M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Discuss Spyderco's products and history.
Doeswhateveraspidercan
Member
Posts: 2216
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:31 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm

First S35VN is hardly new.

Second tame your ego.

Ask yourself even as I would who am I to Debate Sal or Eric?

Who am I to debate Chris Reeve?

You are a nobody got it?

I am a nobody got it?

These are industry leaders accomplished people not just consumers please try to show a little humility and respect would you?

Jumping down a rabbit hole after positing a position is called a straw man argument in light of the current discussion of specific steels. IE S30V and S35VN please do try to stay on track.

Thank you very much.
:)

User avatar
Pelagic
Member
Posts: 2427
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2018 5:49 pm
Location: East Coast/Nomadic

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Pelagic » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:02 pm

Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm
First S35VN is hardly new.

Second tame your ego.

Ask yourself even as I would who am I to Debate Sal or Eric?

Who am I to debate Chris Reeve?

You are a nobody got it?

I am a nobody got it?

These are industry leaders accomplished people not just consumers please try to show a little humility and respect would you?

Jumping down a rabbit hole after positing a position is called a straw man argument in light of the current discussion of specific steels. IE S30V and S35VN please do try to stay on track.

Thank you very much.
Tame my ego? Lol, this site is glorious. All I did was reference what I've seen in cut tests, and you're telling me that knife manufacturers opinions completely negate any and all data. I simply haven't seen many models from any companies where they push s35vn to high hardness. I was hoping you'd show me a cut test or something, but instead you just call me a nobody. But I'll try not to be so egotistical.
Pancake wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:20 pm
Are you a magician? :eek:
Nate wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 4:32 pm
You're the lone wolf of truth howling into the winds of ignorance
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm
You are a nobody got it?


Doeswhateveraspidercan
Member
Posts: 2216
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:31 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:25 pm

Pelagic wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:02 pm
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm
First S35VN is hardly new.

Second tame your ego.

Ask yourself even as I would who am I to Debate Sal or Eric?

Who am I to debate Chris Reeve?

You are a nobody got it?

I am a nobody got it?

These are industry leaders accomplished people not just consumers please try to show a little humility and respect would you?

Jumping down a rabbit hole after positing a position is called a straw man argument in light of the current discussion of specific steels. IE S30V and S35VN please do try to stay on track.

Thank you very much.
Tame my ego? Lol, this site is glorious. All I did was reference what I've seen in cut tests, and you're telling me that knife manufacturers opinions completely negate any and all data. I simply haven't seen many models from any companies where they push s35vn to high hardness. I was hoping you'd show me a cut test or something, but instead you just call me a nobody. But I'll try not to be so egotistical.
Smiles, yes you are a nobody it is okay, so am I and yes Chris Reeve is your superior in the knife industry even as he is mine.
:)

User avatar
Pelagic
Member
Posts: 2427
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2018 5:49 pm
Location: East Coast/Nomadic

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Pelagic » Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:38 am

Vivi wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:21 pm
Image
Lol, sorry it was so uneventful. What's your opinion on the matter? Debates over "which steel is better" between 2 of the most similar steels in the cutlery world seem borderline useless imo, especially considering production heat treats.

S30v = slightly more vanadium, manufacturers have more experience heat treating

S35VN = slightly tougher, potential for slightly finer grain structure, slightly more grindability, takes a high polish slightly easier.

The differences are incredibly minor, but there's considerably more hype around s35vn, which I feel is mostly due to it not being s30v, which is old news and nowhere near as coveted as it once was. I feel the difference in hype far outweighs the actual differences between the 2 steels.
Pancake wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:20 pm
Are you a magician? :eek:
Nate wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 4:32 pm
You're the lone wolf of truth howling into the winds of ignorance
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm
You are a nobody got it?

User avatar
Vivi
Member
Posts: 6438
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2007 8:15 am

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Vivi » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:57 am

I dunno, I don't have any S35VN, I just enjoy watching a good pissing contest.

User avatar
Pelagic
Member
Posts: 2427
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2018 5:49 pm
Location: East Coast/Nomadic

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Pelagic » Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:20 am

Vivi wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:57 am
I dunno, I don't have any S35VN, I just enjoy watching a good pissing contest.
First of all, I'd appreciate it if you'd lay off me a bit. I'm not trying to stir up anything like you. I was giving you an opportunity to say something on topic.

