Folding knife for food or use in restaurants

[Vamais]

On the hiking trail or at a restaurant is one thing. But the resistance to using the right tool for the job in the house is just weird. Knife nerds espouse right tool for the job when it comes to chopping, fileting fish, hunting game and slicing cardboard, but for some reason that logic gets discarded when it comes to culinary purposes.

For me, the "right tool for the job" is very much influenced by logistics and other external factors. For example, if using the knife in my pocket for a given food prep task takes five seconds longer than doing the same task with a dedicated kitchen knife, but retrieving, cleaning, and returning said kitchen knife will take me 10 seconds longer than doing the same with my pocket knife, then the knife in my pocket is the right tool for the job.

My intent as a "Knife nerd" is not to find the knife that performs the best at each specific task and then only use that knife for that task. My quest has been to find the knife or combination of knives that will nicely handle everything I am likely to encounter, knives that I can pretty much always expect to have with me. Consequently, I like to test how well my EDC performs at food prep, and I like to build familiarity with using my knives that way.

I understand that you are a professional chef (please correct me if I am mistaken). I am not, and the amount of food prep cutting I need to do at any one time is pretty minimal. If I was cooking in larger quantities, then maybe I would find myself using actual culinary knives more.

As for bringing a sharp food prep knife to another person's house, it is much easier for me to bring a folder. I don't drive, and therefore I don't have a big metal box in which I can shunt around a bunch of specialized tools. I have to be pretty selective of what I carry with me, and what I do carry often needs to be small, versatile, useful, and light. I find a lot of enjoyment in selecting equipment and putting together systems that meet those criteria.

[Danke]

If a folding knife can't cut food well, it's probably not a very good knife. Serrations do keep the knife sharp after many uses, which is why they are often seen in restaurants, but if you know how to keep your knife sharp, they aren't necessary.

OK Part 1) Find better restaurants where they know how to cook and plate food. I'm struggling with the picture of a place just tossing a half cut up pizza on the table.

It's pretty common in Italy to be served a small Neapolitan pie uncut, to be eaten with a knife and fork.

So a soft thin crust, kinda like toast.

[Coastal]

Interesting, informative and funny thread!

[TkoK83Spy]

On the hiking trail or at a restaurant is one thing. But the resistance to using the right tool for the job in the house is just weird. Knife nerds espouse right tool for the job when it comes to chopping, fileting fish, hunting game and slicing cardboard, but for some reason that logic gets discarded when it comes to culinary purposes.

For me, the "right tool for the job" is very much influenced by logistics and other external factors. For example, if using the knife in my pocket for a given food prep task takes five seconds longer than doing the same task with a dedicated kitchen knife, but retrieving, cleaning, and returning said kitchen knife will take me 10 seconds longer than doing the same with my pocket knife, then the knife in my pocket is the right tool for the job.

My intent as a "Knife nerd" is not to find the knife that performs the best at each specific task and then only use that knife for that task. My quest has been to find the knife or combination of knives that will nicely handle everything I am likely to encounter, knives that I can pretty much always expect to have with me. Consequently, I like to test how well my EDC performs at food prep, and I like to build familiarity with using my knives that way.

I understand that you are a professional chef (please correct me if I am mistaken). I am not, and the amount of food prep cutting I need to do at any one time is pretty minimal. If I was cooking in larger quantities, then maybe I would find myself using actual culinary knives more.

As for bringing a sharp food prep knife to another person's house, it is much easier for me to bring a folder. I don't drive, and therefore I don't have a big metal box in which I can shunt around a bunch of specialized tools. I have to be pretty selective of what I carry with me, and what I do carry often needs to be small, versatile, useful, and light. I find a lot of enjoyment in selecting equipment and putting together systems that meet those criteria.

I'm still not understanding how spending under $30 on a Z Cut, that's made for this kind of stuff and doesn't require a bunch of additional space in order to bring with you somewhere, or use in the actual kitchen, is an issue? Like Vivi said earlier, this is a strange place sometimes. People are over the top nuts about knives, but refuse to enjoy knives that are MADE FOR THE JOB when they are available and A LOT cheaper than a folder. Mind blowing the lack of culinary interest that's around here.

[vivi]

knife nerd wants to bush craft, they buy a mora.

knife nerd wants to chop chop, they buy an axe or a becker 9"

knife nerd wants to fish, they buy a filet knife

knife nerd wants to break down cardboard, they buy a box cutter

knife nerd wants to prep food, they use a pocket knife?

