LED Drop-In for SureFire G2

JBE · #1

Could anyone recommend an LED drop-in for an older SF G-2 incan? Something that doesn't require modding or replacing of head assembly/lens...Doesn't have to be the brightest or the best, I'm just looking for extending run times of my CR123's. Thanks!

RyanA · #2

Edit: The poster below me has a much better idea. I wasn't even aware those were on the market.

Buckles · #3

you could always just buy one of the new KX4 heads from Surefire. 120l for $52

Ferreter · #4

Dereelight make LED dropin's that will work in a G2. I converted all my Surefire's that take P60's or P90's to Dereelight dropin's a while ago.

JBE · #5

Ferreter wrote:Dereelight make LED dropin's that will work in a G2. I converted all my Surefire's that take P60's or P90's to Dereelight dropin's a while ago.

How are they working out for you? Have a link to where you got them from?

ETA: I found their website, unfortunately their US distributor doesn't have any in stock....

RyanA · #6

Heat will be a serious problem in a G2 though. You'd want something with a low amperage draw (approx 350ma). At 1200ma the deerelight dropins will run way too hot.

RIOT · #7

ive never seen a surefire light with an LED, all i know is i flashed my regular surefire light in my buddies face on night and all he could say is it was way brighter than a LED light.

does surefire make LED lights that are better than the regular ones ?

RyanA · #8

It's complicated. There are a lot of factors involved. It really depends on what you're comparing it to. There should be quite a few SF LED lights that are brighter than say a 6p (The E2DL is an excellent example). The bottom line is that LED makes more light in the visible spectrum and less heat than incandescent, so at a given level of power consumption, say 20 watts, it will produce more light. 20 watts in incandescent will likely produce about 4-500 lumens. A led array of 3-4 leds with proper heat management could likely go as high as 1500-2000 lumens. The big issue is that the more power that is used the more heat is produced. For LED's this reduces the overall output. Heat is not really a problem for incandescents though, so if you want to hit stratospheric numbers like say 15,000 lumens, then incan is still the way to go for now. That's the simple version. There are lots of other factors to consider as well.

RIOT · #9

thanks for that info! with my own judgement i always noticed with a super high powered LED light < its bright but it does not put out the far distance of light needed like a regular Surefire.

I need a light to be not only super bright but to put out the super distance too.

RyanA · #10

Output and distance are two different areas. Distance has to do mostly with the size of the optic/reflector in comparison to the surface area of the light source. I don't think you'd notice a huge difference between distance in a e2dl and a 6p. The e2dl might actually outhrow a 6p. They have a measurement you can compare if you're looking up reviews, check out the Lux figures. Just make sure they're all measured at the same distance or the measurement wont be very useful. For the most part LED lights with outputs near 200 lumens will likely reach out a good distance. But as the numbers go up the distance will likely go down. Most of the really high output LED lights pull off such big numbers by using a large chip or multiple emitters. This increases the surface area of the emitter and reduces throw.

If you want output and throw then HID is the way to go. There are a lot of drawbacks though. Ballasts limit how small the light can be. There's typically a warm up time. And they're usually expensive. But they do put out big numbers that go a long ways. Stanley makes a neat one for about 80 bucks. It can be found in the auto section of wally world. The ballast has a sort of scramble mode so there's no warm up. It's a sweet light for the money.

RIOT · #11

RyanA wrote:Output and distance are two different areas. Distance has to do mostly with the size of the optic/reflector in comparison to the surface area of the light source. I don't think you'd notice a huge difference between distance in a e2dl and a 6p. The e2dl might actually outhrow a 6p. They have a measurement you can compare if you're looking up reviews, check out the Lux figures. Just make sure they're all measured at the same distance or the measurement wont be very useful. For the most part LED lights with outputs near 200 lumens will likely reach out a good distance. But as the numbers go up the distance will likely go down. Most of the really high output LED lights pull off such big numbers by using a large chip or multiple emitters. This increases the surface area of the emitter and reduces throw.

If you want output and throw then HID is the way to go. There are a lot of drawbacks though. Ballasts limit how small the light can be. There's typically a warm up time. And they're usually expensive. But they do put out big numbers that go a long ways. Stanley makes a neat one for about 80 bucks. It can be found in the auto section of wally world. The ballast has a sort of scramble mode so there's no warm up. It's a sweet light for the money.

pretty cool info, you obviously know your lights, which i do not.

i bought a bunch of crappy 20 dollar lights for my ar15 and then i bought the surefire light (80 bucks) which kills everything i have.

still im always searching for THE BEST.

JBE · #12

RyanA...Thanks for the great info!

Is there a drop-in lamp module that you can recommend?