Secondly, I've used both steels in several different models from several different companies. I don't really notice a difference in use aside from buck's s30v performing very well consistently, along with certain spyderco models. Cut tests are not conclusive proof of anything, but Pete's cut tests on Cedric & Ada outdoors show s30v outperforming s35vn, and super steel Steve's testing shows them to be about equal. I've seen tests where s35vn wins as well. What I DON'T see is (aside from Buck's s30v and random other models that end up having a much higher HRC than average) one consistently overshadowing the other by a significant margin. The whole point to me is that when it comes to production heat treats, aside from the occasional outlier, the difference is negligible.
Pancake wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:20 pm
Are you a magician? :eek:
Nate wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 4:32 pm
You're the lone wolf of truth howling into the winds of ignorance
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm
You are a nobody got it?

Banter 247
Member
Posts: 40
Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:56 am

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Banter 247 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:29 am

Pelagic wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:20 am
Vivi wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:57 am
I dunno, I don't have any S35VN, I just enjoy watching a good pissing contest.
First of all, I'd appreciate it if you'd lay off me a bit. I'm not trying to stir up anything like you. I was giving you an opportunity to say something on topic.

Secondly, I've used both steels in several different models from several different companies. I don't really notice a difference in use aside from buck's s30v performing very well consistently, along with certain spyderco models. Cut tests are not conclusive proof of anything, but Pete's cut tests on Cedric & Ada outdoors show s30v outperforming s35vn, and super steel Steve's testing shows them to be about equal. I've seen tests where s35vn wins as well. What I DON'T see is (aside from Buck's s30v and random other models that end up having a much higher HRC than average) one consistently overshadowing the other by a significant margin. The whole point to me is that when it comes to production heat treats, aside from the occasional outlier, the difference is negligible.
Short version: yup. That’s about the size of it.

Doeswhateveraspidercan
Member
Posts: 2216
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:31 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:41 am

Vivi wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:57 am
I dunno, I don't have any S35VN, I just enjoy watching a good pissing contest.
He, He, He I do like to instigate a bit.
:)

Doeswhateveraspidercan
Member
Posts: 2216
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:31 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:54 am

Pelagic wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:20 am
Vivi wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:57 am
I dunno, I don't have any S35VN, I just enjoy watching a good pissing contest.
First of all, I'd appreciate it if you'd lay off me a bit. I'm not trying to stir up anything like you. I was giving you an opportunity to say something on topic.

Secondly, I've used both steels in several different models from several different companies. I don't really notice a difference in use aside from buck's s30v performing very well consistently, along with certain spyderco models. Cut tests are not conclusive proof of anything, but Pete's cut tests on Cedric & Ada outdoors show s30v outperforming s35vn, and super steel Steve's testing shows them to be about equal. I've seen tests where s35vn wins as well. What I DON'T see is (aside from Buck's s30v and random other models that end up having a much higher HRC than average) one consistently overshadowing the other by a significant margin. The whole point to me is that when it comes to production heat treats, aside from the occasional outlier, the difference is negligible.
Okay laying off.

Returning to being serious now.

I have used S35VN in Chris Reeve Knives for years the Sebbie’s in different sizes and different blades, his kitchen cutlery which the EX-Wife got and the Inyala.

I was never nice to them left them wet on purpose carried them while working in the yard sweating to death etc... No rusting or pitting not once ever.

S30V has rusted and pitted on me and I mean pits that were not shallow or something that could be rubbed out with a bit of glitz and elbow grease either.

This was on a Para3 in S30V.

I have noticed s35VN sharpens easier but seems to have more tooth than S30V while cutting.

It might even be tougher as I never had a tip break with S35VN but have had it happen with S30V the tip just chipped right off
while cutting single wall no staple having cardboard.

Chris Reeve makes great knives in S35VN but not Fully flat ground so after noticing the cutting difference between the Sebbie and a PM2 the Reeve stuff got sold and the Spyderco addiction with all the variety began.

It is unlikely Reeves will ever go FFG but if he does he will have something great.