I don't get it. Paring knives work better and are cheaper and easier to clean.

to each their own I guess. I find purpose built tools more efficient and pleasurable to use.

Like I said if I'm just cutting up an apple, sure I might use a Military or something. But for actually prepping a meal for 2 or more, give me something with knuckle clearance and good geometry.

[Danke]

I'm complicated

[vivi]

At home I use my MagnaCut mule as my dedicated steak or dinner knife in general, if I'm eating and it needs cut, that's what I use. It's probably the longest running test I've ever done on a single knife, I've used it pretty much everyday since they came out.

For restaurants we typically don't eat out much and when we do it's usually not places that need a knife. We stopped going to steak houses and started making our own steaks at home. Once I really looked at the difference in cost I think I've only stepped foot in a steak house one time in the last year and I was on a business trip. But if I did feel the need and if I had to pick a knife based on this criteria, I'd probably go with a SE MagnaCut Chief Salt.

Reasons being, it's easy to clean and even disassemble if necessary, but I think having a finger choil for food use with a folder has an advantage because it limits how close you can get the pivot to the food, the same could be said about a ricasso so you'd do well with a Pacific too. Serrations because ceramic plates aren't kind to knife edges and steak houses use serrations for the same reason, and MagnaCut because it'll resist corrosion and will hold up to the plate contact.

I think a Police 4 would also excel here but you'd need to be more mindful of cleaning it before putting it away. Good argument here for a Police 4 Salt

cooking a steak perfectly is a skill any home cook can learn, and you can make an 8oz filet + asparagus + mash for $15 a head. The mark up on steaks is absurd considering how easy they are to cook. Same meal is $50+ per person before tip eating out.

We have a local spot that sells grass fed NY Strips for under $10 a piece. Steak night for a family of four for less than $50 isn't a hard ask where I live.

it's a little more involved but me and my kid also make our own pizza dough. I priced it out once and a 16" pepperoni pizza is something like $3 to make at home.

[Evil D]

I find purpose built tools more efficient and pleasurable to use.

Is anyone actually disagreeing with this though? I personally don't use a pocket knife for food prep because it works better than a kitchen knife, I use it just to use the pocket knife in different situations, cutting different materials. I enjoy nice kitchen knives too.


Are you thinking about this in like, all or none terms? Like guys only ever use pocket knives for their food? I screw around when I get a new knife just to see how it cuts a carrot or a potato and that's about it, I'm not making 5 course meals for a family of 8 or using it exclusively in place of kitchen knives (except for my MagnaCut mule for eating). I would agree that would be kinda weird.

[gdwtvb]

I buy the knives, not my wife.
I sharpen the knives, not my wife.
I carry the knives, not my wife.

When out to dinner often my wife will ask me teasingly if I have a sharp knife she can use.

I always do, and always provide it for her.

I've never worried about dulling a knife on ceramic plates and never found more than minimal touch ups are required anyways. With a sharp knife, very little presure is required.

We share and use whatever I happen to be carrying. A few she has remarked she didn't like as much, so if we're planning on eating out I generally grab the Chapparal, which she likes. (Ti stealth model)

I'm usually pretty oblivious to anyone else, never worried if anyone sees what I do, and I don't watch other people eat either.

Grizz

[Evil D]

it's a little more involved but me and my kid also make our own pizza dough. I priced it out once and a 16" pepperoni pizza is something like $3 to make at home.

We take the lazier way out and make pizzadillas with large wraps. Not quite the same as a real pizza but dang good.

[vivi]

it's a little more involved but me and my kid also make our own pizza dough. I priced it out once and a 16" pepperoni pizza is something like $3 to make at home.

We take the lazier way out and make pizzadillas with large wraps. Not quite the same as a real pizza but dang good.

that can work. i've also had some lazy nights where I took a $1 french bread loaf from the local walmart supercenter and cut it in half to use as my base.

[vivi]

I find purpose built tools more efficient and pleasurable to use.

Is anyone actually disagreeing with this though? I personally don't use a pocket knife for food prep because it works better than a kitchen knife, I use it just to use the pocket knife in different situations, cutting different materials. I enjoy nice kitchen knives too.


Are you thinking about this in like, all or none terms? Like guys only ever use pocket knives for their food? I screw around when I get a new knife just to see how it cuts a carrot or a potato and that's about it, I'm not making 5 course meals for a family of 8 or using it exclusively in place of kitchen knives (except for my MagnaCut mule for eating). I would agree that would be kinda weird.

I'm just commenting on a general sentiment I've noticed on knife forums, not this thread in particular. It's a trend I've seen many times on here, BF, reddit and elsewhere, and as a chef / knife nerd I think it's funny.