*Cho* · #13

I was recently told by a SF rep that SF would be selling new G2 heads seperately because the newer models are now stronger, have increased lumens output. So instead of forcing customer to upgrade they are making it possible to upgrade just the head.

jujigatame · #14

I got an LED dropin for my G2 incan a few years back from Lighthound and have been very pleased with it. The most I use it for at one time is usually a few minutes. Extended use will get the head pretty warm but I've only had to do that on a couple of occasions. Battery life has been very good with it. Even after you're past the point of getting max brightness there is still a lot of usable light to be had for several hours.

samuraishot · #15

I've got a Malkoff M60 drop-in (now replaced with the M61).

Check out Gene's stuff on malkoffdevices.com. It's totally worth it.

Ferreter · #16

JBE wrote:How are they working out for you? Have a link to where you got them from?

ETA: I found their website, unfortunately their US distributor doesn't have any in stock....

I find them quite good, though I should've said I primarily use them in a 6P or M2 rather than a G2. I have tried one in my G2 and it works fine but as RyanA said extented use may cause heat issues in a G2.

nuubee · #17

lapolicegear is currently running a 15% off sale on everything until the 14th, and the discount code is listed at the top of the page. If you get one of the KX4 heads (normally $52), you can select whatever color to match your G2 head, or get it in a contrasting color contrast. They should not overheat in a G2, because the bezels that now go on the G2 led models are aluminum, with a powder-coated finish. The discount is going to bring it below $50 spent on SureFire products (which should get you free shipping), so think about picking up a lanyard, or a couple of lanyard rings, or some other SureFire product, to get the discounted price above $50, to get free shipping. Here is the link to the KX4 led bezel:

http://www.lapolicegear.com/surefire-hi ... t-led.html

The design and build quality of Gene Malkoff's led drop-ins are nothing short of superlative. You say you want maximum throw. The new Malkoff M61 series are not configured to throw a beam as far as the old M60 series that had an optic. You can still get the M60 at:

http://www.elzetta.com/m60_faq.htm

You are going to want to get a metal bezel if you get a Malkoff M60 because of heat issues. They tend to be regularly available on ebay.

SaturnNyne · #18

nuubee wrote:You are going to want to get a metal bezel if you get a Malkoff M60 because of heat issues.

Since the original poster said he's looking to extend runtimes, the Malkoff he'd want would be one of the low output models. I have no experience with the M61s, but, as I remember it, the M60s were said to be usable for ~15 minutes with plastic bodies and the low power versions could be used without restrictions.

Also I'm not totally convinced that adding a metal bezel to a plastic body helps significantly, even though SF switched to metal bezels on the G2L shortly after introduction. When mounted in place, the conical section of the dropin sits entirely within the plastic body, all the way up to the rim (which is wrapped in a sticker on the newer ones anyway), and the front of it rests against the bezel's glass with space around the edges. Held like this, the brass of the dropin's heatsink makes very little or no contact with the aluminum and the only advantage would be quicker cooling of the air surrounding the narrow dropin rim and better conductance of whatever heat makes it out through the plastic threads. My guess is that the difference is negligible enough that—no matter which bezel you used—you'd be better off either limiting runtimes or using a dropin that runs cool enough for it to not be an issue.

I used my 6P bezel on my G2Z with M60 for a while, but I didn't like the nose-heaviness or scratch potential of the type 2 ano, and it didn't offer any advantage at all since I only used it for brief bursts. Switched back to G2Z bezel and have been happy with it that way.

(Side note: My M60 and M60WL work perfectly in both the 6P and G2Z bodies, but at least the 60WL does not work reliably in the G2 body for some reason; it often fails to respond and I have to loosen and tighten bezel and tail, shake it about, poke and prod until it comes on. This is just an anecdote and I have no idea if this is actually an issue or just a problem with my particular G2 or M60WL, but it was enough of a problem that I now put up with the weight of the 6P instead. I've heard of similar issues with cheaper dropins too.)

But anyway, the OP said it doesn't have to be the best or brightest, so he's probably not looking to pay Malkoff prices. Maybe just the basic SF P60L dropin would be good if he can find one at a good deal? It's pretty much an exact LED replacement of the original lamp assembly: same spill, almost same spot, similar throw, long runtime, cooler tint (little too cool on mine), and ability to accept a wide range of voltages. But I see it's been discontinued and replaced with the KX4. I'd guess they gave up on the dropin idea because of the heat transfer problem I mentioned, choosing to create a single piece solution with proper heatsinking that would work equally well on any body. That would also be part of why they were able to increase output. That's a shame for those who wanted to have both options and carry one in their SC1.

I have no experience with any other options.

jujigatame · #19

I'd imagine the P60L can be found without much trouble at CPF.

RyanA · #20

Sorry it's been a while. I got kinda wound up in something else and forgot to check in here.

If you'd like to keep the stock nitrolon bezel then something like a Malkoff M61LL is probably a good bet.

However the new KX4 that Buckles mentioned is probably a better deal all around. Because the KX4 head upgrade is made from aluminum the heat issues that would normally result from running an LED in nitrolon would be alleviated as well.