Para 2 as EDDC

[fivesense]

Quote post: fail. Thanks interface.

:D

[para-para-paramilitary]

Is the little Spyderco emblem on the blade a different color if the blade is black coating vs. DLC? In looking at various images online, I see different color emblems (one grey and the other white) and I assume it must be because of the different coating. Perhaps it's just different lighting in the images? Any ideas?

well mine is silver

[fivesense]

After a couple weeks, I've finally come around on the suggestion made by others here to check out the Yojimbo 2- I ordered it and it will arrive this week.

At first, I just couldn't wrap my mind around the shape and overall idea. But it seems pretty clear now; Yojimbo 2 is every bit as capable at EDC utility as it is EDC self-defense. I'm eager to handle it and put it into the rotation and I look forward to learning more about the Wharncliffe blade.

[Bloke]

But it seems pretty clear now; Yojimbo 2 is every bit as capable at EDC utility as it is EDC self-defense. I'm eager to handle it and put it into the rotation and I look forward to learning more about the Wharncliffe blade.

Just don't go picking any fights to check out its self defence capabilities! :p

[ZrowsN1s]

The Yojimbo was a paradigm shift for me. There is my taste in knives before owning the Yojimbo, and my taste in knives after. Much like you, I was skeptical of the blade shape and of the thumb on spine technique at first, I think you're going to like it a lot. I just ordered a P'Kal myself :D It should be here tomorrow. I thought it was time to learn something new, I think that just like with modern mixed martial arts, the more techniques and styles you can draw from the better prepared you'll be to adapt to different situations. I have a feeling the P'Kal is going to be every bit as much of a training evolution for me as the Yojimbo.

[fivesense]

The Yojimbo was a paradigm shift for me. There is my taste in knives before owning the Yojimbo, and my taste in knives after. Much like you, I was skeptical of the blade shape and of the thumb on spine technique at first, I think you're going to like it a lot. I just ordered a P'Kal myself :D It should be here tomorrow. I thought it was time to learn something new, I think that just like with modern mixed martial arts, the more techniques and styles you can draw from the better prepared you'll be to adapt to different situations. I have a feeling the P'Kal is going to be every bit as much of a training evolution for me as the Yojimbo.

I think so too. For me, it is very much about trying something different- very different in fact. I was 100% "not for me" 2 weeks ago, but an honest evaluation of my needs and wants got me to "I'm trying this thing out." Maybe it will be a revelation maybe not, but it will be a great experiment. With good steel from a good company, it will be worth it either way.

What was the paradigm shift for you personally?

[ZrowsN1s]

The grip style. I went from being a reverse grip karambit guy, to REALLY liking the Filipino style. Also the ease of deployment without a wave, I can open the Yojimbo pretty much anyway you can hold it. The Compression lock, size of the handle, and shape, as well as the weight of the blade itself make this knife fly open. The Yojimbo upped my knife deployment game, where as before I relied on the "wave".

The next paradigm shift was Wharncliffe Blades. The Yojimbo was my first. I did not understand, but all has been made clear now. Wharncliffes are awesome, you'll see. :D

And last but not least was the training that went with the new knife. I had been studying Emerson combat systems techniques before I saw some of Mr. Janich's MBC videos. His video's are what convinced me the Filipino Grip/Silat style was worth trying out and adding to my knowledge base.

[fivesense]

The grip style. I went from being a reverse grip karambit guy, to REALLY liking the Filipino style. Also the ease of deployment without a wave, I can open the Yojimbo pretty much anyway you can hold it. The Compression lock, size of the handle, and shape, as well as the weight of the blade itself make this knife fly open. The Yojimbo upped my knife deployment game, where as before I relied on the "wave".

The other paradigm shift was Wharncliffe Blades. The Yojimbo was my first. I did not understand, but all has been made clear now. Wharncliffes are awesome, you'll see. :D

How do you find the tip of the Yojimbo 2? Many reviews say it's "fragile" or "weak," but I also read how it's good for stab and jab (which I assume means flesh).

[ZrowsN1s]

Have you seen the evolution of the Yojimbo 2 vid?
https://youtu.be/1ddOdONCCqU

...
The tip IS thin and you do have to be careful, but it stabs VERY well.

