Love Sharpmaker! Can't Sharpen Sage 1, help!

Mahmer09 · #1

Got the sharpmaker for Christmas. I have brought a few old knives back from the dead. My new PM2 is crazy sharp. I just am having zero luck on the Sage 1. Jdavis882 on YouTube had some tips. Sharpie, angle the Sage a little towards the opposite stone. But dang, nothing works. The grind on the Sage is unlike any other knife I have and its pissing me off. Any tips? Thanks

Seelow123 · #2

Any pics of the edge perhaps? have you dulled the knife substantially? Where is the stone removing the sharpie? I'm not helping you very much by asking a bunch of questions but if you can answer some of them, maybe I can help you out :)

APS · #3

Put the sharpie on the edge. Pick an angle and do one swipe. Check the edge to see if sharpie has been touched by the stone where you want the edge to be sharpened. If not, pick another angle and try again. Once you find the right angle, then unfortunately you will have to remember it or go through the sharpie thing again.

Donut · #4

You might have to straighten the edge out.

Either that or you have a burr.

What exactly is the edge doing when you cut something? Can you cut along the left side of the edge and not the right side of the edge?

Cliff Stamp · #5

When you say nothing works, what exactly is happening? How sharp is the edge, what stones are you using, what setting. Is the marker being removed from the entire edge bevel or part of it? If it is the latter then what part?

dbcad · #6

Some magnification would definitely help. Seeing and knowing what you are doing at the edge is invaluable.

Another good tip is to cease trying to sharpen if you're getting frustrated. Remember all you're trying to do is make the bevels meet in the middle with precision. Let the offending blade sit and evaluate again with magnification after the frustration has passed. I've been in your shoes Mahmer09

Mahmer09 · #7

Thanks for the responses. I can eventually remove sharpie. But usually on one side more than the other even though I feel like I'm using the same angle. The knife won't cut paper at all. I start off one step 1 and try to go through all the steps but I'm so inconsistent at removing sharpie, its frustrating. Even a Gerber Bear Grils knife has gotten amazingly sharp. I just don't get it.

Mahmer09 · #8

Donut wrote:You might have to straighten the edge out.

Either that or you have a burr.

What exactly is the edge doing when you cut something? Can you cut along the left side of the edge and not the right side of the edge?

How would I do that? Can I do that with the Sharpmaker? It doesn't feel really different on either side. But I have noticed that the edge is really small on each side. It already was smaller, I just can't figure out why the Sage is so different or how to deal with the difference.

PatCatMan · #9

Sounds like you got a burr.
I get the same kinda problems out of the ZDP. Still can't get that steel sharp enough.

Back to your Sage 1 - one of the sharpest blades I own - my EDC and fav - same steel as your PM2 right?
May have a little difference in angle from side to side, or most likely a burr. These guys on here know much more than me, but if you can feel the burr - strop or pull(reverse action) the blade on the side of the burr and see if that doesn't help.

Then light strokes. S30V perks up quick on the UF's for me.

Good luck - still fighting ZDP here.
Pat

Cliff Stamp · #10

There is no burr, the edge isn't cutting paper then it isn't even apexed. Do not move past the first step until the edge cleanly slices paper. If you are removing sharpy more on one side than the other then work on the other side (where it isn't being removed) until it evens out. It will take some time after you can no longer see the marker before the edge is full apexed (brought to a point) because you can't really see beyond about 0.1 mm without magnification.

jnichols2 · #11

I had the same problem with my Sage 1. I needed to reprofile the edge.
See my thread: http://www.spyderco.com/forums/showthre ... ofile+Sage

To properly reprofile the edge, you really need the diamond rods. The grey stone just doesn't cut fast enough.
When you remove all sharpie on both sides and it cuts paper, then go to the grey stone and sharpen as normal.

Mahmer09 · #12

Cliff Stamp wrote:There is no burr, the edge isn't cutting paper then it isn't even apexed. Do not move past the first step until the edge cleanly slices paper. If you are removing sharpy more on one side than the other then work on the other side (where it isn't being removed) until it evens out. It will take some time after you can no longer see the marker before the edge is full apexed (brought to a point) because you can't really see beyond about 0.1 mm without magnification.

