Tip up or tip down?

[SailorMan]

Without wanting to start a religious debate, what are the advantages of each? I've always preferred tip up because reaching for the knife puts it into your hand oriented correctly. Or to think of it another way, tip up when closed is tip down when opened, and I don't want to open a knife point up. But that's me, and I'm curious what others think.

[sal]

Hi SailorMan. for some history, Spyderco brought clothing clips to the knife world. 1981 was the first one.

Tip down offers two types of openings, "pinch" and "drop(ping the handle)".

Tip up offers only "pinch" but many say is more secure to grasp & open than tip down.

I carry both as I do my daily rotation.

However, many have strong opinions as to their preference.

sal

[vampyrewolf]

I find my Delica(tip-up) as the easiest to get at and open(either in the pocket, or on the back of my waistband). My Cricket(tip-down) however it the best for work. The tip-down is easier to conceal as you open, as you just reach down, and pick up sideways(wrist cocked), and open. It simply depends on how you feel like grabbing. Lately my Delica has been on my waistband(in the back), and my cricket is on my pocket.

[Tightwad]

Tip down is my preferred carry. Get nervous with a Tip up knife in my pocket. May be
it's because I'm left handed and "lefty's" are different anyway! I find that Tip down is
just easier for me to use. Besides I like to carry my smaller Spyderco's in my shirt
pocket. Tip up just doesn't work there to well. I't really all in what works for you.

[Leo Daher]

Well, I'm a lefty myself, and I'm pretty comfortable with tip up. In fact, many (if not all) of Spyderco's reversible clip, southpaw-friendly knives are tip up models. Right now, I'm carrying too Matriarchs, one in each front pants pocket.

That being said, I've also carried tip down folders for an extended period of time (a pair of AFCKs, which I regard as BM's Spydies) without any problems. I believe it's all a matter of getting used to a certain carry mode.

If your knives are meant for emergency use (self-defense or otherwise), I suggest sticking to one way of carrying, unless you're Sal Glesser. That way, you can avoid fumbling on the draw under stress.

Leo

[Clay Kesting]

I think it's really just a matter of what you get used to. My daily carry for some time was my BF Native and I got used to tip-up. At that time I would have sworn tip-up was the easiest to retrieve and open. As soon as I got my Chinese Folder I changed it to tip-up, because I thought that was the way to go and, anyway, that's the way the custom version is set up.

However, I've since become a convert to flat ground blades and all my regular carries just happen to be tip-down (Calypso Jr, original Centofante Jr and Military) as are most of my other Spydies. In fact the Native is now the only tip-up knife I now own. Guess what, the Chinese Folder just got changed back to tip-down. Actually I think the Chinese Folder is probably better tip-down anyway, even though there's a lot of knife showing. It is certainly less risky when carried IWB and I found the smooth Almite made it harder to withdraw from my pocket than the grippy G10 of my BF Native.

Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow, in Australia it's tomorrow already.


Edited by - Clay Kesting on 4/15/2001 3:58:21 PM

[John F Jensen]

I am definetely a tip down person. My first Spyderco (around 1989) was a C07S Police model that I carried until the the C55P Starmate arrived in mid-1998 (also a tip down).

It may be what one gets used to, but I find the drop method is the best for me. When I pull a tip down knife out of my pocket, my thumb and index finger grab the "hole" and I "drop" the handle down as I clear the pocket. I have never had a problem or failure with this method. Fast, smooth and effective!



JOHN F JENSEN
"Your Quality Distributor"
619-475-3633
johnfjensen@home.com


Edited by - JOHN F JENSEN on 4/15/2001 6:10:41 PM

[Kyoto_the_Shadow]

I am a strictly tip-up person. I have found that it is the easiest method no matter what you intend on doing after your knife is drawn, and it is the fastest for me.

[Paul Work]

Whatever works best for you. I prefer tip up.

Paul

[Jeff/1911]

Could someone (Sal?) please explain the "pinch" and "dropping the handle" techniques? Thanks, Jeff/1911.

[Clay Kesting]

Jeff,

To use the "drop" opening method, you hold the blade hole between the thumb and forefinger with the handle down and roughly parallel to the floor. Then a quick downward flick of the wrist will cause the handle to drop towards the floor and open the knife. This is usually sufficient with linerlocks, but with lockbacks, especially with lightweight handles, you may need to start by flicking the wrist up before you start the downward movement. The closest analogy I can think of, is the wrist movement used to crack a whip.

The drop method is very fast but puts less strain on the knife than flicking the blade out. Sal's speed drawing his Military is legendary on the forums. Hope this helps.

Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow, in Australia it's tomorrow already.

[thorin hammer]

I must say that I like both tip up and tip down. I have no problem with either. Both clip positions are safe because the blade is against your pocket and knife handle, if that is how you carry it. There is a learning curve with both opening methods, but after you get past that it really isn’t a problem. I choose what knife to carry based on how much knife will stick out of my pocket.

Ehh, supposed to be Thorin... : )

[SailorMan]

I wouldn't try the "drop" open on a boat. Water holds a strange attraction for tools, proportional to the tool's expense, the depth of the water, and your resistance to diving in it. You quickly learn every tool, at all times, is either firmly in hand, or tucked into a safe place. Anything else and it will skip, jump, and wiggle its way into the deep.

But thanks for the enlightening discussion.

[Jeff/1911]

Clay,

Thank you for the excellent description of the "drop" opening method. You mean a pinch across the hole with thumb closest to the body, so that the handle ends up in your hand, correct? I have just been trying this with my G-10 Rookie and it works, but as you mentioned with a light blade like this one a significant snap is required.

How has Sal's speed drawing technique with a knife become legendary? Have some of you observed him performing this?

Jeff/1911.

[Clay Kesting]

That's right Jeff, the handle ends up in the hand with the thumb and forefinger still pinching the blade. However it's the weight of the handle rather than the blade which effects the ease of using this method. The stainless handled knives are the easiest apart from linerlocks.

A number of members here and on Bladeforums have reported seeing Sal draw his Military at shows and on tours at Golden. Apparently it's "in your face" before you see him move <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>.

Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow, in Australia it's tomorrow already.

Edited by - Clay Kesting on 4/16/2001 8:29:45 PM

[Jeff/1911]

Clay,

Thanks for further clarification of this technique.

And of course, I should have realized that Sal could be "viewed" at shows and so forth; I didn't think of that.

Jeff/1911.

[Mancer]

Yeah tip-up is the way to go, well depending on the use of the blade, if its just a util knife and its got some weight on the handle opening it by dropping it is fine, but for those blades like Matriarch's,Civilains,Guntings which are used to defend oneself tip-up is the only way to go, one of the major reasons Ive never carried my Civilian and always have my Matriarch, can have my Mat out and open in just over a second, where the Civ takes a darn site longer.

Seeya

MaNcEr

It's Time To Kick @$$ 'N Chew Bubble Gum

[chinook]

I saw (or rather didn't see) Sal deploy his toy. The only thing to compare it to was Superman telling Lois Lane "It won't hurt, did it?" <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>

----------
Disguised as a reponsible adult.
><CHINOOK*>

[Jeff/1911]

Chinook,

No kidding, huh? Do you think we could maybe convince Sal to make a video of his technique? I'd sure like to see that.

Jeff/1911.

[chinook]

Jeff
That would be a "very" short video.

Not sure that he would want to teach his fastdraw to everyone out there, butt maybe a link to an .mpg or .rm or .mov made available here on the forums would be acceptable. A slow or stop motion runthrough would help a bunch.