[fivesense]

Have you seen the evolution of the Yojimbo 2 vid?
https://youtu.be/1ddOdONCCqU

...
The tip IS thin and you do have to be careful, but it stabs VERY well.

Not yet but will shortly! Thanks!

[BLUETYPEII]

you can kill someone by using a knife, but you can't stop someone by using a knife.

Sorry, this does not compute. And fencing has nothing to do with using a knife for SD.

Let’s explain it this way... When you get into a fight or are attacked ect... your body goes into what is called “fight or flight” ( look it up anybody serious about self-defense should know about the “fight or flight” response. ) the problem with using a knife for SD is that your assailant ( and you for that matter ) is experiencing an extreme adrenaline rush into their bloodstream, which will cause most pain to be completely ignored until the level of adrenaline in the bloodstream has dropped.

When you use a gun for SD It has the added benefit of that loud bang when it’s fired ( if not silenced ) and you’re assailant will hear this and if you hit them they will probably feel the impact... They may not feel pain for a second but they’ll know they’ve been hit.

I’ve heard many stories of people being mortally wounded and not even realizing it until moments after.

FYI I carry a semi auto pistol with a 15 round magazine, Spyderco Caribbean and a Spyderco Waterway for SD.

I think the Spyderco Caribbean is an excellent choice for self-defense especially if corrosion resistance is a factor for you.

Remember IF running away is an option it is always the best option, live to fight another day.

[pinepig2]

A few years ago I had to adjust my thinking on the concept of a knife for self defense (in this case as a secondary weapon for uniformed law enforcement) after a training experience. We were using red-handled trainer Spyderco folders. I'd been carrying Spyderco since 1994 and figured I had pleny of muscle memory in deploying them to be able to accomplish it under stress. However, when attacked in the mat room by a redman-suited assailant I was not able to get the knife deployed. This was a moderate-stress scenario with the attacker operating at don't-injure-the-LEO force level. Real life would be much. much worse.

Morever, not a single officer in the class of about 12 was able to able to get the folding knife deployed. The instructor then handed out some fixed blade trainers and it was a completley different result. Lesson: If you're going to depend on a knife for self-defense in any capacity, if you don't make it a fixed blade you are deluding yourself.

[youmakemehole]

A few years ago I had to adjust my thinking on the concept of a knife for self defense (in this case as a secondary weapon for uniformed law enforcement) after a training experience. We were using red-handled trainer Spyderco folders. I'd been carrying Spyderco since 1994 and figured I had pleny of muscle memory in deploying them to be able to accomplish it under stress. However, when attacked in the mat room by a redman-suited assailant I was not able to get the knife deployed. This was a moderate-stress scenario with the attacker operating at don't-injure-the-LEO force level. Real life would be much. much worse.

Morever, not a single officer in the class of about 12 was able to able to get the folding knife deployed. The instructor then handed out some fixed blade trainers and it was a completley different result. Lesson: If you're going to depend on a knife for self-defense in any capacity, if you don't make it a fixed blade you are deluding yourself.

andddd... /endthread :rolleyes:

Truth is that reality is more often than not way less glamorous and idealistic than most people make it out to be in their heads. People know this fact but yet still hold on to certain unrealistic expectations when it comes to certain things. I am probably not an exception here either, just to be real, for perhaps other subjects. Anyways though, if you want to carry something whose main purpose is for self defense, you would not carry a folder. If you carry a folder for mainly other reasons, such as cutting stuff(not people), and would like to imagine the most ideal scenarios where the folder saves you in a CQC situation, that is totally fair. However if one wants to go as far as asking people to coddle a fantasy where a folder becomes the most ideal SD knife, there could be a little pushback, mainly for the sake of realism and most importantly the sake of your safety and life.