Like I said, most knife nerds will chop with an axe and bushcraft with a Mora, but an awfully large number of them use very inefficient designs for culinary applications.

I understand and acknowledge the difference between using a delica as your every day food prep knife and just messing around to see how a certain knifes geometry works for a culinary task. But a lot of folks use folders, mules, and other inefficient designs as their dedicated food prep knives. This and other threads here are a few of many examples I've come across.

I understand not everyone is a chef or even cooks at home often. But I would never use a Spyderco Police as a dedicated chopper, or a Victorinox Classic as a dedicated car emergency knife / seatbelt cutter, or a 4 Max as a dedicated bush crafter.

I just find it fascinating how many times in these circles I've heard the mantra "right tool for the job" when it comes to say, batoning kindling with a fixed blade instead of an axe, but how many of those same people don't apply the same thinking to culinary cutlery.

Even if I'm just juilienne slicing a single onion I grab something with knuckle clearance. I find pleasure in using a finely tuned kitchen knife for kitchen work. Even the folders with the best geometry don't compare to a lowly Kiwi or nice japanese hand forged gyuto.

[Evil D]

I find purpose built tools more efficient and pleasurable to use.

Is anyone actually disagreeing with this though? I personally don't use a pocket knife for food prep because it works better than a kitchen knife, I use it just to use the pocket knife in different situations, cutting different materials. I enjoy nice kitchen knives too.


Are you thinking about this in like, all or none terms? Like guys only ever use pocket knives for their food? I screw around when I get a new knife just to see how it cuts a carrot or a potato and that's about it, I'm not making 5 course meals for a family of 8 or using it exclusively in place of kitchen knives (except for my MagnaCut mule for eating). I would agree that would be kinda weird.

I'm just commenting on a general sentiment I've noticed on knife forums, not this thread in particular. It's a trend I've seen many times on here, BF, reddit and elsewhere, and as a chef / knife nerd I think it's funny.

Like I said, most knife nerds will chop with an axe and bushcraft with a Mora, but an awfully large number of them use very inefficient designs for culinary applications.

I understand and acknowledge the difference between using a delica as your every day food prep knife and just messing around to see how a certain knifes geometry works for a culinary task. But a lot of folks use folders, mules, and other inefficient designs as their dedicated food prep knives. This and other threads here are a few of many examples I've come across.

I understand not everyone is a chef or even cooks at home often. But I would never use a Spyderco Police as a dedicated chopper, or a Victorinox Classic as a dedicated car emergency knife / seatbelt cutter, or a 4 Max as a dedicated bush crafter.

I just find it fascinating how many times in these circles I've heard the mantra "right tool for the job" when it comes to say, batoning kindling with a fixed blade instead of an axe, but how many of those same people don't apply the same thinking to culinary cutlery.

Even if I'm just juilienne slicing a single onion I grab something with knuckle clearance. I find pleasure in using a finely tuned kitchen knife for kitchen work. Even the folders with the best geometry don't compare to a lowly Kiwi or nice japanese hand forged gyuto.

Ya know what's funny, my wife is also a chef, and she has a couple chef friends that I've hung out with, and I'm telling you none of them give a crap about their knives. If they're sharp then great, if not then get it sharp and move on. One of them was even a chef in a Michelin star kitchen. Seems to me that butchers are far more into their knives than chefs (though I guess my sample size is only about 8 or so people).

[vivi]

I find purpose built tools more efficient and pleasurable to use.

Is anyone actually disagreeing with this though? I personally don't use a pocket knife for food prep because it works better than a kitchen knife, I use it just to use the pocket knife in different situations, cutting different materials. I enjoy nice kitchen knives too.


Are you thinking about this in like, all or none terms? Like guys only ever use pocket knives for their food? I screw around when I get a new knife just to see how it cuts a carrot or a potato and that's about it, I'm not making 5 course meals for a family of 8 or using it exclusively in place of kitchen knives (except for my MagnaCut mule for eating). I would agree that would be kinda weird.

I'm just commenting on a general sentiment I've noticed on knife forums, not this thread in particular. It's a trend I've seen many times on here, BF, reddit and elsewhere, and as a chef / knife nerd I think it's funny.

Like I said, most knife nerds will chop with an axe and bushcraft with a Mora, but an awfully large number of them use very inefficient designs for culinary applications.

