CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

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mpgtsm
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CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby mpgtsm » Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:35 am

I have two S30V blades I use every day. Occasionally they need more than just touching up. Which rods are better as an upgrade.

Thanks, and my apology if this is an old subject.

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Spydergirl88
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby Spydergirl88 » Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:37 am

I have both and use both with no detectable difference (to me) on my knives. My edc is s30v
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Wartstein
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby Wartstein » Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:45 am

I never had diamond-, but have CBN rods and all I can say is that they work perfectly well.

Here is another thread concerning your question, including a post of Sal on it: viewtopic.php?t=78443#p1219379
Top three going by pocket-time: Endura 4 in VG 10/Micarta-scales; Stretch 1 in VG 10; Endura 4 in HAP 40

mpgtsm
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby mpgtsm » Wed Feb 12, 2020 9:46 am

Great. Thank you both

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emanuel
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby emanuel » Thu Feb 13, 2020 2:44 pm

Had both. CBN seems to cut "finer" than the diamonds, while both remove metal just as fast, if that makes any sense. I use the CBN exclusively since I like the edge finish more/get the knife to a more consistent sharpness. Can't go wrong with both, but I recommend the CBN based on my experience.

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Evil D
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby Evil D » Thu Feb 13, 2020 3:13 pm

I can't really compare them because my diamond rods are wore down a good bit, but I don't remember them cutting as aggressively as the CBN do so I have to lean a little towards them. Seems like I read on here somewhere that diamond cuts better but CBN doesn't tear off the rods as easily..? I'll tell ya this much, when they say to use a light touch, they mean it. If you ham fist on either of these rods you'll ruin them.
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soc_monki
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby soc_monki » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:48 pm

I enjoy my diamond rods. They work deceptively fast, and leave a pretty good finish. You can always polish up the edge with the medium, fine and ultrafine if you want. I usually just leave the diamond finish, but sometimes do hit it on the brown rods depending on how I feel.
Spyderco : Resilience, Tenacious, Persistence, Manix 2 G10, Para 3 G10, Para 3 LW, Paramilitary 2,
BBS Paramilitary 2, Amalgam
Kershaw : Tone, Cryo, Cryo 2, Thermite, Atmos, Natrix 7007cf, Natrix 7008cf, Bareknuckle 7777, Bareknuckle 20cv, Concierge
Zero Tolerance : 0566CF, 0770CF, 0770GRYBW, 0562CF, 0470, 0456CF, 0095BW, 0801TI
Ontario : Rat 1
CRKT : Caligo
Civivi : Plethiros, Baklash
Cold Steel : AD10
Benchmade : 810-1401 Contego, 15080-2 Crooked River, 15080-Custom Crooked River, 560BK-1 Super Freek, 15085 Mini Crooked River, 940-2, 550-1 Griptilian, 950bk Rift
Buck : 110, Bucklite 422, 110 LT, 110 Slim Select, 112 Slim Pro
Artisan : Tradition

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pantagana23
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby pantagana23 » Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:33 am

Guys, if I buy the standard Sharpmaker set, do I need additional rods to take to get the knife to sharp?
I mean those CBN/diamonds and ultra fine.

Also, is the honing board with compounds needed additional to previous?

I need to get a good sharpener, as I have 30+ folders in different steels and only a diamond/ceramic stone, and can't get any knife even close to factory level.

I wan't to get a normally priced sharpener (WE and Tormek go too high IMO), and maybe this would be the solution.

From my current steels, I have AUS-8, VG-10, LC200N, CTS-XHP, CPM154, N690Co, H1, 440C, 12C27 and Victorinox steel (whatever alloy that is)

Please advise.

TkoK83Spy
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby TkoK83Spy » Fri Feb 14, 2020 8:33 am

pantagana23 wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:33 am
Guys, if I buy the standard Sharpmaker set, do I need additional rods to take to get the knife to sharp?
I mean those CBN/diamonds and ultra fine.

Also, is the honing board with compounds needed additional to previous?

I need to get a good sharpener, as I have 30+ folders in different steels and only a diamond/ceramic stone, and can't get any knife even close to factory level.

