Ethical question

[Hatuletoh]

The opinion of anyone who cares to weigh in on this topic is quite welcome, but if a Spyderco representative takes a position I'll accept his/her judgment as the final word.

Summary: I have tied lanyards on most of Spyderco knives I regularly carry, and on some of those lanyards I have attached titanium beads fashioned in the shape of the Spyderco logo (see example photo below). These beads are unlicensed, that is, whatever Chinese factory that makes them is profiting from the Spyderco brand without permission or financial recompense. I would never consider buying a counterfeit knife, but the situation with these beads seems different to me, because they aren't counterfeits of a genuine Spyderco product, and I didn't purchase a knock-off lanyard bead instead of genuine one to try to save a few bucks. I know Spyderco does actually offer a few varieties of lanyard beads, but they're too heavy and/or large for my taste. I forgo a bead on a lanyard all together if I can't find one that's small, lightweight, and fits with the style/color of a particular knife. So I'll stress again that Spyderco doesn't lose out on money they otherwise would have made when I purchase an unlicensed spyder bead, although perhaps some other purveyor of lanyard beads does. And finally, for what it's worth, Spyderco gets a little free advertising from the beads hanging out of my pockets, and on a two separate occasions random folks have recognized the spyder bead, asked to see the knife to which it was attached, and been impressed with the product. I'm confident the two gentleman to whom I spoke and who got to handle a Spyderco knife for the first time are more likely to become customers than if they had not, and those interactions were precipitated by spyder-shaped lanyard beads. So that's my case for why I've always felt ethically sound purchasing and attaching to my knives unlicensed Spyderco logo lanyard beads, but a friend disagreed, which is why I'm putting this out for arbitration. As I said, I'll abide by an official ruling, or in the absence of an official position, a solid majority from the people.

[infinkc]

Id say if it was a product that Spyderco sells and is being copied, then its infringing on their patents. Technically that company should have asked for permission to produce such products, but i doubt that is the case. Stickers, shirts are also big ones. Its not ethical, but for Spyderco to go tell all these people to stop, would cost them more than its worth. Its really up to the person that is buying them if they feel its right or wrong, but legally it is wrong and hurts the company supporting people that make non licensed products.

[bobnikon]

Not to get too existential, but if you are asking the question, you already know the answer. If it wasn't bothering you, you wouldn't have asked the question. So, if you are looking for validation, are you going to accept it from those that say it is okay even if you don't think so?

[RustyIron]

You can try to rationalize it any way you want. Trademark infringement is an unethical practice perpetrated by the dregs of the world community.

[apollo]

It maybe isn’t ethical but probably that Lock cage also isn’t made with permission either.
And i do not want to count the amount of people here on the forum who have those,
myself included so i would let it go if i was you.

Besides you already own it so enjoy it. If you feel to bad about it then just don’t buy another in the future.

[aicolainen]

Like my old boss used to say; if you think you might not like the answer, don't ask. Then you can carry on doing what you think is right. Once you ask, that option is gone.

[riclaw]

Official merch > unlicensed merch > no merch

[ZrowsN1s]

I have no problems with aftermarket parts that fill holes a company leaves. I have a ton of aftermarket clips, scales, ti hardware.

Knock off's are not something I buy (a copy of something the company already offers).

This being the actual company logo is interesting. Not something they make, yet clearly an infringement on their I.P.

[ChrisinHove]

Spyderco do / did some beads, just not that pattern.

If someone’s making them for profit, unlicensed, then my take is that it’s an infringement - but maybe not a capital offence. I wouldn’t buy them, though.

[Matus]

I think it is more unethical to put lanyards on knives ...

[Bill1170]

It’s a trademark infringement if not licensed. How do you feel about theft? There’s your ethical compass right there.

[Mushroom]

You can try to rationalize it any way you want. Trademark infringement is an unethical practice perpetrated by the dregs of the world community.

This is my stance as well. I’ve seen the fake Spyderco beads and have even been tempted to purchase but I just can’t personally justify it.

[TazKristi]

@Hatuletoh we view this as trademark infringement. Plain and simple.

Sal and Gail founded Spyderco nearly 50 years ago. Spyderco has worked very hard over decades to build our reputation (one that is, by and large, viewed in a very trusted, positive light). We take enormous pride in working for Spyderco and working for you, our customer.

When you see our logo on a product (even a product that IS our logo), it instills a certain level of trust that what you're purchasing is made with quality and integrity. The Bug (our logo) was custom-designed; it was carefully crafted with thought and intention. It is a representation of our company.

When I look at anything that infringes on our legal trademark, I don't see integrity or quality. I see something intended to potentially fool our customers and hurt us. There is no grey area here. It's ours. They're stealing it. They're profiting off of decades of hard work, passion, commitment, and integrity.

You wanted an official opinion. Now you have it.

Kristi

[The Mastiff]

Ethics and doing the right thing isn't something you need a majority vote on. You either do what is right or you don't. Majority opinions shouldn't enter into it.

You already knew what is right though.

[Nestor]

Many of us need to experience something first hand to develop better understanding of the problem. I grew up behind the Iron Curtain and copyright piracy was just a daily routine back then. Took me years to re-program my perception on this topic, but I must honestly admit that two or three times I failed miserably nonetheless. Couple of years ago I've published two books in the old country and some of the stuff from them was blatantly copied and distributed by someone. The day I discovered that, sure helped me to fully understand the importance of the copyright and feelings connected with being a victim of theft. Decide for yourself what side you're on. Cheers.

[shunsui]

I'm going with free advertising as far as that bead goes.

Fake knives would be another matter.

[yablanowitz]

I'm going with free advertising as far as that bead goes.

Fake knives would be another matter.

I disagree. Trademark infringement is trademark infringement, whether it is a bead in the shape of someone else's logo or a knife pretending to be something it's not. Both are theft, period.

[Bill1170]

I'm going with free advertising as far as that bead goes.

Fake knives would be another matter.

I disagree. Trademark infringement is trademark infringement, whether it is a bead in the shape of someone else's logo or a knife pretending to be something it's not. Both are theft, period.

I’m with Yablanowitz and Taz Kristi. Theft is theft.

[ladybug93]

since the round hole is trademarked, would drilling a hole in your own non-spyderco knife be wrong? just wondering how far this sentiment goes.


if another company is offering something spyderco doesn't, you're not taking away from spyderco business. people aren't dumb enough to think a bead that isn't offered by you is representative of your brand, and if they are, there was no helping them anyway.

that said, i do agree that infringement is infringement. they shouldn't be profiting off of the spyderco logo. i just don't care for some of the justifications given.

[Mushroom]

since the round hole is trademarked, would drilling a hole in your own non-spyderco knife be wrong? just wondering how far this sentiment goes.


if another company is offering something spyderco doesn't, you're not taking away from spyderco business. people aren't dumb enough to think a bead that isn't offered by you is representative of your brand, and if they are, there was no helping them anyway.

that said, i do agree that infringement is infringement. they shouldn't be profiting off of the spyderco logo. i just don't care for some of the justifications given.

Personal modifications like that would likely fall under fair use. It’s when illicit profits are being made that it would become trademark infringement.

Custom makers need to license the use of Spyderco's round hole if they want to use it on a model they plan to produce and sell.