer to the "normal" grip position.

[Cujobob]

I agree that I would 'likely' prefer the PM2 without a choil, uncertain on the Manix.

I also would think that more high end and custom knives are choil-less, suggesting something as well

As mentioned in the Delica thread, I think the Caly is 'sort of' a choiled Delica. Is there a market for both versions?

[Evil D]

I agree that I would 'likely' prefer the PM2 without a choil, uncertain on the Manix.

I also would think that more high end and custom knives are choil-less, suggesting something as well

As mentioned in the Delica thread, I think the Caly is 'sort of' a choiled Delica. Is there a market for both versions?

People beg for a choiled Delica, but the reality is the R model is essentially exactly that, and though I don't know the sales numbers, I do know it's a model that very rarely gets mentioned unless it's spoke of by collectors. You never see a thread about "show your favorite EDC" and people are singing the praises of the R.

I guess my answer to this question would depend solely on the execution of the knife. One of my favorite handle designs is the Yojimbo 2, but one of my favorite blade designs in the Manix 2. If I could get a choil-less Manix 2 blade in the Yojimbo 2 handle, I'd be in heaven. That would be a knife that doesn't have a choil, so I'd be happy without it.

That said, I don't think you could take a knife like the Caly 3 and remove the choil and end up with a knife that works as well in your hand as the Caly 3 does.

The real reason though is because of the lock design in the Manix 2. If you look at the pivot between the scales, there's the large round section that the ball bearing rides on. Look at the handle from the side underneath there...you can't really extend the "guard" any further than it is because your index finger would ride on that round part of the tang instead of inside a finger groove...that would make pretty poor ergos. So, you're stuck having to have that 1/2 inch or so of handle in front of the "guard" part of the handle, and then you're going to have some amount of ricasso, so you would end up with something like 3/4-1 inch of space between the guard spot on the handle and the beginning of the edge....which would suck.

Another thing to consider is the thumb hole. I'm throwing out a guess here as I don't recall off hand, but I don't remember seeing any blade grinds where the thumb hole is way out ahead of the plunge line. I think this is because having the thumb hole half way on the plunge line helps to reduce any weakening that the hole may introduce into the blade. Again, that's just a guess, there may well be models that have the hole way out after the plunge line, but on the Manix 2 if you moved the edge further back that's what you would get, because you can't move the hole any further back because of the guard. If you then went and changed the guard to allow the hole to be moved, then there's Spyderco's "circle ratio pattern thingamajig" or whatever they call it where there's an optimum distance between the pivot and thumb hole, and you would be altering that. Plus once you change the guard and all those other things, do you really have a Manix 2 in the end?

[FCM415]

Geez everyone is picking on choils lately. Hot topic of the week out of nowhere.

Before you suggest taking out the choils on the PM2 and Manix to gain mere mm's of length (the longer the blade the less control you have BTW), how about looking to suggest that they extend the blade a few mm's to fill the handle. Look at these models closed. There's your mm's.

BTW, the choil taking up space is a bit overblown... Now, if it were designed like the Tenacious or the Centofante3, then I can agree... I suppose you can turn them that way in a redesign

But check out this pic:


Direct comparison between a typical choiled Spyderco and a typical non choiled... These are what I have on hand now...At home I have several more glaring examples that there is pretty much no edge gained by getting rid of the choil... Again, this is comparing SPYDERCO style tang/choil areas.... Tenacious/Cent3 styles are different but that doesnt help your Manix wishes.

When I get home tomorrow, I can give you direct apples to apples comparison pics with the FRN models that are choiled vs non choiled and it's the exact same thing LMAO..Like I said, this point of contention is overblown.

[FCM415]

Spydiehole, leafshape, choil... Some things you will NEVER disassociate with Spyderco. Sorry :cool: :spyder:

Is there a market for both versions?

For the Delica at least, Sal has already shot down the notion of having two versions for the sake of a choil. One or the other in the future update (if any). I can assume that he would feel the same about other popular in house models.

[Cujobob]

Spydiehole, leafshape, choil... Some things you will NEVER disassociate with Spyderco. Sorry :cool: :spyder:

The hole, sure, but the blade shapes have come in many different flavors plus on arguably their most popular model, the Delica (just guessing), they don't have one. I believe Spyderco will do what works best or is most popular but often those two are not the same. On models where rear grips feel comfortable, I NEVER choke up and use choils. I've never used it on my Manix 2 or my PM2 to perform an actual cutting task.

[Fresh Eddie Fresh]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but appears that the Manix 2 could be made without the choil and gain more useful egde in the process. In fact, it seems that the Para 2 could also be made without the choil. Since I never feel a need to put my finger on the blade, this design change would suit me well indeed.

If you don't already have one, try out an Endura. I think it would be right up your alley.

[dubya3]

Want a manix with more cutting edge, there's a Manix XL available

[Fancier]

I support the right of those who like them to have the chance to buy them, but I'm kind of done buying knives with choils, much like I don't buy knives with thumb studs. I like keeping my hand on the handle scales, and I like slicing things with the base of the blade. If I want to choke up I use a smaller knife. Why would I want to hold naked steel?