Ah, my sig line brought up again. This time my avatar too! Great detective work, I'm definitely a troll looking for insider info for flipping.The Deacon wrote:C'mon David, between his avatar and his sig line, have you ever really doubted that?
Buy Sprints, then Flip Them at a Profit?
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Strong-Dog
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"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill
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Strong-Dog
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Can anyone actually tell me why flippers are "lower than pond scum" or "lowlifes"? Or do you guys just throw around insults without being able to back them up?bdblue wrote:We talk about flippers a lot, but always good to have another chance to say that flippers are lower than pond scum.
Original question asked if this happens a lot... I recall when the first run of green PM2's started shipping, people would get the box in the mail, put up a sales ad, put a new label on the box and mail it back out, for $150 profit. There are a lot of people that are true knife enthusiasts and don't like flippers, but there are a lot of people on the forums that are not knife enthusiasts but are just out to make a buck so anytime you see someone defend flipping you know who they are.
Two year old thread, should we take a poll about zombie knife flippers?
You caught me, I'm most definitely a flipper because I have a very simple understanding of free market economics that dictates a flipper is a part of a market driven by voluntary exchange, and not lower than pond scum.
"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill
It's already been discussed ad nauseam. Go search some more necro threads about it and complete it with a spirited response. Its obviously bothering you. How many green paras did you get? If you dont feel bad and are confident about your position, why go out of your way to convince others by resurrecting a sensitive thread everyone else was willing to die off? Oh, youre not trying to convince others... So what do you have to prove? All you got is "you must be anti free market". What a load of crap. If you cant tell the difference then there is no point discussing it further.Strong-Dog wrote:Can anyone actually tell me why flippers are "lower than pond scum" or "lowlifes"? Or do you guys just throw around insults without being able to back them up?
You caught me, I'm most definitely a flipper because I have a very simple understanding of free market economics that dictates a flipper is a part of a market driven by voluntary exchange, and not lower than pond scum.
You got it all figured out strong dog, you should run for office.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory.
-Leonard Nimoy
-Leonard Nimoy
To strong dog
At risk of prolonging this:
...I don't think anyone is accusing you of being a flipper
...I also don't think flippers should be called lower than pond scum, because as you point out, they are free to accept the risk of buying these knives
...I agree that we can vote with our dollar
...However your free market arguments ignore a few things:
1. Spyderco is not responding to the market demand by raising prices (commensurate with demand) on limited runs, which allows flippers to profit
2. Spyderco offers the mule team at a discounted cost so that its customers can experiment with a steel and report back, not so that a "flipper" has extra room to profit off of that lower price
3. "Flippers" as we call them, often knowingly circumvent the 2 limit per person rule that the SFO places on things like the Mule team
You have to respect that the combination of the 3 points makes others feel that "flippers" are being dishonest at worst, and profiteering at best. Even if this profiteering is legal, and part of a free market, it places the program of the Mule team at risk. I know most of my comments pertain to the Mule team, but this is the program I see that's most at risk from "flippers." I think the only thing that Spyderco can really do to prevent "flipping" is to charge a larger profit margin on limited runs so that they don't sell out as quickly and brings price in line with demand. This will reduce the room flippers have to profit, but it will also make collecting more expensive for the rest of us.
TL;DR?
So, I say we vote with our dollar, ignore the flippers, and don't make topics such as this a distracting wedge issue in this otherwise civil forum.
I'd much rather be arguing with you about the merits of liners versus no liners, or what color to make the next PM2 sprint, or whether you like or dislike a 50/50 choil.
At risk of prolonging this:
...I don't think anyone is accusing you of being a flipper
...I also don't think flippers should be called lower than pond scum, because as you point out, they are free to accept the risk of buying these knives
...I agree that we can vote with our dollar
...However your free market arguments ignore a few things:
1. Spyderco is not responding to the market demand by raising prices (commensurate with demand) on limited runs, which allows flippers to profit
2. Spyderco offers the mule team at a discounted cost so that its customers can experiment with a steel and report back, not so that a "flipper" has extra room to profit off of that lower price
3. "Flippers" as we call them, often knowingly circumvent the 2 limit per person rule that the SFO places on things like the Mule team
You have to respect that the combination of the 3 points makes others feel that "flippers" are being dishonest at worst, and profiteering at best. Even if this profiteering is legal, and part of a free market, it places the program of the Mule team at risk. I know most of my comments pertain to the Mule team, but this is the program I see that's most at risk from "flippers." I think the only thing that Spyderco can really do to prevent "flipping" is to charge a larger profit margin on limited runs so that they don't sell out as quickly and brings price in line with demand. This will reduce the room flippers have to profit, but it will also make collecting more expensive for the rest of us.