Continuing on being realistic - there have been 3 times in my life I have been in danger of being mugged. Every one of those situations could have been easily avoided had I been more mindful and risk averse. Every one of those situations I have also been able to escape the situation and preserve my safety by running or driving away. Compared with the average person, I definitely do occasionally surround myself more often with higher risk situations/areas and higher risk individuals just due to certain things I chose to involve myself in. So given that, and the metrics I have as far as dangerous SD warranting situations go, it really should be an extremely slim chance anyone would find themselves in a situation where they are forced to defend with their knife. In the off chance that something like this does occur, I find the real life scenarios tend to involve the knife/weapon wielder to have to willingly put themselves in a high risk situation when they fully had the option not to, and to also chose not to flee the situation when danger started to present itself. Given such a small chance of an inevitable SD scenario unfolding for the average person, I find all discussion in regards to the topic somewhat silly and unpractical to say the least, just like it would seem odd if I started asking people on how best to prepare for being struck by lightning when I leave the house each day.

[ZrowsN1s]

.... Lesson: If you're going to depend on a knife for self-defense in any capacity, if you don't make it a fixed blade you are deluding yourself.

You have to Practice, but you can learn to draw a folder quickly under stress. And not everyone lives where they can carry a fixed blade or gun. Sometimes you have to work with what you got.

Am I likely to have to defend myself with a pocket knife? Probably not, but it's nice to know I can and better to be prepared. Running, avoidance, is always the best strategy, when that's an option.

[pinepig2]

.... Lesson: If you're going to depend on a knife for self-defense in any capacity, if you don't make it a fixed blade you are deluding yourself.

You have to Practice, but you can learn to draw a folder quickly under stress. And not everyone lives where they can carry a fixed blade or gun. Sometimes you have to work with what you got.

Well I had thousands of practice reps over two decades carrying Spyderco's and still couldn't make it happen. I imagine there are people out there in the world that could do better, if they train in knife combat daily. But then you wouldn't catch those guys carrying folding knives either. It's more than the stress (my scenario was not a high-stress event, being training), it's the realities of what fine motor movements are even possible when getting tackled/pummeled/wrestled/etc. It used to be that police defensive tactics always supposed that the fight would take place standing up, until actual research was applied and it was realized that most fights go to the ground. So now we teach ground fighting as a fundamental skill.

Try drawing and deploying a folding knife when someone is mounted on you and beating you in the face. If you can do it then I'll be the first to applaud you. I doubt you'd even be able to get the knife out of your pocket, however.

[pinepig2]

Darn it, wrong button!

[ZrowsN1s]

.... Lesson: If you're going to depend on a knife for self-defense in any capacity, if you don't make it a fixed blade you are deluding yourself.

You have to Practice, but you can learn to draw a folder quickly under stress. And not everyone lives where they can carry a fixed blade or gun. Sometimes you have to work with what you got.

Well I had thousands of practice reps over two decades carrying Spyderco's and still couldn't make it happen. I imagine there are people out there in the world that could do better, if they train in knife combat daily. But then you wouldn't catch those guys carrying folding knives either. It's more than the stress (my scenario was not a high-stress event, being training), it's the realities of what fine motor movements are even possible when getting tackled/pummeled/wrestled/etc. It used to be that police defensive tactics always supposed that the fight would take place standing up, until actual research was applied and it was realized that most fights go to the ground. So now we teach ground fighting as a fundamental skill.

Try drawing and deploying a folding knife when someone is mounted on you and beating you in the face. If you can do it then I'll be the first to applaud you. I doubt you'd even be able to get the knife out of your pocket, however.

I appreciate that a fixed blade is easier to draw, but as I said it's not an option for me and many others. I work with what I've got. Ideally I'd carry a gun if the city I lived in allowed such things.

As for being mounted and punched in the face my priority wouldn't be drawing any kind of weapon, my priority would be to stop getting punched in the face and to get a better position.

I'm no expert and you sound like you've had a lot of experience, but I could refer you to some more experienced people than myself who are inclined to believe that a proper defense can be mounted with a folding knife.

The Spyderco Yojimbo and P'kal were designed by two of them, Michael Janich and Craig Douglas. The P'kal features the Emerson wave as do a few other Spyderco models, Ernest Emerson is another.