I wan't to get a normally priced sharpener (WE and Tormek go too high IMO), and maybe this would be the solution.

From my current steels, I have AUS-8, VG-10, LC200N, CTS-XHP, CPM154, N690Co, H1, 440C, 12C27 and Victorinox steel (whatever alloy that is)

Please advise.
Sharpmaker would be perfect for you! Since you already have a diamond stone for reprofiling or removes chips, though the CBN/Diamond rods wouldn't be a bad idea...that way you could maintain the same angle with all the stones instead of free handing with the diamond you already have. Depends on your skill level with your free hand sharpening I suppose! It's a big leap in grit going from diamond to be the brown rods, so it will take some patience but it can be done. I've done it myself plenty of times now from the CBN to the browns.

Depending how much of an edge junky you are, finishing on the standard fine rods should be fine in most cases. You should easily be able to cut through receipt paper, shave arm hair off the white stones if sharpened correctly.
Currently have 20 :spyder: 's in 14 different steels.

-Rick

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Woodpuppy
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby Woodpuppy » Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:08 am

The only sharpening “system” I have is the Sharpmaker. I have a set of cbn rods, but only ever use them to reprofile an edge to 30* included, or fix a battered edge. Then I rely on the brown & white rods for regular maintenance sharpening. Often I only need the white/fine rods. Some folks do well with a light touch with just the brown/mediums, but I like the white. I also made myself a leather strop; the suede side is loaded with green compound and the reverse is just smooth cowhide. I don’t think I’ve achieved “arm hair tree topping” level, I usually stop when I reach easy arm hair shaving with no razor burn. I also like the Spyderco Doublestuff2 stone. Both of mine have come apart, unfortunately I epoxied my first one back together without thinking. I should have stuck two white stones together! They outlast the cbn. I’d really like a doublestuff “3” with white & brown stones in the same shape as the DS2.
:spyder: My other blade is a Kelly Perfect :spyder:

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soc_monki
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby soc_monki » Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:44 am

I hardly ever use my fine and ultrafine rods anymore. Finish bevel on diamonds, microbevel withe the browns. Pops hair off the arm and slices paper no problem. I prefer the tooth you get from that progression.

All the stones are good to have though. Some steels work great at the high polishes of the fine and ultrafine. It's good to have variety!
Spyderco : Resilience, Tenacious, Persistence, Manix 2 G10, Para 3 G10, Para 3 LW, Paramilitary 2,
BBS Paramilitary 2, Amalgam
Kershaw : Tone, Cryo, Cryo 2, Thermite, Atmos, Natrix 7007cf, Natrix 7008cf, Bareknuckle 7777, Bareknuckle 20cv, Concierge
Zero Tolerance : 0566CF, 0770CF, 0770GRYBW, 0562CF, 0470, 0456CF, 0095BW, 0801TI
Ontario : Rat 1
CRKT : Caligo
Civivi : Plethiros, Baklash
Cold Steel : AD10
Benchmade : 810-1401 Contego, 15080-2 Crooked River, 15080-Custom Crooked River, 560BK-1 Super Freek, 15085 Mini Crooked River, 940-2, 550-1 Griptilian, 950bk Rift
Buck : 110, Bucklite 422, 110 LT, 110 Slim Select, 112 Slim Pro
Artisan : Tradition

TkoK83Spy
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby TkoK83Spy » Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:32 pm

soc_monki wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:44 am
I hardly ever use my fine and ultrafine rods anymore. Finish bevel on diamonds, microbevel withe the browns. Pops hair off the arm and slices paper no problem. I prefer the tooth you get from that progression.

That's how I finished off my M390 Para 3 a couple weeks ago. I actually plan on using it all next week at work to see how I like it and how it holds up.
Currently have 20 :spyder: 's in 14 different steels.

-Rick

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soc_monki
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby soc_monki » Fri Feb 14, 2020 4:37 pm

TkoK83Spy wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:32 pm
soc_monki wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:44 am
I hardly ever use my fine and ultrafine rods anymore. Finish bevel on diamonds, microbevel withe the browns. Pops hair off the arm and slices paper no problem. I prefer the tooth you get from that progression.