TL;DR?
So, I say we vote with our dollar, ignore the flippers, and don't make topics such as this a distracting wedge issue in this otherwise civil forum.
I'd much rather be arguing with you about the merits of liners versus no liners, or what color to make the next PM2 sprint, or whether you like or dislike a 50/50 choil.
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Strong-Dog
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So in essence, no? You can't tell me a logical reason why flippers are lower than pond scum?FCM415 wrote:It's already been discussed ad nauseam. Go search some more necro threads about it and complete it with a spirited response. Its obviously bothering you. How many green paras did you get? If you dont feel bad and are confident about your position, why go out of your way to convince others by resurrecting a sensitive thread everyone else was willing to die off? Oh, youre not trying to convince others... So what do you have to prove? All you got is "you must be anti free market". What a load of crap. If you cant tell the difference then there is no point discussing it further.
You got it all figured out strong dog, you should run for office.
I got two green para this time around, as I missed out the first time. That ok with you?
Calling flippers lowlifes and lower than pond scum is bothering me? No, I just find it very illogical and a ridiculous thing to say.
Am I right or am I wrong when I say that when someone say they hate flippers and that they make things not fair, at some level (no matter how small) they must be anti free market? You either like the free market or you don't. You may think flippers are a negative aspect of the market, but they are a part of it and there is nothing wrong with that. Everyone has equal opportunity in a free market system, would you rather have the gov come in a prosecute people that flip knives?
You can't do anything about people that choose to buy knives and them sell them at higher prices. Where we differ is that while I accept that they are a part of the free market and that there is nothing wrong with that, people like you sit there and insult them for some reason devoid of logic.
People like yourself must really hate pawn shops, huh?
"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill
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Strong-Dog
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Spyderco is free to raise prices if they want to, just a flippers are free to buy up limited runs and sell them at a higher price. Do I want Spyderco to do this? Definitely not.tvenuto wrote:To strong dog
At risk of prolonging this:
...I don't think anyone is accusing you of being a flipper
...I also don't think flippers should be called lower than pond scum, because as you point out, they are free to accept the risk of buying these knives
...I agree that we can vote with our dollar
...However your free market arguments ignore a few things:
1. Spyderco is not responding to the market demand by raising prices (commensurate with demand) on limited runs, which allows flippers to profit
2. Spyderco offers the mule team at a discounted cost so that its customers can experiment with a steel and report back, not so that a "flipper" has extra room to profit off of that lower price
3. "Flippers" as we call them, often knowingly circumvent the 2 limit per person rule that the SFO places on things like the Mule team
You have to respect that the combination of the 3 points makes others feel that "flippers" are being dishonest at worst, and profiteering at best. Even if this profiteering is legal, and part of a free market, it places the program of the Mule team at risk. I know most of my comments pertain to the Mule team, but this is the program I see that's most at risk from "flippers." I think the only thing that Spyderco can really do to prevent "flipping" is to charge a larger profit margin on limited runs so that they don't sell out as quickly and brings price in line with demand. This will reduce the room flippers have to profit, but it will also make collecting more expensive for the rest of us.
TL;DR?
So, I say we vote with our dollar, ignore the flippers, and don't make topics such as this a distracting wedge issue in this otherwise civil forum.
I'd much rather be arguing with you about the merits of liners versus no liners, or what color to make the next PM2 sprint, or whether you like or dislike a 50/50 choil.
It doesn't really matter why they offer the runs, because that means absolutely nothing to the people that do circumvent their rule. If this is such an issue, then Spyderco needs to get better methods to combat this. I recognize that it's impossible to stop this, so instead of whining about it I'd rather accept it as a "downside" of the greatest economic system ever implemented.