I understand and acknowledge the difference between using a delica as your every day food prep knife and just messing around to see how a certain knifes geometry works for a culinary task. But a lot of folks use folders, mules, and other inefficient designs as their dedicated food prep knives. This and other threads here are a few of many examples I've come across.

I understand not everyone is a chef or even cooks at home often. But I would never use a Spyderco Police as a dedicated chopper, or a Victorinox Classic as a dedicated car emergency knife / seatbelt cutter, or a 4 Max as a dedicated bush crafter.

I just find it fascinating how many times in these circles I've heard the mantra "right tool for the job" when it comes to say, batoning kindling with a fixed blade instead of an axe, but how many of those same people don't apply the same thinking to culinary cutlery.

Even if I'm just juilienne slicing a single onion I grab something with knuckle clearance. I find pleasure in using a finely tuned kitchen knife for kitchen work. Even the folders with the best geometry don't compare to a lowly Kiwi or nice japanese hand forged gyuto.

Ya know what's funny, my wife is also a chef, and she has a couple chef friends that I've hung out with, and I'm telling you none of them give a crap about their knives. If they're sharp then great, if not then get it sharp and move on. One of them was even a chef in a Michelin star kitchen. Seems to me that butchers are far more into their knives than chefs (though I guess my sample size is only about 8 or so people).

That's been my experience too, lol.

In fact the first chef I worked under, Jerry Risner, someone who trained in Italy and France at starred restaurants under prestigious chefs with decades of experience.....he didn't even know serrated knives could be sharpened. Blew his mind first time I brought in my sharpmaker.

Most chefs don't know dick about knives. Some think only bolstered knives are any good. Most have terrible honing rod technique and think going hard and fast and flashy is the way to do it. Many of them have way better knife skills than me, but since my teens I have yet to step foot into a kitchen where anyone knew half as much about sharpening as me.

I did work at a steak house a few years back where one of the other chefs carried a fine spyderco ceramic stone. That made my day when I found that out, as I keep one in my knife roll. I had to teach him it should be white and not black though! He had never cleaned it. Ever! I bought him a bottle of bar keepers friend and taught him how to maintain it.

Most chefs just use cozzini bros house knives, or have a cheap roll with a western chefs, a bread knife, paring knife and maybe some boning knives if they're heavy on meat prep.

You'd think there'd be more knife nerds in the biz but they're more concerned with hooking up with FoH than cutlery.

Even though I spend more time in an office than prepping these days since I'm more into management than line service, I carry a chef knife in my EDC backpack. Too much of a connoisseur of cut to use a cozzini I can run across my arm without causing any harm. I miss being able to justify carrying a full knife roll of gyutos and petties but those days passed me by years ago.

[Wartstein]

...
My intent as a "Knife nerd" is not to find the knife that performs the best at each specific task and then only use that knife for that task. My quest has been to find the knife or combination of knives that will nicely handle everything I am likely to encounter, knives that I can pretty much always expect to have with me. Consequently, I like to test how well my EDC performs at food prep, and I like to build familiarity with using my knives that way.

knife nerd wants to bush craft, they buy a mora.

knife nerd wants to chop chop, they buy an axe or a becker 9"

knife nerd wants to fish, they buy a filet knife

knife nerd wants to break down cardboard, they buy a box cutter

knife nerd wants to prep food, they use a pocket knife?

I guess I am a "knife nerd", and more of the kind Vamais is.

Sure, if planning to cook a more complicated meal at home (and especially if one has the skills and high standards of a trained chef!) dedicated kitchen knives are a sensible choice.

But generally what I enjoy in EDC folders exactly IS to find and carry that "Jack of all (many) trades, master of none" model, the simplicity of that concept, the growing familiarity of that one tool to me, the "I don´t have to think", cause in my pocket is a knife anyway that will do most things decently (also in a restaurant!)

There are just tasks a folding knife CAN be decent in and that are in the range of it was intended for, and there are such tasks that are beyond those limits (like real chopping)

Food prep to me definitely IS in the realm of EDC folder tasks, and at least when it comes to Spyderco, main figures of this brand think so too: I could quote Sal like five or six times saying that he likes to carry longer folders (also) cause they work better for food prep and/or for use in restaurants, as well as Michael Janich (since I quoted Sal already in this thread, here is one of Mr. Janich viewtopic.php?p=1619356#p1619356)
I am saying this just to show that most likely (even) the designers of at least Spyderco folders DO think of food prep too.