In all honest the only superiority I have experienced between S30V and S35VN is in the corrosion department other than that pretty close in all regards.
:)

jcoolG19
Member
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby jcoolG19 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:02 pm

Rockwell testing is not a hard thing to figure out. There are some basic things you have to remember, but it's a fairly easy process. The small anvil or pin is a pedestal anvil or small are anvil. Most knives give you enough room to get a good supporting surface. The Lionsteel knives, like the Shuffler, Dom, etc, are no exception. The Manix 2 is huge by comparison. The pedestal anvil is not for heavy parts but it has more than enough support for pocket knives, and fixed blades if the balance isn't way off.
Attachments
IMG_20190529_115208819.jpg
IMG_20190514_093845964.jpg
HRC_LS_Dom2.jpg
HRC_LS_Dom1.jpg

Doeswhateveraspidercan
Member
Posts: 2216
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:31 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:05 pm

Thanks for the info and the pictures
:)

jcoolG19
Member
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2018 5:41 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby jcoolG19 » Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:47 pm

Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:05 pm
Thanks for the info and the pictures
Your welcome. Any questions, please ask. I try to be as transparent as I can.

Your tag..
I have to agree with you. Sal and co. make this way more interesting! Nobody does what they do in so many varieties, and they do a pretty good job with them, too. Of the now 64 Spydercos I have tested, all have been pretty much on target. Considering the amount, and variety of steels from Spyderco, that is outstanding. Their 4V is amazingly consistent. Two Para 3s and 2 Manix 2 were all within a half point of each other.

User avatar
Pelagic
Member
Posts: 2427
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2018 5:49 pm
Location: East Coast/Nomadic

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Pelagic » Sun Jun 16, 2019 3:29 pm

jcoolG19 wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:47 pm
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:05 pm
Thanks for the info and the pictures
Your welcome. Any questions, please ask. I try to be as transparent as I can.

Your tag..
I have to agree with you. Sal and co. make this way more interesting! Nobody does what they do in so many varieties, and they do a pretty good job with them, too. Of the now 64 Spydercos I have tested, all have been pretty much on target. Considering the amount, and variety of steels from Spyderco, that is outstanding. Their 4V is amazingly consistent. Two Para 3s and 2 Manix 2 were all within a half point of each other.
Thank you for everything you do.
Pancake wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:20 pm
Are you a magician? :eek:
Nate wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 4:32 pm
You're the lone wolf of truth howling into the winds of ignorance
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm
You are a nobody got it?

Doeswhateveraspidercan
Member
Posts: 2216
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:31 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Doeswhateveraspidercan » Sun Jun 16, 2019 3:37 pm

jcoolG19 wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:47 pm
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:05 pm
Thanks for the info and the pictures
Your welcome. Any questions, please ask. I try to be as transparent as I can.

Your tag..
I have to agree with you. Sal and co. make this way more interesting! Nobody does what they do in so many varieties, and they do a pretty good job with them, too. Of the now 64 Spydercos I have tested, all have been pretty much on target. Considering the amount, and variety of steels from Spyderco, that is outstanding. Their 4V is amazingly consistent. Two Para 3s and 2 Manix 2 were all within a half point of each other.
Do you think it possible to test CTS-204P, M390 and 20CV all in the same model? I can’t get over the difference and similarities. M390 being identical in use to CTS 204P But 20CV coming out so much sharper and I am talking fresh from the factory blades not any errors introduced by sharpening.

Another good test would be the Native Chief versus let’s say a PM2 in S30V this Native Chief came in sharp, I dulled it and brought it back sharp so much easier that other S30V knives I have already mentioned like the safe 5 for example.

Thank you.

As for my tag it is straight up Joe Friday.. only the facts.
:)

User avatar
ZrowsN1s
Member
Posts: 4851
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2016 5:08 pm
Location: San Diego, California USA

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby ZrowsN1s » Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:03 pm

So back to the original topic.... soft M390.

Dave Warren of Tuya Knives is getting some positive attention today on Instagram. His company had been selling M390 advertised at 59-61. His company saw JcoolG19's HRC test numbers of their knives at 57 hrc and he called the factory in China and had them check. They confirmed that Kurts testing was indeed accurate and that their knives were testing lower than they thought. Perhaps a calibration error at the factory in China.

