Getting Full Value from Your Blade Length

[kennethsime]

One thing I've been paying attention to more, since acquiring a Tenacious and a Rock Jumper, is how much of the edge of a given knife is fully-sharpened. Fans of the "other brands" are often caught complaining about the lack of a "sharpening choil" on Spyderco knives, but frankly I'm all for the full use of the edge. After all, that's where we get the most leverage, and if we're carrying around an extra 1/8" of CPM steel, we may as well be able to use it. Right?

I was perusing the 2024 Product Guide tonight, and while I'm stoked on the Bodacious design, one thing that immediately stuck out to me in the catalog was the lack of a fully-sharpened edge:


The Tenacious, by comparison, appears nearly fully-sharpened by comparison:


I know that Eric has talked about how difficult this particular process is, so I got to wondering whether one factory or another may be better at this process. We've seen an example from Golden and China, so far.

Using the Caribbean as a sample, Taichung's looking pretty darn good:


Seki's looking hit or miss here on the Lil' Temperance; the VG-10 is missing a section, the K390 looks complete:


I wondered if I should check some other models from the Golden factory. The Microjimbo looks PERFECT:


...but the Yojimbo is kinda of meh by this standard:


Finally, it struck me that these photos, all from the catalog, may have been touched up in Photoshop or similar. So friends, I ask you:
- Which model in your collection offers the most fully-sharpened edge?
- Which factory have you noticed excelling at this process?
- Have you corrected a less-than-fully-sharpened edge? How long did it take, and what was your process?

Discuss.

[vivi]

easy fix. not a concern of mine. i put my own edge on all my knives and this is easy to correct during that process.

will take this every time over a sharpening choil. I will to go my grave believing sharpening choils on knives is one of the dumbest ideas I've ever seen.

[kennethsime]

will take this every time over a sharpening choil. I will to go my grave believing sharpening choils on knives is one of the dumbest ideas I've ever seen.

Preach.

[Mushroom]

I like Spyderco’s general approach toward sharpening choils, in that it is easier for the end line user to add a sharpening choil to the blade than it is to remove a sharpening choil from the blade.

[zhyla]

It doesn’t really matter. Longer blades have an advantage in reach but rarely does the rearmost 1/4” of the blade get used. Maybe when slicing apples once in a while.

We tend to focus on blade length a lot when handle ergonomics matter more. It’s as if Spyderco charges by the inch and we want to make sure we get our money’s worth.

Someone with a microscope could probably take photos of edges at different parts of the blade and show how much more wear the middle gets than the tip and heel.

[kennethsime]

It doesn’t really matter. Longer blades have an advantage in reach but rarely does the rearmost 1/4” of the blade get used. Maybe when slicing apples once in a while.

We tend to focus on blade length a lot when handle ergonomics matter more. It’s as if Spyderco charges by the inch and we want to make sure we get our money’s worth.

Someone with a microscope could probably take photos of edges at different parts of the blade and show how much more wear the middle gets than the tip and heel.

I disagree pretty strongly with this, although I'll admit my sample size is fairly small. In cutting cardboard, which is 90% of what I use my knife for, I utilize the heel of the blade to great effect with quite a bit of frequency.

[vivi]

carving wood too. leverage matters more on harder cuts, and wood generally takes more effort than food or cardboard.

[zhyla]

In cutting cardboard, which is 90% of what I use my knife for, I utilize the heel of the blade to great effect with quite a bit of frequency.

Why? And if your main use for a knife is cutting boxes why do you care how long the blade is? Actual box cutters are like an inch of blade.

[Wartstein]

..... on the Bodacious design, one thing that immediately stuck out to me in the catalog was the lack of a fully-sharpened edge:

Not sure, but that short unsharpened section might be for added finger safety?

- On the one hand for those who don´t use the in other aspects less safe "pinch grip fingers out of the blade path" closing method but one of the other ways of closing a comp.lock one handed?
- Or should the lock ever get disengaged and the blade close unintentiontally?

Also, to me it matters more how much space there is between the hand on the handle and where the actual cutting edge starts.
It looks a bit like as if that distance is about the same on Tenacious and Bodacious, just that part of the distance on the latter is covered by unsharpened edge, but not so on the Tencacious?

That said:

- I still prefer the Tenacious approach with edge really all the way to the handle.
The Tenacious also is pretty safe for the fingers, normally when closing the linerlock the "hidden ricasso" would hit the finger, not the actual edge, if one does not put the hand too far back on the handle

- I am 100 % with Vivi, never understood sharpening notches and much rather have a short, not sharp section instead - like on the Bodacious:
If left unsharpened it still does not catch up on stuff like a notch would
And even if it is harder to reach with some sharpening gear or methods: One could always give it kind of an edge with a small file or whatever.

[vivi]

In cutting cardboard, which is 90% of what I use my knife for, I utilize the heel of the blade to great effect with quite a bit of frequency.

Why? And if your main use for a knife is cutting boxes why do you care how long the blade is? Actual box cutters are like an inch of blade.

If I'm breaking down a big box, when I halve it I stack the halves, then once those are cut I stack the quarters, so on until it's as small as I need.

It's waaaay faster than doing individual layers, and much faster than any box cutter.