"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill
This is far too off topic, and I only say this because so much of your argument supposes the infallibility of a "free" market. I think anyone who was negatively affected by the sub-prime mortgage nonsense has reason to request that markets be a little less "free." Entities acting in their own self interest often screw over the group, in much worse ways than the mortgage crisis (Easter Island comes to mind). Thus, society often places negative pressure on those who would do things that screw the group. The most stringent is laws, but another is social mores. There are plenty of things you can do that are not illegal, but those around you would consider "wrong" and it would have social consequences for you to do them.
I can admit that in this case the downsides are relatively minor, however, it's not unreasonable for the concerned group to discuss methods of minimizing those downsides. Further, it is not unreasonable for this group to suggest solutions that result in a less free market (actual restrictions) or to express some sort of moral outrage (social pressure). The anonymity of the internet makes the second one far less effective, and some may view it as "wining" as you pointed out.
So, my final thought on this is, to answer your question, the above reasons are why it's not unreasonable (or illogical) to have a thread like this, and for people to express anger at those who are, in a real sense, benefiting themselves at the expense of the group.
Now can I get back to lusting after the Slysz Bowie?
I can admit that in this case the downsides are relatively minor, however, it's not unreasonable for the concerned group to discuss methods of minimizing those downsides. Further, it is not unreasonable for this group to suggest solutions that result in a less free market (actual restrictions) or to express some sort of moral outrage (social pressure). The anonymity of the internet makes the second one far less effective, and some may view it as "wining" as you pointed out.
So, my final thought on this is, to answer your question, the above reasons are why it's not unreasonable (or illogical) to have a thread like this, and for people to express anger at those who are, in a real sense, benefiting themselves at the expense of the group.
Now can I get back to lusting after the Slysz Bowie?
That's a terrible example, because the mortgage market is created by government intervention through Fannie, Freddie and Ginnie.tvenuto wrote:This is far too off topic, and I only say this because so much of your argument supposes the infallibility of a "free" market. I think anyone who was negatively affected by the sub-prime mortgage nonsense has reason to request that markets be a little less "free."
But let's leave politics out of this forum, please?
Holding the term free market like its a crucifix doesn't mean anyone else is against it. Funny thing is, I haven't defended either position really, I've just talked about how ridiculous and desperate for attention you are right now. BTW My family owns a pawn shop and Pawn Stars is my favorite show.Strong-Dog wrote:So in essence, no? You can't tell me a logical reason why flippers are lower than pond scum?
In essence, I didn't call flippers anything so I am not obliged to tell you a logical reason for it. Opposing viewpoints are aplenty, you read necrothreads... You look them up.
I got two green para this time around, as I missed out the first time. That ok with you?
Fine by me. Since the limit was one this time around, did you have any issues with KW? Did you have to pull any tricks to slither by?
Calling flippers lowlifes and lower than pond scum is bothering me? No, I just find it very illogical and a ridiculous thing to say.
it does bother you, you're even asking for an explanation. No one owes you squat, and likewise people find you ridiculous also. You even resurrected a thread from 2011 (meaning you were up last night reading up on the subject) to respond because it affects you that much. We can all agree to disagree but you are disturbed.
Am I right or am I wrong when I say that when someone say they hate flippers and that they make things not fair, at some level (no matter how small) they must be anti free market? You either like the free market or you don't. You may think flippers are a negative aspect of the market, but they are a part of it and there is nothing wrong with that. Everyone has equal opportunity in a free market system, would you rather have the gov come in a prosecute people that flip knives?
like I said arguments from both sides are all in your necrothreads. Matter of fact, everything you have stated so far is nothing new. Going on about it is pointless, I'm just responding at how ridiculous and desperate you sound. Gotta defend yourself from random online people lmao.
You can't do anything about people that choose to buy knives and them sell them at higher prices. Where we differ is that while I accept that they are a part of the free market and that there is nothing wrong with that, people like you sit there and insult them for some reason devoid of logic.
People like yourself must really hate pawn shops, huh?
Technical difficulties. Responses in bold.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory.
-Leonard Nimoy
-Leonard Nimoy
Don't cry foul. You're the one who's so eager to discuss and debate it. Keep reading those necrothreads, they are all there...Every point you've made. All...There.
I'm done. Again, I just had to respond to your absurdity. You were insulted by what people had to say about you from 2011 and called it comic gold. Jokes on you.