I really find enjoyment in how well especially serrated, longer bladed Spyderco folders work in a variety of tasks, despite if I see each task individually there´d probably ALWAYS be a better tool for the job (scissors, scrapers, box cutters, kitchen knives, tweezers, needles, fixed blade, and so on),

And for MY kind of food prep an Endura or Stretch XL just work fine, even in my own kitchen, and I do use such knives even there quite often. Just cause it is so nice to experience how their familiar ergos and performance work as well in some bushcraft tasks (where sure a Mora would be better) as well as in food prep tasks (where sure a dedicated kitchen knife would be better).

If we started to rule out every cutting task where another more dedicated tool would work better for EDC folders, for me that would leave the question: Why then even bother with refined ergos or do it all cutting geometry in EDC folders?.

[shunsui]

When I was EDC Enduras, I had a HAP40 Endura that I had just reprofiled to 30 degrees with the diamond rods on my sharpmaker. I was surprised at how sharp an edge it took. My friend and I took an old lady who lives on our street out for a steak dinner. The steak was a little tough and the provided steak knives were worthless. The old lady was struggling to cut her steak. I gave her my Endura and she proceeded to easily cut her steak holding the knife with just two fingers. She was a nice Italian girl of about 98 years. Put a nice patina on the HAP40 too. The waitress almost ran off with my Endura, but the burnt orange handle caught her attention, and she said it was a different looking steak knife than she was used to.

[Wartstein]

When I was EDC Enduras, I had a HAP40 Endura that I had just reprofiled to 30 degrees with the diamond rods on my sharpmaker. I was surprised at how sharp an edge it took. My friend and I took an old lady who lives on our street out for a steak dinner. The steak was a little tough and the provided steak knives were worthless. The old lady was struggling to cut her steak. I gave her my Endura and she proceeded to easily cut her steak holding the knife with just two fingers. She was a nice Italian girl of about 98 years. Put a nice patina on the HAP40 too. The waitress almost ran off with my Endura, but the burnt orange handle caught her attention, and she said it was a different looking steak knife than she was used to.

Touching on my post/point above: I have and love the HAP40 Endura myself - and isn´t it just a delight how easily and well that great do it all folder in ones pocket can also slip into the role as a food cutter? Imo just one of the tasks it was meant and to a certain degree optimized for for an universally usable EDC folder.

[PMBohol]

I find purpose built tools more efficient and pleasurable to use.

Is anyone actually disagreeing with this though? I personally don't use a pocket knife for food prep because it works better than a kitchen knife, I use it just to use the pocket knife in different situations, cutting different materials. I enjoy nice kitchen knives too.


Are you thinking about this in like, all or none terms? Like guys only ever use pocket knives for their food? I screw around when I get a new knife just to see how it cuts a carrot or a potato and that's about it, I'm not making 5 course meals for a family of 8 or using it exclusively in place of kitchen knives (except for my MagnaCut mule for eating). I would agree that would be kinda weird.

Using a folder for food prep or for eating means that you have to clean it. I don’t see the practicality here. Spyderco makes a line of culinary knives that would fit the purpose.

[shunsui]

When I was EDC Enduras, I had a HAP40 Endura that I had just reprofiled to 30 degrees with the diamond rods on my sharpmaker. I was surprised at how sharp an edge it took. My friend and I took an old lady who lives on our street out for a steak dinner. The steak was a little tough and the provided steak knives were worthless. The old lady was struggling to cut her steak. I gave her my Endura and she proceeded to easily cut her steak holding the knife with just two fingers. She was a nice Italian girl of about 98 years. Put a nice patina on the HAP40 too. The waitress almost ran off with my Endura, but the burnt orange handle caught her attention, and she said it was a different looking steak knife than she was used to.

Touching on my post/point above: I have and love the HAP40 Endura myself - and isn´t it just a delight how easily and well that great do it all folder in ones pocket can also slip into the role as a food cutter? Imo just one of the tasks it was meant and to a certain degree optimized for for an universally usable EDC folder.

You're preaching to the choir.

[Wartstein]

Using a folder for food prep or for eating means that you have to clean it. I don’t see the practicality here. Spyderco makes a line of culinary knives that would fit the purpose.

Like you´d have to clean any other knife- ? So I don´t see how particularly that is much of an disadvantage? And it is also not much of a hazzle. With many types of food I wipe off the blade somewhen later, no problems there, and almost all of the times a simple napkin or sheet of paper towel does the job very fast.

(NOT disputing though that Spyderco knives meant for food prep and just that are of course better in that particular capacity!
But, as said: I think in many EDC folder tasks there actually will be a more specialized tool that can do the particular task at hand better. It is exactly the point of an EDC folder to do many things well, with the drawback that almost none perfectly).