What's getting him the positive attention is his company's response. Not only did he apologize for the error, he is recalling all of the M390 blades and is going to have them re-treated. He also added that after listening to the community the new range for all M390 knives going forward will no longer be 59-61 but 61-62.

In reading the comments on IG, I can tell you that guy just got himself some new customers.
Carrying 3 knives is perfectly normal :D
-Matt

Baron Mind
Member
Posts: 243
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:18 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Baron Mind » Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:23 pm

ZrowsN1s wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:03 pm
So back to the original topic.... soft M390.

Dave Warren of Tuya Knives is getting some positive attention today on Instagram. His company had been selling M390 advertised at 59-61. His company saw JcoolG19's HRC test numbers of their knives at 57 hrc and he called the factory in China and had them check. They confirmed that Kurts testing was indeed accurate and that their knives were testing lower than they thought. Perhaps a calibration error at the factory in China.

What's getting him the positive attention is his company's response. Not only did he apologize for the error, he is recalling all of the M390 blades and is going to have them re-treated. He also added that after listening to the community the new range for all M390 knives going forward will no longer be 59-61 but 61-62.

In reading the comments on IG, I can tell you that guy just got himself some new customers.
That's fantastic!

Baron Mind
Member
Posts: 243
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2018 4:18 pm

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Baron Mind » Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:24 pm

jcoolG19 wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:47 pm
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:05 pm
Thanks for the info and the pictures
Your welcome. Any questions, please ask. I try to be as transparent as I can.

Your tag..
I have to agree with you. Sal and co. make this way more interesting! Nobody does what they do in so many varieties, and they do a pretty good job with them, too. Of the now 64 Spydercos I have tested, all have been pretty much on target. Considering the amount, and variety of steels from Spyderco, that is outstanding. Their 4V is amazingly consistent. Two Para 3s and 2 Manix 2 were all within a half point of each other.
We need more 4v from Spyderco!

User avatar
bearfacedkiller
Member
Posts: 9013
Joined: Sat Jan 04, 2014 1:22 pm
Location: hiding in the woods...

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby bearfacedkiller » Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:45 pm

I almost bought one of those Lionsteel traditionals. I want to believe that Lionsteel just botched that one. I really, really hope they didn’t target 51 HRC on purpose.
-Darby
sal wrote:Knife afi's are pretty far out, steel junky's more so, but "edge junky's" are just nuts. :p
SpyderEdgeForever wrote: Also, do you think a kangaroo would eat a bowl of spagetti with sauce if someone offered it to them?

User avatar
Pelagic
Member
Posts: 2427
Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2018 5:49 pm
Location: East Coast/Nomadic

Re: M390 CTS-204P 20CV :) Hype Steel

Postby Pelagic » Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:03 pm

ZrowsN1s wrote:
Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:03 pm
So back to the original topic.... soft M390.

Dave Warren of Tuya Knives is getting some positive attention today on Instagram. His company had been selling M390 advertised at 59-61. His company saw JcoolG19's HRC test numbers of their knives at 57 hrc and he called the factory in China and had them check. They confirmed that Kurts testing was indeed accurate and that their knives were testing lower than they thought. Perhaps a calibration error at the factory in China.

What's getting him the positive attention is his company's response. Not only did he apologize for the error, he is recalling all of the M390 blades and is going to have them re-treated. He also added that after listening to the community the new range for all M390 knives going forward will no longer be 59-61 but 61-62.

In reading the comments on IG, I can tell you that guy just got himself some new customers.
Thanks for telling everyone about this.
Pancake wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:20 pm
Are you a magician? :eek:
Nate wrote:
Thu Apr 04, 2019 4:32 pm
You're the lone wolf of truth howling into the winds of ignorance
Doeswhateveraspidercan wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm
You are a nobody got it?


Return to “Spyderco General Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: archangel, Capt'n Boatsalot, jasonstone20, Majestic-12 [Bot], Modernflame, MSN [Bot], prndltech, sabb8pro2, sal, Spydergirl88, steelcity16, Tims and 27 guests