I'm done. Again, I just had to respond to your absurdity. You were insulted by what people had to say about you from 2011 and called it comic gold. Jokes on you.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory.
-Leonard Nimoy
-Leonard Nimoy
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Strong-Dog
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You're done? I look forward to the next time you "just have to respond to my absurdity".FCM415 wrote:Don't cry foul. You're the one who's so eager to discuss and debate it. Keep reading those necrothreads, they are all there...Every point you've made. All...There.
I'm done. Again, I just had to respond to your absurdity. You were insulted by what people had to say about you from 2011 and called it comic gold. Jokes on you.
You think I'm a flipper? That's great. You think I'm a troll? Even better.
So again, you offer no points to discuss besides insulting me. I try to have a discussion, you call me ridiculous and attention seeking. You tell me to look up stuff in "necrothreads" because you either can't discuss it yourself, or won't for whatever reason. That's fine, but if you cannot contribute to the discussion then why are you posting? But I'm the desperate attention seeking one, right?
"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill
Correct. What did you expect after doing that? Attention. Prove your point. Disprove opposing views, pick out the ridiculous tidbits and dismiss them as comical. Claim hypocrisy. You want some action... You want attention.Strong-Dog wrote: But I'm the desperate attention seeking one, right?
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory.
-Leonard Nimoy
-Leonard Nimoy
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Strong-Dog
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I thought you were done? Anyways, proving my point and attempting to disprove opposing views is what a discussion is. Which is what I'm attempting to do, have a calm discussion about flipping. I want action? No, I realize that no action can be taken to stop flippers. I want attention? Also wrong, but think what you want. Please refer to my previous post detailing how you in fact are the one who is desperate for attention.FCM415 wrote:Correct. What did you expect after doing that? Attention. Prove your point. Disprove opposing views, pick out the ridiculous tidbits and dismiss them as comical. Claim hypocrisy. You want some action... You want attention.
Now we could have go back to discussing flipping knives in general, but it seems like you are more interested in discussing me.
"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill
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Strong-Dog
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Funny thing is, I haven't defended either position really, I've just talked about how ridiculous and desperate for attention you are right now.
Then why are you posting? You just admitted that the only reason you're posting is to insult me.
Then why are you posting? You just admitted that the only reason you're posting is to insult me.
"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill
I lied, I'm not done. Sue me. A calm discussion? Please. Don't downplay it after the fact. "Comedy gold...ridiculous ....hypocrite" ...Sound familiar? You think that is proper in a calm debate? You ain't fooling this dog.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory.
-Leonard Nimoy
-Leonard Nimoy
Oh yeah? "Hypocrisy at its best" that's an insult. You're doing the same thing to those you were responding to. You both are hard liners from different ends of the spectrum/subject.Strong-Dog wrote:Funny thing is, I haven't defended either position really, I've just talked about how ridiculous and desperate for attention you are right now.
Then why are you posting? You just admitted that the only reason you're posting is to insult me.
It is about you. It was never about the subject. You took offense to something from 2011... Took it to heart because it hit close to home.
A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory.
-Leonard Nimoy
-Leonard Nimoy
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Strong-Dog
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Have you read this thread? Some of the things that have been said are comedy gold, ridiculous, and hypocritical. I'm sorry if those words are too strong for you.FCM415 wrote:I lied, I'm not done. Sue me. A calm discussion? Please. Don't downplay it after the fact. "Comedy gold...ridiculous ....hypocrite" ...Sound familiar? You think that is proper in a calm debate? You ain't fooling this dog.
Do you have any points to bring up about flipping knives? Or does me making my viewpoint on the matter make you that upset that you have to push the subject of discussion far aside and instead focus on assumptions made about me.
If you think I'm wrong on the subject of flipping, by all means please tell me why! But don't insult me and then tell me to read old posts in threads as your defense.
"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill
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Strong-Dog
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You're very good at making assumptions.FCM415 wrote: It is about you. It was never about the subject. You took offense to something from 2011... Took it to heart because it hit close to home.
"For a second, I thought I was dead, but when I heard all the noise I knew they were cops. Only cops talk that way. If they had been wiseguys, I wouldn't have heard a thing. I would've been dead."
-Henry Hill
-Henry Hill