Before you call the idea of using a folder for defense delusional, I would humbly suggest you check out their work, instruction, and bona fides.
http://shivworks.com/edged-weapon-overview/
https://www.staysafemedia.com/
https://emersonknives.com/training-cent ... t-systems/

[youmakemehole]

I appreciate that a fixed blade is easier to draw, but as I said it's not an option for me and many others. I work with what I've got. Ideally I'd carry a gun if the city I lived in allowed such things.

As for being mounted and punched in the face my priority wouldn't be drawing any kind of weapon, my priority would be to stop getting punched in the face and to get a better position.

I'm no expert and you sound like you've had a lot of experience, but I could refer you to some more experienced people than myself who are inclined to believe that a proper defense can be mounted with a folding knife.

The Spyderco Yojimbo and P'kal were designed by two of them, Michael Janich and Craig Douglas. The P'kal features the Emerson wave as do a few other Spyderco models, Ernest Emerson is another.

Before you call the idea of using a folder for defense delusional, I would humbly suggest you check out their work, instruction, and bona fides.
http://shivworks.com/edged-weapon-overview/
https://www.staysafemedia.com/
https://emersonknives.com/training-cent ... t-systems/

I might not call it delusional, but it is at the very least very impractical. You are so much better off if you learn martial arts SD techniques that do not involve a weapon, or carry mace or a taser if SD is your priority here. I'm fairly confident that those so called "experts" can probably count with one hand the number of times they have had no choice but to physically defend themselves in a normal, public setting, let alone situations where they had to use a knife or weapon to defend. I'm not trying to cast any doubt on the effectiveness of the techniques themselves, but realistically most of these "experts" are just stacking their bankrolls by preying on the imagination/fears of of people who think that spending any amount of time learning how to disable/incapacitate some fantasy "bad guy" during highly improbable situations counts as a practical and efficient way to add value to their lives. Some people, especially men, also have some inexorable need to be as bad-*** as possible, and nothing speaks louder to these people than another person who comes along and says 'hey, give me $xx and buy this equipment $xx and I will make you the most bad-*** person ever by teaching you how to be physically superior in violent exchanges against other humans'. People who fall for this not only make themselves victim to their most primal and animalistic instincts, they also waste a lot of time and money as well. All good if martial arts is a hobby, but if your primary motive is to prepare for some sort of violent confrontation, you're probably doing it wrong. Better off honing your social acumen and understanding of psychology so you can use intelligence and words to shut down a potential threat, as skills such as these would be applicable and useful to all areas of your life, as opposed to violence, where unless you are a soldier or mercenary, would have zero relevance for bettering your day to day self. If you must, go spend $10 and an hour or so during your weekend to buy a can of mace or a taser. Knives are lethal weapons, and the liabilities as well as physical risks you take if you choose to use it on another human can be highly variable and severe, not to mention regrettable.

[Bloke]

carry something whose main purpose is for self defense

[ZrowsN1s]

...... You are so much better off if you learn martial arts SD techniques that do not involve a weapon,
....... Some people, especially men, also have some inexorable need to be as bad-*** as possible,
........ People who fall for this not only make themselves victim to their most primal and animalistic instincts, they also waste a lot of time and money as well.
....Better off honing your social acumen and understanding of psychology so you can use intelligence and words to shut down a potential threat, as skills such as these would be applicable and useful to all areas of your life, as opposed to violence,
....If you must, go spend $10 and an hour or so during your weekend to buy a can of mace or a taser. Knives are lethal weapons, and the liabilities as well as physical risks you take if you choose to use it on another human can be highly variable and severe, not to mention regrettable.

Where to even begin to answer that? You seem to have some personal hang ups that you need to sort out on your own, or not. I would only again encourage you to check out the people I listed in depth. You'll find a surprising number of your issues addressed. From learning avoidance and empty handed skills, to non-lethality with a knife.

Check out the instructors backrounds, who their students are, and decide then if they are just padding their pockets by selling fantasy.

I won't be so rude as to call it delusional but when I think about what's likely to save you when someone really wants to do you or your family harm and you are attacked violently, words and peper spray don't really cut it.

http://shivworks.com/edged-weapon-overview/
https://www.staysafemedia.com/
https://emersonknives.com/training-cent ... t-systems/