"Late lockup" on a cbbl?

[JuPaul]

The cbbl on my new cruwear Manix sits significantly lower in the cutout than on my other Manixes when the blade is open. Like the ball bearing isn't seating as far up the tang of the blade as usual. Maybe the spring is shorter or more compressed. Without taking it apart it's tough to see if this would be a problem. There's currently no blade play of any kind, lock up feels solid. Any thoughts?

It was hard to capture on camera, but here's my attempt:

[JRinFL]

I’m probably wrong, but I’m thinking some sort of engineering change (CQI) on the lock.

[TkoK83Spy]

Hmm, that's interesting Julia. I haven't heard or read anything about a CQI on our beloved Manix! Though not a majorly significant difference, it's definitely noticable... especially to those of us that love our Manix's. I just went upstairs and checked my 4 variations and they all look the same as your Rex45 version. I'd think as long as it locks up strong and no play, it should be okay...but that is a little odd. Hoping others with the same knife can chime in or provide pics. I passed on this one myself, but I'm definitely curious.

[RustyIron]

I've never before noticed any variation, so I checked four of my Manix variants.
A REX45 G10 engages in the middle, like yours.
An M4 XL is about the same, right in the middle.
A Maxamet LW engages further.
A REX45 LW engages LESS, like your Cruwear.

To be fair, all but the Maxamet LW have been apart, and I didn't take note of how they were from the factory.

[JuPaul]

Thanks for checking on yours, everyone. My older Manixes have all been taken apart as well, but I never noticed a difference in this regard before and after. I can definitely feel the difference when unlocking this model, though. It's a shorter pull to disengage the lock, for sure.

[nerdlock]

Maybe you could try taking it apart and see if there is any difference in the part where the ball bearing meets the tang of the blade during lockup?

[Wartstein]

[EDIT: Julia, I was not really awake already when I posted the now deleted pic (it was early in the morning where I live) - I actually posted the one I took with the blade in the CLOSED position... :o :p

Update it now with the correct one in the OPEN position :) ]

I only have my two lightweights to compare to yours.
I took a pic (now updated in the open position!) so you can check for yourself.
Looks more like on your REX 45 and by that how obviously most (but not all!) Manix CBBLs normally look in the open position, going by the posts so far?!

[sal]

Hi Julia,

Is there blade play?

sal

[Wartstein]

[EDIT: Deleted for sillyness... :p ]
....

And: I´d actually very much dislike it if they made a change in a way that the spring would be less "strong".
But still I could see the reasoning behind it, since people who compare CBBL and axxis lock often times prefer the axxis lock due to its a bit easier operation. But they forget the CONs with the latter (can open in the pocket (happened to me), springs more fragile (broke twice on my BM Minigrip)

[rklee]

<double post>

[rklee]

I have a Q-Ball with the ball bearing lock, and shortly after I got it, the locking seemed to become early, with the ball going just a tiny bit up the tang. That made me concerned, but I wondered if it was always that way, that maybe I was imagining things. One day I took a loupe to it and noticed a bit of pocket lint on the tang side. With a toothpick, I was able to remove it, and the problem was gone. Now it locks up very nice and secure.

[ChrisinHove]

I think that the ongoing self optimisation is part of the genius of the cbbl / bbl. Even if the ball and ramp wear to the extent of creating blade play, a new, slightly oversized ball would probably sort it.

[Cambertree]

What’s the lock release like on it Julia?

Discernibly lighter or heavier?

Could it be a CQI to make it easier to release?

I know some people say that they can release the lock with one finger/thumb. Both of mine need to have a hold on both sides to release the lock.

[PStone]

The cbbl on my new cruwear Manix sits significantly lower in the cutout than on my other Manixes when the blade is open. Like the ball bearing isn't seating as far up the tang of the blade as usual. Maybe the spring is shorter or more compressed. Without taking it apart it's tough to see if this would be a problem. There's currently no blade play of any kind, lock up feels solid. Any thoughts?

