Oddball blade steels

[Mk-211]

Apparently it's official now, this was posted on Blade Forums.

[tzirconia]

Apparently it's official now, this was posted on Blade Forums.

Well, with that info now I'm officially excited for this steel!

[VandymanG]

Love the idea and opportunity to try new steels. But I also worry about certain knife models being made with or tied to CPM steels being discontinued or sky rocketing in price. My budget can only really handle three knives and a mule this year. It’s not like last year where I was buying just shy of two Spyderco knives a month. So I can’t just quickly go out and buy the knife model or steel I want. This whole thing is frustrating. Already got 2 of 3 of the budgeted folders. Now I want the Temperance PE Cruwear and several other knives I had planned out long term to get but probably won’t be able to.

[jwbnyc]

There it is. This is the one I’ve been waiting my whole life for. MagnaMax.

[WilliamMunny]

Love the idea and opportunity to try new steels. But I also worry about certain knife models being made with or tied to CPM steels being discontinued or sky rocketing in price. My budget can only really handle three knives and a mule this year. It’s not like last year where I was buying just shy of two Spyderco knives a month. So I can’t just quickly go out and buy the knife model or steel I want. This whole thing is frustrating. Already got 2 of 3 of the budgeted folders. Now I want the Temperance PE Cruwear and several other knives I had planned out long term to get but probably won’t be able to.

Don’t worry you’re not alone, I just posted about this. I try to keep my knife purchase to 2-3 a year. But this year will be extremely hard so I just try to make a plan.

1. Para 3 LW (already purchased)
2. MagnaMax Mule
3. BBB Collaboration

I am not going to lie, I am going to also probably get a Rex-121.

But that leaves out many others like a Manix LW 15v, Native 5 Cruwear, Military 15v, Manix XL, etc. it sucks but it’s also a bit silly if I spent more than my budget. It's just making sure I get my top priority knives.

[8th_Note]

Love the idea and opportunity to try new steels. But I also worry about certain knife models being made with or tied to CPM steels being discontinued or sky rocketing in price. My budget can only really handle three knives and a mule this year. It’s not like last year where I was buying just shy of two Spyderco knives a month. So I can’t just quickly go out and buy the knife model or steel I want. This whole thing is frustrating. Already got 2 of 3 of the budgeted folders. Now I want the Temperance PE Cruwear and several other knives I had planned out long term to get but probably won’t be able to.

I have a limited knife budget as well, but I troll eBay and BladeBinge daily for good deals on lightly used knives. And there are some incredible deals to be had if you watch closely, do due diligence, and aren't afraid to make low ball offers. There are also some incredible deals on new knives that pop up at the big retailers, if you have the patience to look for them.

[abbazaba]

Every time I read this thread all I can think of is my precious CPM-M4... I know there are already other equivalents but I truly hope M4 gets to live on. Hopefully BHQ adapts K390 as their new default exclusive steel, being the only steel many consider a true "upgrade" to M4. I do wonder how much that would effect the price... M4 could often appear in knives for a very attractive price.

Regardless, upwards and onwards. As much as I am still in disbelief about Crucible having metallurgists in the family that have worked in the industry with them, I'm certain we will end up in a new era of incredible steel thanks to people like Larrin and Shawn pushing the limits of what is possible. Spyderco will continue doing exactly what they have been for years, even if it looks different than it is now. I know they are up to the challenge.

[Naperville]

Ohhhhh MagnaMax is like K390 for edge holding but S35VN for toughness.

This is unreal. I like where modern steels are headed!

Pulease make em available for the Native Chief.

[VandymanG]

Ohhhhh MagnaMax is like K390 for edge holding but S35VN for toughness.

This is unreal. I like where modern steels are headed!

Pulease make em available for the Native Chief.

It would be a great steel for the whole native line up. Just hope that if they release it as a mule that they make enough and that they figure out how to prevent the mess that happened when the Magnacut mule was released. I couldn’t get one because of the server being overwhelmed and the quick sellout.

[VandymanG]

Don’t know if these steels fall into the oddball category but tool steels in general have become my favorite. I have far more tool steels than I do stainless steel knives. I would love to see more M4 and 3V knives. Of course any more opportunities down the road to get more CRUWEAR would greatly be appreciated. If crucible had a steel that patina’s really well I’d love to hear about it and see a knife made from it. T15 has a beautiful patina when I forced the mule I had to patina, would love to see that in a knife if stock was purchased to make said knives.

Decided last night to sell my comic book collection in order to buy some more knives than my budget would allow. Haven’t bought a comic book in decades and my collection is just sitting in boxes all bagged upped so they’re just taking up space.

[RustyIron]

Don’t know if these steels fall into the oddball category but tool steels in general have become my favorite.

It's comforting to know there are at least a couple of us. Despite my preference for patination, I have to admit that it's pretty cool to get all the desired blade characteristics in a material that won't rust. K390 has been my favorite pocket knife steel, so I'm a bit curious about MagnaMax. If it's used in a model that I like, I'll surely pick one up.

[Red Leader]

Don’t know if these steels fall into the oddball category but tool steels in general have become my favorite.

It's comforting to know there are at least a couple of us. Despite my preference for patination, I have to admit that it's pretty cool to get all the desired blade characteristics in a material that won't rust. K390 has been my favorite pocket knife steel, so I'm a bit curious about MagnaMax. If it's used in a model that I like, I'll surely pick one up.

