Bow River steel upgrade please

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Revival
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Bow River steel upgrade please

#1

Post by Revival »

What is the possibility of a steel upgrade for the Bow River? I recently purchased 4 for Xmas gifts and probably getting 2 more. Love everything about it but wish it had a better steel.

Who else would be on board? I know there has been small talk about it in the past from other forum members, but I hope it’s a reality some day.
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Fireman
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#2

Post by Fireman »

I would i for sure buy some in LC200N or Magna Cut
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Wandering_About
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#3

Post by Wandering_About »

I'd love this. Doesn't even have to be anything super crazy. It's such a good fixed blade design. Keep a couple around for giving away at all times myself. A man can dream so... something to give a nod to Phil Wilson's experiments with fancy steels. S90V? Probably too much to ask for but hey, this is a pie in the sky moment. AEB-L at, say, 63-64Rc? That would be excellent. LC200N for a completely worry free hunting/fishing knife? Also would be excellent.

The only thing that keeps me from using the Bow River more is that the steel is a bit "meh" compared to what I'm used to. Granted, I have some outdoors oriented fixed blades from custom makers in steels that are just plain excellent (including CruWear and MagnaCut). So I'm a bit spoiled in that regard. But I do like the Bow River design, and would be very happy to see an upgrade to it.
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skeeg11
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#4

Post by skeeg11 »

Magna Cut would definitely take it out of the budget or Value category. LC200N is not very expensive here in the states, but the cost importing the steel for a Chinese manufacture might be. All is not lost, however. Many manufacturers are moving to 9Cr in their value line and Sal is well aware of this so there is hope.

The Bow River is such a great all around GP design for an outdoorsman. If by some miracle they did manage to do a Bow River in LC200N I would jump on it, but what I would really like to see is a totally new collaboration with Phil Wilson made in Golden.
bjz
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#5

Post by bjz »

I had been wanting to give a fixed blade a go for a rather specific niche in my kitchen lineup and pulled the trigger on one…fully expecting to hate the trailing point and eventually modify that. As much as I find it visually unappealing, I’ve quickly grown to really appreciate the design as a whole…including the price point. It is a fantastic fruit (especially citrus), vegetable and cheese knife. I’ve yet to play around with my own edge geometry yet, but I personally have yet to take any sort of real issue with 8cr in any of my spyderco or Byrd folders. I don’t suspect I will in this case either.

So, out of genuine curiosity, what are folks using this knife for and how have you found the 8cr significantly lacking for those tasks?

And with that, I’m off to go use my bow river for dinner!
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#6

Post by bjz »

skeeg11 wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 8:14 pm
what I would really like to see is a totally new collaboration with Phil Wilson made in Golden.
Like a Golden “value” sprig using the z-cut bd1n and poly handles?! I’d fill a drawer with those…and no, not a sock drawer!
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#7

Post by GarageBoy »

I'll take some 9/10Cr, if bd1 isn't on the table
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#8

Post by bearfacedkiller »

I’m in! Better steel and not made in China please.
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tonijedi
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#9

Post by tonijedi »

Fireman wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 7:51 pm
I would i for sure buy some in LC200N or Magna Cut
This!
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Bolster
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#10

Post by Bolster »

Wait a second.

I thought the point of the Bow River was that it was a relatively inexpensive Chinese Spyderco fixie.

Are you proposing shipping a high grade steel to China to make an upgraded Bow River? Or are you proposing to have the Bow River made elsewhere, and to become a higher end, more expensive knife?

Personally, I'd just choose a non-Chinese option if I wanted an upgraded steel.
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Mr.B.
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#11

Post by Mr.B. »

Should I feel the need for a better steel than my Bow River I will use my South Fork.

Bring back the South Fork and leave the Bow River in its niche.
Soanso McMasters
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#12

Post by Soanso McMasters »

A lot of knives should get the SPY27 treatment, this one included. Make it the new VG-10 so to speak.
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Mushroom
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#13

Post by Mushroom »

I would guess the possibility of an upgrade is slimmer than the blade stock… but seriously, I doubt it would happen.

If the knife cost four times as much as the current price, would you still have bought four of them as gifts with the intention of also buying two more?

I’d rather see a new design than seeing Spyderco devote funds and resources to making a second, more expensive, version of an existing budget model.
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Wandering_About
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#14

Post by Wandering_About »

I'd prefer to see an upgraded model produced alongside the standard. Maybe a sprint run would be a good way to do it? The 8Cr13MoV version sits in a good spot for wider appeal via price, and I'd hate to see it go away. But for me... Skin a few critters and you'll find out that wear resistance does in fact matter.
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Revival
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#15

Post by Revival »

Bolster wrote:
Wed Dec 01, 2021 4:59 pm
Wait a second.

I thought the point of the Bow River was that it was a relatively inexpensive Chinese Spyderco fixie.

Are you proposing shipping a high grade steel to China to make an upgraded Bow River? Or are you proposing to have the Bow River made elsewhere, and to become a higher end, more expensive knife?

