does anyone PREFER pinned construction models?

[suedeface]

I have never had a problem with a pinned construction knife. I realize that torx screws make it easier for the good people at spyderco to assemble and service more knives, but I still have to stand by the good 'ol pins. Personally, I think torx are more trouble than they are worth, especially if you dis-assemble your knife frequently. I had a H-1 dragonfly that I took the male-side screws out of and loc-tited them. While I was applying the loc-tite, I couldn't help but think of how wimpy, small, and easily stripped (and lost) these screws are (especially the smaller lockbar screw.) Yes, you can tighten up the pivot and such if the blade gets some play, but I just don't see how torx are superior. As for being able to take apart your knife for cleaning...I don't think the torx screws lend themselves too well to being unscrewed / tightened several times. This wouldn't be a problem if you could easily get a replacement torx screw/s (within reason) from Spyderco. So, while I have never had a major issue with torx screws ( I am careful and use the right tool), I am now trying to hoard as many pinned dragonfly models as I can. Opinions?

[Holland]

they look nice on some models, and ive never had a problem with my caly3, but i definitely don't prefer them

[xceptnl]

Speaking to Holland's answer. Sal has told us here many times that pinned construction can allow them to keep the handle slabs as thin as possible. Armed with this information I would always prefer for my Caly models to remain pinned and maintain their slim in pocket width. Not many models would I prefer pinned over screwed, but on some it certainly makes sense.

[yablanowitz]

It would not bother me a bit if they went entirely to pinned construction on all models. Those screws are not there for end line users to take apart their knives, but that's what they get used for. I wouldn't mind that if the same people didn't then manage to strip said screws and blame the manufacturer for the damage. As for taking knives apart to clean them, well...I have a couple of knives sitting here in front of me as I type that were pinned together before 1948 and are still working fine without ever being taken apart for cleaning.

[BadFish]

I enjoy pinned knives to be honest on certain models. On the other hand models that I beat the crap out of like my Tasman I like to be able to clean and tighten them. My two favorite carry knives outside of work are pinned and I love them ( centofante 3, and goddard sprint).

[GoodEyeSniper]

I have no preference, but I find the ability to take apart and/or tighten pocket knives is often unnecessary.

correction: taking them apart is unnecessary, but tightening the pivot on a torx model can turn into something you HAVE to do, because of the way it is designed.

[Sparki]

I just got my first caly 3.5 CF today... and I have to say I really like the construction. It's a nice change from owning FRN and G-10.

[Blerv]

I like the clean looks and situationally tighter designs. It's like many things in life, the purpose dictates the use. Show shovels aren't my preference but I adore them occasionally :) .

[MarcusH]

Sal has told us here many times that pinned construction can allow them to keep the handle slabs as thin as possible.

I've been wondering lately if that is still the case. The Ulize and the Caly 3 have exactly the same handle thickness of 9.6 mm or 0.378 inch.

[paladin]

I have no preference, but I find the ability to take apart and/or tighten pocket knives is often unnecessary.

correction: taking them apart is unnecessary, but tightening the pivot on a torx model can turn into something you HAVE to do, because of the way it is designed.

+1 this

Also, I find its a good balance to have a removable/adjustable blade ala Caly 3, but pinned scales & backstrap/spring. I get obsessive/compulsive if I am afforded too many options for takedown...just can't help myself. However OTOH, if I could not have removed the blade from my Caly 3 it would probably still be grinding that fine black grit it was infested with. Sure I could have flushed/dried it, but I would not have rested as easy as I do now that I was able to completely clean the affected area. More importantly, I was able to THROUGHLY Frog Lube the entire blade shank, pivot, & pivot hole. Now it is comparable in smoothness to a liner lock.

[Blerv]

Only a couple of my folders have ever been tightened/loosened. None have been taken apart.

They all work great with occasional water and oil. If not neglected its surprising the small cracks you can get that stuff into.

[glbpro]

Ironically the only stripped torx screws I've ever had were on a pinned construction knife! The clip on my Centofante 3 came with one of the three screwheads stripped from the factory and I needed to use pliers to get it out. It's currently 'borrowing' a clip screw from my endura.

I'm ok with either screwed or pinned construction, or indeed a mix of the two as on the newest Manix 2 LW :)

[w3tnz]

Nope, I won't buy pinned models anymore, the scale swap on my caly 3.5 has been so frustrating I don't know if I'll ever finish it. Having to drill the pins out sucks, finding replacement fixings sucks, the lockbar pivot is especially troublesome, not interested in something I can't tear down for basic maintenance or modification. I don't nessacarily consider a thin handle an advantage either. You would be surprised what you find inside a knife when you actually strip it down, even a brand new one, a lot of places for crud to hide. Never stripped a fixing either, torx are superior to pozi, phillips, even allen bolts, more contact surface, more torque, use larger ones t25-t30 at work daily and prefer them to any other fixing.

