Just noticed something while picking out todays EDC.If you think you want a Sebenza but aren't sure,get a Starmate first.If you like it you will like the Sebenza.Notice how much they favor each other.
I learn something new everyday,even though I don't want to. Jeff
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G10 Sebenza=Starmate
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dialex
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Starmate, anytime <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>
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dialex
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You know, Jeff, this is what my friend Bernard keeps telling me all the time "Try a Sebbie, try a Sebbie" <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0> I aggree CR makes some **** good knives, I really like the Mnandi, but the Sebenza just didn't hit the spot. At least, not that much <img src="wink.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>
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This is an issue that I have frequently revisited over at BFC. I have handled a number of Sebenzas at B&M stores* and I have found them to be very over-priced for what you get. My StarMate is every bit as smooth in its action, every bit as secure in its lock**, and the blade is of a higer grade steel than the earlier Sebenzas***. I know that there are those who prefer the Sebenza, just as there are those who prefer a certain over-priced German brand of automobiles that do not deliver any performance of any variety superior to their significantly less expensive Japanese competition, but they are, IMO, seeking status by doing so. Status is a valid goal and I heartily endorse those who seek it by various means, but I question if buying expensive status symbols is a very good way to get there.
* I do buy the occasional knife from these stores just to keep them around so that I can have a place to handle knives of interest. But one of them, Chesapeake Knife & Tool, is so expensive that their "sale prices" frequently exceed the factories' published retail prices and you are lucky if you find one with a staff that even cares a whit about the products that they sell. One such is at the Springfield Mall near the junction if I-495, I-395, and I-95, in Virginia, just south of Washington, DC.
** The Spyderco liner locks with the adjustable eccentric pivot are, IMO, the best liner locks going because they allow for perfect adjustment of that critical liner-tang interface and because their locking liners are of steel, not aluminum or titanium, metals that gall and wear.
*** The earlier Sebenzaas used a steel, BG-42, IIRC, that is not the equal, IMO, of the CPM440V in the StarMate. Of course, I understand that they now use S30V, a crucible particle technology steel like CPM440V, but developed specifically for knife blades and used by most of the quality makers in their best products. It's about time that CRK got on board, if you ask me, which you had not. <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>
Edited to add this thought: I have the earlier model C-15 Spyderc/Terzuola Clipit, Sal's first collaboration with a custom maker, along with the C-19, its baby brother. A look at either of these knives will show you the direct genealogy of the StarMate. It isn't a copy of the Sebenza, as some may be implying, but a direct evolution of, and improvement upon, Bob T's earlier designs.
Trying to walk in the Light, Hugh Fuller, 1 John 1:5
Edited by - FullerH on 10/29/2003 9:03:50 AM
* I do buy the occasional knife from these stores just to keep them around so that I can have a place to handle knives of interest. But one of them, Chesapeake Knife & Tool, is so expensive that their "sale prices" frequently exceed the factories' published retail prices and you are lucky if you find one with a staff that even cares a whit about the products that they sell. One such is at the Springfield Mall near the junction if I-495, I-395, and I-95, in Virginia, just south of Washington, DC.
** The Spyderco liner locks with the adjustable eccentric pivot are, IMO, the best liner locks going because they allow for perfect adjustment of that critical liner-tang interface and because their locking liners are of steel, not aluminum or titanium, metals that gall and wear.
*** The earlier Sebenzaas used a steel, BG-42, IIRC, that is not the equal, IMO, of the CPM440V in the StarMate. Of course, I understand that they now use S30V, a crucible particle technology steel like CPM440V, but developed specifically for knife blades and used by most of the quality makers in their best products. It's about time that CRK got on board, if you ask me, which you had not. <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle border=0>
Edited to add this thought: I have the earlier model C-15 Spyderc/Terzuola Clipit, Sal's first collaboration with a custom maker, along with the C-19, its baby brother. A look at either of these knives will show you the direct genealogy of the StarMate. It isn't a copy of the Sebenza, as some may be implying, but a direct evolution of, and improvement upon, Bob T's earlier designs.
Trying to walk in the Light, Hugh Fuller, 1 John 1:5
Edited by - FullerH on 10/29/2003 9:03:50 AM
Hey, this is turning in a BFC/Usual Suspect style 'Strider vs Sebenza' thread...fun!
I might as well add some comments here.
About steel, I think that a high-grade steel, (heat) treated well, all perform very close to each other. So a Sebenza with ATS-34, BG-42 or S30V are all fine knives. Same for a C-15/C-19 with ATS-34, or a Starmate with CPM440V. Wasn't Chris Reeve the first to use S30V ?
IMHO, Spyderco liner locks are good locks, maybe the best production liner locks, but no where near a frame-lock. On my Starmate, when I applied (a lot of) pressure on the tip of the blade, I could feel the liner flex a bit. I wasn't worried that it would break, but I prefer the rock solid feel of a frame-lock.
Also, you can take a Sebenza apart, and put it back together perfectly <A HREF="http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showt ... 60685">see here</A>, and not void warrenty. On a Starmate, you would need to mark the position on the pivot, and when screwing it back, you need loc-tite or something to keep the pivot screw in place for the tension that you set it to. A Sebenza has a bushing around the pivot meaning you screw it down tight and still have smooth action.
Anyway, the Sebenza was very much worth the money too me. I sold my Starmate for the initial reason of this thread (they have almost identical profiles).
But, I might buy a Starmate again. Why?, I think it's one of the best and most beautifull Spyderco's.
Ted
Edited by - Ted on 10/29/2003 12:47:23 PM
I might as well add some comments here.
About steel, I think that a high-grade steel, (heat) treated well, all perform very close to each other. So a Sebenza with ATS-34, BG-42 or S30V are all fine knives. Same for a C-15/C-19 with ATS-34, or a Starmate with CPM440V. Wasn't Chris Reeve the first to use S30V ?
IMHO, Spyderco liner locks are good locks, maybe the best production liner locks, but no where near a frame-lock. On my Starmate, when I applied (a lot of) pressure on the tip of the blade, I could feel the liner flex a bit. I wasn't worried that it would break, but I prefer the rock solid feel of a frame-lock.
Also, you can take a Sebenza apart, and put it back together perfectly <A HREF="http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showt ... 60685">see here</A>, and not void warrenty. On a Starmate, you would need to mark the position on the pivot, and when screwing it back, you need loc-tite or something to keep the pivot screw in place for the tension that you set it to. A Sebenza has a bushing around the pivot meaning you screw it down tight and still have smooth action.
Anyway, the Sebenza was very much worth the money too me. I sold my Starmate for the initial reason of this thread (they have almost identical profiles).
But, I might buy a Starmate again. Why?, I think it's one of the best and most beautifull Spyderco's.
Ted
Edited by - Ted on 10/29/2003 12:47:23 PM
I personally just can't see dropping that much on a knife that's not a special ed or proto or something. I can get 2(or more) Spydies for the price of a Sebbie,and I'm not giving up a thing in terms of quality and customer service. Plus,Spyderco has a much greater veriety.
FullerH: there's also one in the mall in Georgetown. I've never bought anything from CK&T,their prices are silly. I have bought from Remington Shaver. They actually have some decent priced merchandise,plus they do occationally have good sales. Not too good of a Spydie selection,though.
FullerH: there's also one in the mall in Georgetown. I've never bought anything from CK&T,their prices are silly. I have bought from Remington Shaver. They actually have some decent priced merchandise,plus they do occationally have good sales. Not too good of a Spydie selection,though.