Personally, I'd just choose a non-Chinese option if I wanted an upgraded steel.
I personally don’t care where it is made. I understand a better steel would increase the price and would be fine with that. I’m not saying make it the most expensive fixed Spyderco either. I’m sure there is a happy medium.
Mushroom wrote: I would guess the possibility of an upgrade is slimmer than the blade stock… but seriously, I doubt it would happen.

If the knife cost four times as much as the current price, would you still have bought four of them as gifts with the intention of also buying two more?

I’d rather see a new design than seeing Spyderco devote funds and resources to making a second, more expensive, version of an existing budget model.
If the Bow river would cost 4x as much, it would put it in a totally different category. The Tenacious received a steel upgrade without the price increasing 4x right?

Out of curiosity, do you own a Bow River or are you saying you would rather see a new design being that the Bow River is something that does not interest you?
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Mushroom
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#16

Post by Mushroom »

The Tenacious did receive a steel upgrade, to S35VN, but it wasn’t until they finally had molds made for an FRN version. It’s also a long standing model with a well established reputation. Also might be one of their best sellers.

If an upgraded Bow River did happen, S35VN is probably the best steel you’re going to get. I do not know if their maker in China is capable of working with other steels yet or not. Pretty much any other steel and it would probably have to be made somewhere else, which would subsequently increase the price considerably. (Actually probably more than four times the current cost too)


I do own a Bow River. I like it and hope it sticks around but there is only so much room available in their catalog. I would prefer to see more diversity in their catalog than to have a budget variant and high end variant of the same model.
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Bolster
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#17

Post by Bolster »

Revival wrote:
Wed Dec 01, 2021 7:28 pm
Bolster wrote:
Wed Dec 01, 2021 4:59 pm
Wait a second.

I thought the point of the Bow River was that it was a relatively inexpensive Chinese Spyderco fixie.

Are you proposing shipping a high grade steel to China to make an upgraded Bow River? Or are you proposing to have the Bow River made elsewhere, and to become a higher end, more expensive knife?

Personally, I'd just choose a non-Chinese option if I wanted an upgraded steel.
I personally don’t care where it is made. I understand a better steel would increase the price and would be fine with that. I’m not saying make it the most expensive fixed Spyderco either. I’m sure there is a happy medium.

I think that anyone who wants an affordable/bargain Spyderco *does* care where it's made...they want it made where labor is inexpensive, to keep costs down.

So far, the addition of Chinese Spydercos has been for the purpose of extending options to the lower end of the price scale. I think that's the Bow River's niche as well.
Steel novice who self-identifies as a steel expert. Proud M.N.O.S.D. member 0003. Spydie Steels: 4V, 15V, 20CV, AEB-L, AUS6, Cru-Wear, HAP40, K294, K390, M4, Magnacut, S110V, S30V, S35VN, S45VN, SPY27, SRS13, T15, VG10, XHP, ZWear, ZDP189
skmo
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#18

Post by skmo »

bjz wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 9:22 pm
So, out of genuine curiosity, what are folks using this knife for and how have you found the 8cr significantly lacking for those tasks?
Any of the 8Cr variations of steel have had far too varied quality control issues in my experience. I've had 8Cr13MoV blades so soft they almost dull in a stiff breeze, and I've had them so brittle they chip like ceramic. Most of the knives I've had problems with have been Kershaws, but there have a been a few others. The 9Cr blade on my Civivi Praxis has been pretty good, and I've been happy with the 10Cr on the little use I've put on my Minimis. China is doing a great deal of manufacturing of inexpensive knives these days with Sandvik's 14C28N, which is just about my favorite steel in the world. If Spyderco could get them to use 14C28N on a Bow River, I'd be more than happy to shell out over a C note each for a few.
Michael Janich
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#19

Post by Michael Janich »

Dear skmo:

Welcome to the Spyderco Forum.

Stay safe,

Mike
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Re: Bow River steel upgrade please

#20

Post by yablanowitz »

skmo wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2024 3:08 am
bjz wrote:
Tue Nov 30, 2021 9:22 pm
So, out of genuine curiosity, what are folks using this knife for and how have you found the 8cr significantly lacking for those tasks?
Any of the 8Cr variations of steel have had far too varied quality control issues in my experience. I've had 8Cr13MoV blades so soft they almost dull in a stiff breeze, and I've had them so brittle they chip like ceramic. Most of the knives I've had problems with have been Kershaws, but there have a been a few others. The 9Cr blade on my Civivi Praxis has been pretty good, and I've been happy with the 10Cr on the little use I've put on my Minimis. China is doing a great deal of manufacturing of inexpensive knives these days with Sandvik's 14C28N, which is just about my favorite steel in the world. If Spyderco could get them to use 14C28N on a Bow River, I'd be more than happy to shell out over a C note each for a few.
Out of idle curiousity, have any of those blades come from Spyderco/Byrd? The steel is only as good as the heat treatment, and that maker has it dialed in.
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