[Jay_Ev]

I've been wondering lately if that is still the case. The Ulize and the Caly 3 have exactly the same handle thickness of 9.6 mm or 0.378 inch.

I think in this thread there has been some confusion between handle thickness and handle width.

[Evil D]

I have never had a problem with a pinned construction knife. I realize that torx screws make it easier for the good people at spyderco to assemble and service more knives, but I still have to stand by the good 'ol pins. Personally, I think torx are more trouble than they are worth, especially if you dis-assemble your knife frequently. I had a H-1 dragonfly that I took the male-side screws out of and loc-tited them. While I was applying the loc-tite, I couldn't help but think of how wimpy, small, and easily stripped (and lost) these screws are (especially the smaller lockbar screw.) Yes, you can tighten up the pivot and such if the blade gets some play, but I just don't see how torx are superior. As for being able to take apart your knife for cleaning...I don't think the torx screws lend themselves too well to being unscrewed / tightened several times. This wouldn't be a problem if you could easily get a replacement torx screw/s (within reason) from Spyderco. So, while I have never had a major issue with torx screws ( I am careful and use the right tool), I am now trying to hoard as many pinned dragonfly models as I can. Opinions?

Seems to me your issue with screws contradicts your user habits. If you see them as weak "especially if you at your knife apart a lot", just stop taking them apart then? You won't be able to disassemble the pinned knives you're looking for, so just refrain from taking the screwed knives apart and you won't have any problems with strength. Besides, those threads may be small but that allows them to have more surface area and contact, which gives them extra strength. You'll likely break the tang, or defeat the lock, before you push a knife to the point that the screws on the handle scale are ripped from their threads.

[The Deacon]

It's not so much that I prefer pinned construction, it's that I prefer the things pinned construction allows. Namely, bolstered knives with smooth bolsters and all stainless knives with smooth handle slabs. For me, the esthetic quality those features bring to a knife far outweighs any potential benefit screw construction may provide.

Pinned construction also has the side benefit of offering a bit of peace of mind. Screws, by design, are non-permanent fasteners. On a knife, that creates a set of somewhat contradictory demands. If you don't occasionally check them for tightness, you risk having one (or more) unscrew and fall out. If you do occasionally check them for tightness, you risk compromising the thread locking compound intended to prevent them from unscrewing. To me, the only place where the benefit of all screw construction would outweigh that risk would be in the Salt series knifes, and not because of salt, but because sand can be almost impossible to remove from any assembly of moving parts.

[Jazz]

It's tough. I love the pinned FRN models. Nothing to worry is going to loosen and fall off - simple. I detest having to worry about tightening pivots, or wondering if I'll come home with some screws loose or missing. Lock tight is a pain in the *** if you want to disassemble... but on the other hand, I do like to mod now and again and tinker, so what are ya gonna do? I guess I like both, and have no problem with pinned... unless it's like the Calys where only the scales are pinned. What's up with that?

[TSchloz]

I like the pinned models. Simple and no worries.

Tom

[Blerv]

That's been described as a technical limitation due to a narrow handle design.

As an aside, I think Japanese makers have a higher regard for smooth clean lines than some societies. An artist may be commissioned to create a design but the product often has to fit their own personal aesthetic. Otherwise many will just pass on the project completely.

Maybe I'm out on a unsteady limb on this assumption but Sal seems one who designs with some mutual dialogue. If Moki prefers to pin and Spyderco likes the result I don't know how hard they would push for screws even if it was possible. I certainly wouldn't piss off a quality shop over a few tiny torx screws :) .

[suedeface]

It's not so much that I prefer pinned construction, it's that I prefer the things pinned construction allows. Namely, bolstered knives with smooth bolsters and all stainless knives with smooth handle slabs. For me, the esthetic quality those features bring to a knife far outweighs any potential benefit screw construction may provide.

Pinned construction also has the side benefit of offering a bit of peace of mind. Screws, by design, are non-permanent fasteners. On a knife, that creates a set of somewhat contradictory demands. If you don't occasionally check them for tightness, you risk having one (or more) unscrew and fall out. If you do occasionally check them for tightness, you risk compromising the thread locking compound intended to prevent them from unscrewing. To me, the only place where the benefit of all screw construction would outweigh that risk would be in the Salt series knifes, and not because of salt, but because sand can be almost impossible to remove from any assembly of moving parts.

This is one of my main concerns, having the screws slowly back out and get lost. Again, not a problem if you could easily get replacement screws from spyderco, but that isn't always a guarantee. To be fair, i've never had a problem with Spyderco torx as they seem to have quality fasteners, but with other cheaper knives i've had some issues. That is why I take out the male-side screws and put a small drop of loc-tite on them. That pretty well solves the problem for me.