So I have gotten it to a point where if I turn the knife over and feel it, it will be sharper on one side. That's the burr right? If I have turned the knife over and it is sharper on the right side, do I switch and sharpen the other side to cut the burr? Keep doing that until it can cut paper? Then move onto the fine and ultra fine stones? I guess my two main obstacles is knowing when to stop and not just rolling a burr over and over and then how to proceed on the finer stones. Alternate strokes or what? Thanks y'all

Mahmer09 · #13

jnichols2 wrote:I had the same problem with my Sage 1. I needed to reprofile the edge.
See my thread: http://www.spyderco.com/forums/showthre ... ofile+Sage

To properly reprofile the edge, you really need the diamond rods. The grey stone just doesn't cut fast enough.
When you remove all sharpie on both sides and it cuts paper, then go to the grey stone and sharpen as normal.

This isn't really an option right now. I have just started doing one side on the grey stones until I get a burr and then attack the other side. Like I said earlier, I am not sure when to stop this process and move onto the finer stones. I do have the ultra fine rods. But right now those seem like the last thing the Sage 1 needs.

dbcad · #14

Sounds like you are starting to have success Mahmer :) Don't try to rush it, S30V is a pretty wear resistant steel :) We don't know how much pressure you're using, but when the burr starts flopping from side to side try to reduce force to 1/2-1 lb. All you want to do then is remove the burr.

I still recomend magnification, ie. a loupe if you want to play with edges :)

Cliff Stamp · #15

Mahmer09 wrote:So I have gotten it to a point where if I turn the knife over and feel it, it will be sharper on one side. That's the burr right? If I have turned the knife over and it is sharper on the right side, do I switch and sharpen the other side to cut the burr? Keep doing that until it can cut paper? Then move onto the fine and ultra fine stones?

This is the basic process to follow, doesn't matter if it is Sharpmaker or stones : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPGGo3W15HQ .

Grinding until you feel the edge clearly deflected to the other side isn't a sensible way to process for a number of reasons, the main ones are :

-you have severely weakened the edge, that is why it collapsed
-you now have to grind all of that weakened steel off

If you have a burr however but the knife isn't cutting paper then unless you are trying to cut paper in a very particular manner there is something seriously wrong with the steel. How exactly are you cutting the paper and what type of paper is it?

This really isn't a complicated process at all : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSt2mCWGFII

araneae · #16

If you are having trouble removing the burr, try cutting straight across the stone, like you are cutting it in half, with very light pressure. The edge should be quite sharp before you move on to the white stones.

Papa_K · #17

I'd swear that the Taiwan S30V steel (Sage1 and Chaparral) seems very different from the Golden, CO S30V steel (Mil and PM2).
As I remember it, they liked the strop.

This video may be helpful:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MHe_8wT ... ata_player

Mahmer09 · #18

Cliff Stamp wrote:This is the basic process to follow, doesn't matter if it is Sharpmaker or stones : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPGGo3W15HQ .

Grinding until you feel the edge clearly deflected to the other side isn't a sensible way to process for a number of reasons, the main ones are :

-you have severely weakened the edge, that is why it collapsed
-you now have to grind all of that weakened steel off

If you have a burr however but the knife isn't cutting paper then unless you are trying to cut paper in a very particular manner there is something seriously wrong with the steel. How exactly are you cutting the paper and what type of paper is it?

This really isn't a complicated process at all : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSt2mCWGFII

Thanks Cliff. I had seen one of your videos before but didn't make the connection. In the beginning where you are getting the edge so it won't reflect light, mine totally does btw, how would I do that on the sharpmaker? Ten plus passes each side? Decent amount of pressure?

araneae · #19

Papa_K wrote:I'd swear that the Taiwan S30V steel (Sage1 and Chaparral) seems very different from the Golden, CO S30V steel (Mil and PM2).

It's the same steel, they ship it to Taiwan.

Mahmer09 · #20

So I got some 150 grit sand paper. Folded it around the rods and taped it up. I've just gone over and over with the blade straight up and down and I'm trying to reprofile it. Not sure if this is right but it is starting to cut paper. Plan on taking it through the steps soon without the sand paper. Can't wait until the knife works on the sharpmaker straight up and down.