[JoviAl]

It doesn’t really matter. Longer blades have an advantage in reach but rarely does the rearmost 1/4” of the blade get used. Maybe when slicing apples once in a while.

We tend to focus on blade length a lot when handle ergonomics matter more. It’s as if Spyderco charges by the inch and we want to make sure we get our money’s worth.

Someone with a microscope could probably take photos of edges at different parts of the blade and show how much more wear the middle gets than the tip and heel.

Different strokes for different folks but I use the belly and heel of the blade far more than the tip. I’m mainly either cutting down large plants into small bits, or carving/shaving wood.

To the OP - I sharpen the blades on new knives before I use them, and pretty much daily afterwards. It is super easy to sharpen right up to the heel end of the blade with diamond plates. Literally takes seconds.

[Guts]

As I've sharpened more and more knives and branched out to other mfgs that use sharpening choils, I can't help but agree with what Vivi said about sharpening choils being useless lol. At least for a freehand sharpener. I can see why they're preferable for guided sharpening systems having used those in the past. However as a now exclusively freehand sharpener myself, it's only made me appreciate Spyderco's way of doing the plunge grind sans sharpening choil even more. It's always annoyed me having to be mindful of where the heel is on sharpening choil designs while using them since they always get snagged on something. Some non-spyderco finger choil designs are even slightly dangerous to choke up on imo, since the edge at the heel may or may not be right up against your finger depending on the angle they grind the heel at.

That said, regarding the OP, I generally take most of my Spyderco edges down all the way to the plunge if possible. Some designs have more of a rounded off plunge grind which doesn't really lend itself well to doing this, but models with a 90 degree plunge like the PM2 are prime candidates. I always unintentionally nick that little unsharpened portion anyway when I sharpen so I just get rid of them completely. I like to use a diamond plate with a 90 degree edge for this. Just sharpen at the same angle as the rest of the edge until they're slightly blended, then sharpen as normal on whatever stone you were using before.

Here's a few examples I've done.



I think the discussion goes even further than that little unsharpened portion of Spydercos. Owning models like the Tenacious, Lil Temp 3, Rockjumper, all what I'd consider handle forward type designs, I'm beginning to question the utility of the classic finger choil on other designs like the PM2 and Manix. I like finger choils and use them all the time, but I feel like a good handle forward design could accomplish the same thing a finger choil does and you'd also get an extra ~1/4" of cutting edge on top of that. Like in the case of the Bodacious vs Shaman for example. You wouldn't have a finger groove dictating where you can and can't put your fingers, so you can choke up how high or how low you want to without restriction. Would love to see a handle forward PM2 or Manix next.

[JD Spydo]

I've been EDCing an M390 Military model for quite some time now. But I'll be the first to admit that I rarely ever use the entire surface of the blade (close to 4 inches) for most of my cutting jobs. But I am extremely particular that the entire surface is wicked sharp. In all honesty I could probably do just as well with a PARA2 or even a Delica for that matter in the majority of cutting jobs I encounter.

I'm now wondering if the same can be said for Spyderedged blades as well.

[Stuart Ackerman]

My main EDC for a long time now has been the Yojimbo, but before that was the Tenacious.

If I go to a place where edges are frowned upon, the Tennie is my EDC.

The reason is the length of edge, and the handle comfort second.

The steel type is merely an academic exercise anyway. ( sorry to the supersteel afficiandos! )

The folder design I submitted years ago to Sal, has a similar grind at the ricasso to get value for edge money.

[Bolster]

It doesn’t really matter. Longer blades have an advantage in reach but rarely does the rearmost 1/4” of the blade get used.

Wha??

I heavily use the heel of the blade, particularly when stripping wire, or notching wood, as is often the case when doing construction work.

I like the sharpened edge to be as close as safely possible to my index finger, for increased control.

Which is why I continue to buy knives with index finger choils, even though they eat up precious edge space.

[kobold]

One of the advantages of a longer edge is that it needs to be sharpened less often than a shorter one, all things being equal. The wear and tear spreads out over a lengthier edge. In some situations, like when we don't have a sharpener on us, this can be important.
Re sharpening choil - I never missed one, I also sharpen freehand.

[toomanyquestions]

This is an interesting topic.

I can certainly see the utility of a choil: the level of control is eye opening. Conversely, the negative leverage present in long blades has become a feature of my thinking over the last few years. However, the prospect of having a little rarely used "emergency edge" also has merits.

[vivi]

maybe its because I'm a chef that uses a 10" gyuto as my go to knife, but I feel like the difference in control I get on a 3.5" blade by shifting my grip forward 3/4" is 100% negligible.

I do appreciate a choil when carving wood for better leverage, but I wouldn't even need to use them in that case if the edge went to the handle like on the Resilience. That knife gives me the same leverage efficiency as a manix xl gripped in the choil, and it's more comfortable too.

[Senfkarte]

[...]
and while I'm stoked on the Bodacious design, one thing that immediately stuck out to me in the catalog was the lack of a fully-sharpened edge
[...]

I would not bet on the representation in the catalog.
Not sure, if it's still the case, but there was a time, when the number of teeth and the serration pattern of the UKPK in the catalog differed from the pattern of the real knife.
In general the photos seem a little edited. Maybe the sharpened part really is this short, maybe not. We will see.

[pleadnotguilty]

Looking forward to a future with a bodacious xl