I'm curious as well, but what has me more curious than MagnaMax is if the same type of research that went into making a 'stainless K390' could be applied in a slightly different direction and be used to take a steel like K390 and give it more wear resistance for the same amount of toughness, or even a tougher K390? Where I am at, I have little need for corrosion resistance, and K390 takes a beautiful patina anyway.

However, the fact that other players are getting behind this is promising. I think that out of the ashes of the Crucible situation we'll see even a golden era of knife-specific steels emerge.

[Red Leader]

I would love to see more M4 and 3V knives.

Me too. Have you read up on 3V mod? Interesting stuff.

I've been doing some deeper diving on the matrix steels, 1V, AEB-L, and 14c28N and some of these lower cost steels hold a lot of promise for some budget-friendly options, and I feel like there is lots of potential for optimization. I mean, if talk of a 52100 MT gets into the room and all.

If I had to choose one steel, for one knife, for the rest of my life, that had to do everything, and work on everything, all the time, I'd probably do 14c28N or 3V, all things considered. And if I'm dreaming, a K390/14c28N san mai if such a thing was ever possible!

[vanka]

Don’t know if these steels fall into the oddball category but tool steels in general have become my favorite.

It's comforting to know there are at least a couple of us. Despite my preference for patination, I have to admit that it's pretty cool to get all the desired blade characteristics in a material that won't rust. K390 has been my favorite pocket knife steel, so I'm a bit curious about MagnaMax. If it's used in a model that I like, I'll surely pick one up.

I'm curious as well, but what has me more curious than MagnaMax is if the same type of research that went into making a 'stainless K390' could be applied in a slightly different direction and be used to take a steel like K390 and give it more wear resistance for the same amount of toughness, or even a tougher K390? Where I am at, I have little need for corrosion resistance, and K390 takes a beautiful patina anyway.

However, the fact that other players are getting behind this is promising. I think that out of the ashes of the Crucible situation we'll see even a golden era of knife-specific steels emerge.

I think there is such a steel. Tool steel grade, tough and very wear resistant. S390. I could be wrong though. Can't make direct comparison. My S390 hunters are very different geometry and grind compared to my K390 spyderco knives. I might just get a hunter in K390 with similar grind and geometry. Just for the fun of it. Unfortunately spyderco never worked with s390.

[VandymanG]

Don’t know if these steels fall into the oddball category but tool steels in general have become my favorite.

It's comforting to know there are at least a couple of us. Despite my preference for patination, I have to admit that it's pretty cool to get all the desired blade characteristics in a material that won't rust. K390 has been my favorite pocket knife steel, so I'm a bit curious about MagnaMax. If it's used in a model that I like, I'll surely pick one up.

I'm curious as well, but what has me more curious than MagnaMax is if the same type of research that went into making a 'stainless K390' could be applied in a slightly different direction and be used to take a steel like K390 and give it more wear resistance for the same amount of toughness, or even a tougher K390? Where I am at, I have little need for corrosion resistance, and K390 takes a beautiful patina anyway.

However, the fact that other players are getting behind this is promising. I think that out of the ashes of the Crucible situation we'll see even a golden era of knife-specific steels emerge.

I think there is such a steel. Tool steel grade, tough and very wear resistant. S390. I could be wrong though. Can't make direct comparison. My S390 hunters are very different geometry and grind compared to my K390 spyderco knives. I might just get a hunter in K390 with similar grind and geometry. Just for the fun of it. Unfortunately spyderco never worked with s390.

I looked up S390 and it is the rough equivalent of AISI T15 high speed tool steel. If so that would be a great steel to try as a mule just to compare it with T15. Read a post on blade forum by @Larrin and from what I could understand it seems K390 is a better performing steel for knives (?).

[shunsui]

MagnaMax sounds like a game changer. We might see more emphasis on knife designs and heat treat than blade steels.

We live in interesting times.

[Larrin]

S390 does not have greater toughness than K390. High speed steels typically have a bit worse toughness-wear resistance balance because they have a third factor to account for - hot hardness. This is somewhat similar to stainless steels also usually having somewhat worse properties because they also have to balance stain resistance rather than focusing only on toughness and wear resistance (and hardness). K390, CPM-10V, and Vanadis 8 get their good balance of properties by having a microstructure of only vanadium carbides (one of the hardest carbides). So to achieve a higher toughness-wear resistance balance you would need to find a superior microstructure to the best one that we currently know about. Otherwise to get better toughness you would need to lose some wear resistance by dropping the vanadium carbide content.

[abbazaba]

MagnaMax sounds like a game changer. We might see more emphasis on knife designs and heat treat than blade steels.

We live in interesting times.

This seems like a real possibility that I would enjoy, from where I am on my journey.

[VandymanG]

S390 does not have greater toughness than K390. High speed steels typically have a bit worse toughness-wear resistance balance because they have a third factor to account for - hot hardness. This is somewhat similar to stainless steels also usually having somewhat worse properties because they also have to balance stain resistance rather than focusing only on toughness and wear resistance (and hardness). K390, CPM-10V, and Vanadis 8 get their good balance of properties by having a microstructure of only vanadium carbides (one of the hardest carbides). So to achieve a higher toughness-wear resistance balance you would need to find a superior microstructure to the best one that we currently know about. Otherwise to get better toughness you would need to lose some wear resistance by dropping the vanadium carbide content.

Thank you for the great explanation. Love how involved the experts are on this forum. It’s amazing.

[sal]

Hi Larrin,

Thanx much for chiming in. Always appreciate your input. You might want to check out Ericaedc channel. She announced a real world test for Proto X (MagnaMax).

sal