That's how I finished off my M390 Para 3 a couple weeks ago. I actually plan on using it all next week at work to see how I like it and how it holds up.
It really works great. Polishing the bevel works really well for some things, but when there is a toothy finish I find the edge grabs and slices much better. Going through paper it is not as smooth and whisper quiet, but I find I like the aggressive nature of the teeth better!
Spyderco : Resilience, Tenacious, Persistence, Manix 2 G10, Para 3 G10, Para 3 LW, Paramilitary 2,
BBS Paramilitary 2, Amalgam
Kershaw : Tone, Cryo, Cryo 2, Thermite, Atmos, Natrix 7007cf, Natrix 7008cf, Bareknuckle 7777, Bareknuckle 20cv, Concierge
Zero Tolerance : 0566CF, 0770CF, 0770GRYBW, 0562CF, 0470, 0456CF, 0095BW, 0801TI
Ontario : Rat 1
CRKT : Caligo
Civivi : Plethiros, Baklash
Cold Steel : AD10
Benchmade : 810-1401 Contego, 15080-2 Crooked River, 15080-Custom Crooked River, 560BK-1 Super Freek, 15085 Mini Crooked River, 940-2, 550-1 Griptilian, 950bk Rift
Buck : 110, Bucklite 422, 110 LT, 110 Slim Select, 112 Slim Pro
Artisan : Tradition

mpgtsm
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby mpgtsm » Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:11 am

pantagana23 wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:33 am
Guys, if I buy the standard Sharpmaker set, do I need additional rods to take to get the knife to sharp?
I mean those CBN/diamonds and ultra fine.

Also, is the honing board with compounds needed additional to previous?

I need to get a good sharpener, as I have 30+ folders in different steels and only a diamond/ceramic stone, and can't get any knife even close to factory level.

I wan't to get a normally priced sharpener (WE and Tormek go too high IMO), and maybe this would be the solution.

From my current steels, I have AUS-8, VG-10, LC200N, CTS-XHP, CPM154, N690Co, H1, 440C, 12C27 and Victorinox steel (whatever alloy that is)

Please advise.
Unless you really want the mirrored edge, the brown rods will maintain an edge really well, and with almost no time or effort. This thread details it fairly well:
https://forum.spyderco.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=84636

I bought a nice strop, but have not seen it make a difference. A very light touch on the SM, and my blades are as sharp as I've ever imagined they could be.

prndltech
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby prndltech » Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:26 am

Can’t go wrong. I think I bought the CBN? Don’t even remember. Reprofiled s90v with it pretty easily.
The planter, the farmer, the mechanic, and the laborer... form the great body of the people of the United States, they are the bone and sinew of the country men who love liberty and desire nothing but equal rights and equal laws. - Andrew Jackson

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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby kodai78 » Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:29 am

I have several sharpening devices but I only use the Sharpmaker now since I bought it. Perhaps it’s most important characteristic is ease of use. I don’t have the ability to freehand on a stone and get good results in a short time. With the Sharpmaker I can. I have the Diamond stones and medium, fine and ultra-fine. I have a strop and use it after finishing up on the Sharpmaker but it’s hard to tell much difference. I don’t always use all 4 grades of stones. The Diamond is really for an edge in poor condition in my opinion. Use of the brown and white stones is all you need for maintaining a good cutting edge. Of course there are some edge wizards on the forum who need a polished edge and laser like cutting from their knives. More power to them, but the Sharpmaker alone will sharpen pretty much everything in your kitchen and workshop and all your knives very well. There are many other options in the market for sharpening knives but the Sharpmaker hits the sweet spot price and utility wise for me.
:spyder: Smock, Baby Jess Horn CE, Spydiechef, Schempp Bowie,Ti Fluted Military, Titanium Military, Native S30 V and G10, PM 2 in S35VN, and S110V, Manix 2 LW BD1, Sage 5, Positron black CPM S30V, Chaparral w/Raffir Noble scales, SuperLeaf VG 10, Ladybug H1, Dragonfly 2 in ZDP 189 and Superblue/420J1 and H1, Delica in ZDP 189, Clipitool Standard, the Cook’s knife VG10, Santorum, paring and utility knives, all in MBS 26. :spyder:

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pantagana23
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby pantagana23 » Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:05 am

kodai78 wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:29 am
I have several sharpening devices but I only use the Sharpmaker now since I bought it. Perhaps it’s most important characteristic is ease of use. I don’t have the ability to freehand on a stone and get good results in a short time. With the Sharpmaker I can. I have the Diamond stones and medium, fine and ultra-fine. I have a strop and use it after finishing up on the Sharpmaker but it’s hard to tell much difference. I don’t always use all 4 grades of stones. The Diamond is really for an edge in poor condition in my opinion. Use of the brown and white stones is all you need for maintaining a good cutting edge. Of course there are some edge wizards on the forum who need a polished edge and laser like cutting from their knives. More power to them, but the Sharpmaker alone will sharpen pretty much everything in your kitchen and workshop and all your knives very well. There are many other options in the market for sharpening knives but the Sharpmaker hits the sweet spot price and utility wise for me.
So basically I buy Sharpmaker set, which comes with medium and fine, buy diamond and ultrafine additionally for a full set?
How long do these rods last?

mpgtsm
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby mpgtsm » Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:19 am

Diamond or CBN and UF are accessories, if you have a need for them. I'm sure the life of the stones, depends on how often and how you use them. They are easy to clean though.

kodai78
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby kodai78 » Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:44 am

You can add the additional stones later. You don’t have to have them. The stones that are in the Sharpmaker are sufficient for most uses. If you need to repair or reprofile you would add Diamond or CBN. The rods will last a long time if you use light pressure. Maybe decades but many years certainly. Get the Sharpmaker, watch the videos (YouTube) and practice. Then you will learn if you need the other stones. I keep an old Yellow pages and test the edges on that paper after sharpening and the ultra fine stones are nice but not necessary. Many people do not finish an edge with even the fine stones.
:spyder: Smock, Baby Jess Horn CE, Spydiechef, Schempp Bowie,Ti Fluted Military, Titanium Military, Native S30 V and G10, PM 2 in S35VN, and S110V, Manix 2 LW BD1, Sage 5, Positron black CPM S30V, Chaparral w/Raffir Noble scales, SuperLeaf VG 10, Ladybug H1, Dragonfly 2 in ZDP 189 and Superblue/420J1 and H1, Delica in ZDP 189, Clipitool Standard, the Cook’s knife VG10, Santorum, paring and utility knives, all in MBS 26. :spyder:

kodai78
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Re: CBN vs Daimond SM rods?

Postby kodai78 » Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:52 am

pantagana23 wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:33 am
Guys, if I buy the standard Sharpmaker set, do I need additional rods to take to get the knife to sharp?
I mean those CBN/diamonds and ultra fine.

Also, is the honing board with compounds needed additional to previous?

I need to get a good sharpener, as I have 30+ folders in different steels and only a diamond/ceramic stone, and can't get any knife even close to factory level.

I wan't to get a normally priced sharpener (WE and Tormek go too high IMO), and maybe this would be the solution.

From my current steels, I have AUS-8, VG-10, LC200N, CTS-XHP, CPM154, N690Co, H1, 440C, 12C27 and Victorinox steel (whatever alloy that is)

Please advise.
I should have quoted you earlier in my first reply but I have sharpened most of these steels with the Sharpmaker without problems, with good results and without needing Diamond or CBN. (Not sure I have any 12C27, or have sharpened any 440 C in a long time but they should be fine). I hope this helps. You will be able to achieve “factory level” or better with the Sharpmaker after very little practice. Use light pressure!
:spyder: Smock, Baby Jess Horn CE, Spydiechef, Schempp Bowie,Ti Fluted Military, Titanium Military, Native S30 V and G10, PM 2 in S35VN, and S110V, Manix 2 LW BD1, Sage 5, Positron black CPM S30V, Chaparral w/Raffir Noble scales, SuperLeaf VG 10, Ladybug H1, Dragonfly 2 in ZDP 189 and Superblue/420J1 and H1, Delica in ZDP 189, Clipitool Standard, the Cook’s knife VG10, Santorum, paring and utility knives, all in MBS 26. :spyder:


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