It was hard to capture on camera, but here's my attempt:

Hey Julia. I would call yours an “early lockup”. I had the same issue after a blade swap. As long as the purple does actually lock, you should be good. It’ll actually allow for more wear on the tang before it bottoms out.
But you should be sure it’s really locking. That was the issue with mine and had to swap back. Basically performed like a really strong slip joint. I know yours isn’t swapped, but here is a pic where you can see the difference in cbbl position:

Notice the gray LW cbbl. Similar to yours. It seemed to lock, but would fold up like a slippie. And the gray g10 was bottomed out and had play. Not sure if this helps, but as long as it’s 100% for sure locking, I would actually be happy with yours because I think the life of the lock will be longer.

[semfi1345]

The cbbl on my new cruwear Manix sits significantly lower in the cutout than on my other Manixes when the blade is open. Like the ball bearing isn't seating as far up the tang of the blade as usual. Maybe the spring is shorter or more compressed. Without taking it apart it's tough to see if this would be a problem. There's currently no blade play of any kind, lock up feels solid. Any thoughts?

It was hard to capture on camera, but here's my attempt:

My Cru-manix looks exactly like yours. It's got a rock solid lockup; however, when opening the blade, it pushes the locking mechanism downwards until it overcomes the resistance and makes a little pop sound to come open. Also, pulling the CBBL to unlock the blade also has a lip of some sort that it catches on every time I unlock it.

[Donut]

Back in the day, someone swapped out their bearing with ceramic, they found the right size and found a place that sold ceramic bearings.

I wonder if changing the bearing with ceramic would "fix" your late lockup problem. It must be a tolerance thing. I don't know if you could fix it by swapping bearings round. It is more likely tolerance to the angle of the ramp on the blade.

I don't know if I'd be able to find that thread.

I do have a pile of these types of knives, Manix 2 is my favorite. I'll have to do some looking.

[Pokey]

Here are my two. It looks like they lock/unlock about the same. I included a photo of the wear on the tang showing how far the bb engages the tang. I can imagine that if when the tang is machined the flat portion where the ball engages is cut just a hair lower or at a slight angle the ball would travel farther or not as far when fully assembled and locked/unlocked. Or, is the hole for the pivot slightly off center raising or lowering the tang? A slight change in the diameter of the bb would make a difference, too.

My point? It could be machining tolerances stacking up one way or the other and making a difference in lock/unlock timing.

[JuPaul]

The cbbl on my new cruwear Manix sits significantly lower in the cutout than on my other Manixes when the blade is open. Like the ball bearing isn't seating as far up the tang of the blade as usual. Maybe the spring is shorter or more compressed. Without taking it apart it's tough to see if this would be a problem. There's currently no blade play of any kind, lock up feels solid. Any thoughts?

It was hard to capture on camera, but here's my attempt:

Hey Julia. I would call yours an “early lockup”. I had the same issue after a blade swap. As long as the purple does actually lock, you should be good. It’ll actually allow for more wear on the tang before it bottoms out.
But you should be sure it’s really locking. That was the issue with mine and had to swap back. Basically performed like a really strong slip joint. I know yours isn’t swapped, but here is a pic where you can see the difference in cbbl position:

Notice the gray LW cbbl. Similar to yours. It seemed to lock, but would fold up like a slippie. And the gray g10 was bottomed out and had play. Not sure if this helps, but as long as it’s 100% for sure locking, I would actually be happy with yours because I think the life of the lock will be longer.

That's exactly what I was worried about, PStone, and you're right: "early" does make more sense. Messing with it last night the lock up seemed solid, but I'm going to double check when I'm home later. If it is indeed locking then I won't worry about it. Thank you!

[sal]

Hi Julia,

Not to worry. If you get blade play, then you'll have to send it to us.

sal

[JuPaul]

Well, turns out the lockup is definitely compromised. I can close it without disengaging the lock. Looks like it'll have to go into spyderco. Sure hope they can fix it!!