Chief vs Stretch XL for fishing knife?

[James Y]

I know that LC200N is known to hold an edge better than H1/H2 in PE, but I don't know if it holds an edge better in SE. The only thing I would like better (in general) about SE LC200N compared to SE H1/H2 is its ability to be FFG'd.

Jim

[SaltyCaribbeanDfly]

Same. I love SE H1/2.

SE H1/2…

[Kels73]

For me, the overall design of the knife trumps the blade steel. I just purchased a Stretch 2 XL Salt SE, and I'm loving it. I was torn between the Stretch or a Native Chief, but the Stretch's blade profile and ergonomics won me out.

However, that's assuming the blade steel will perform adequately in your intended application. It sounds like H2 PE might not, and that's a legitimate concern.

[Wartstein]

.... I cannot see the point of PE H2 when there are two corrosion resistant and much better edge-holding steels available, at least one of which is already available for use by Seki. I don't really understand the delay given so many other manufacturers are deploying MagnaCut across their ranges.

I can´t weigh in on H1/H2 in PE from personal experience, cause I only know (and love) that steel in SE.

But more or less just parroting things I read (mainly on this forum):

I think there is a place for H1/H2 in PE and a reason why folks might choose it over LC200N (and Magnacut):
- It actually "only" falls behind in edge retention (and perhaps even not that much compared to LC?), but seems to be better both in toughness and corrosion resistance (for those who need super extrem levels of the latter)
- Here viewtopic.php?t=96030 is a great thread by someone who obviously really uses all three of Spydercos Salt steels and has to say a lot of good things about H1/H2 (admittedly he (Windward) these days appearantly only has SE blades anymore when it comes to H1/H2)
- Folks who give H1/H2 a really coarse edge (main proponent: Vivi) report a clear improvement in edge retention.

So, in conclusion: If I wanted a supertough and top level rust resistant folder, but would not be worried if I had to touch up the edge a bit more often (plus: would have to repair damages to the edge LESS often): H2 would be my choice.

The thing that comes with H1/H2 knives and I like to have in some folders is the sabre hollow grind, with its stronger spine and tip. But admittedly this is something Spyderco could of course give LC and MC too (sabre hollow grind) if they choose so, so this is not a real, exclusice pro with H1/H2 (but rather a con that these steels ONLY come in that grind).

[Farmer]

Lc200n wasnt available on Seki knives at first. So maybe the same will happen with magnacut.

Fingers crossed, cos I'd happily take a plain-edge LC200N Stretch XL!

[Farmer]

I think there is a place for H1/H2 in PE and a reason why folks might choose it over LC200N (and Magnacut):
- It actually "only" falls behind in edge retention (and perhaps even not that much compared to LC?), but seems to be better both in toughness and corrosion resistance (for those who need super extreme levels of the latter)

This is the bit I really struggle with because I genuinely can't see a use-case where plain-edge H1/2 is more useful than either LC200N or MagnaCut. Extreme toughness just isn't an attribute I need very often when fishing, kayaking, diving etc.

For instance I use PE H1 for kayak fishing and I'll agree it's fine for occasional light use like cutting thin line or prepping fish. But anything more demanding, such as cutting a few lobster pot lines, means I'm stuck with a blunt knife for the rest of the day. Whereas the same model in either LC200N or MagnaCut would be almost as rust resistant and I would still have a knife that cut could properly.

I guess what I'm saying is that even if there is a specialist use-case for plain-edge H1/2, my money is on most users wanting something with much better edge retention. I would further guess that it's logistical or commercial challenges keeping MagnaCut out of the Seki Salt models, rather than a belief at Spyderco that PE H2 is a better option.

[hvarcz]

For fishing fixed knife.

[cjk]

Maybe try to talk Sal into a PE Stretch 2 XL LC200N Salt?

[aicolainen]

I’m saving my money for a FFG PE (or CE) S2XL Salt. It’s hard to imagine that wont be a thing someday.
With the choice of linerless construction from the get go, it was very obvious a salt version would come along sooner or later. It took longer than I expected and the choice of HG H1/H2 for the initial version was also quite unexpected.
I’m not too concerned about the specific steel, both MC and LC is fine for my use.
Now, I can see why this may be an urgent decision for Lance, unlike me and some other forumites he probably doesn’t have many knives to choose from. Luckily I have a few that can keep me going while I wait for my FFG S2XL

[RazorSharp86]

What we really need is a siren with yellow or green G10 and Magnacut..!

I like a bit of a belly on my fishing knives, personally. Which is why I think that the knives you’ve helped design are by far the best all around for my fishing needs, and why the Chief doesn’t interest me much.

Maybe a Siren XL in Magnacut and high-vis G10 scales? =)

[Naperville]

I have not been fishing lately but upon inspection of my tackle box I see thin and pointy knives.

To remove the fish bones, scales and organs you may need a Native Chief. For hunting you need a tip that has a less acute tip to the knife.

I plan to pick up at least 2 Magnacut Native Chiefs. Excellent steel and blade profile.

[aicolainen]

I have not been fishing lately but upon inspection of my tackle box I see thin and pointy knives.

8< -----

To remove the fish bones, scales and organs you may need a Native Chief. For hunting you need a tip that has a less acute tip to the knife.

I guess it could depend on the size and species of fish you're catching. Just a guess. For the stuff I catch, I definitively prefer some belly and I've not even considered bringing my Chief on a fishing trip.

[Wartstein]

What we really need is a siren with yellow or green G10 and Magnacut..!
...

Almost perfect, but make it FRN instead of G10... (and add an SE option!)

[RazorSharp86]

What we really need is a siren with yellow or green G10 and Magnacut..!
...

Almost perfect, but make it FRN instead of G10... (and add an SE option!)

FRN for a Siren XL Slim model, and G10 for new and improved magnacut Siren.

I’m not a big fan of serrations, personally, but if Spyderco made both (pe and se) I’d buy them.

[Surfingringo]

I think there is a place for H1/H2 in PE and a reason why folks might choose it over LC200N (and Magnacut):
- It actually "only" falls behind in edge retention (and perhaps even not that much compared to LC?), but seems to be better both in toughness and corrosion resistance (for those who need super extreme levels of the latter)

This is the bit I really struggle with because I genuinely can't see a use-case where plain-edge H1/2 is more useful than either LC200N or MagnaCut. Extreme toughness just isn't an attribute I need very often when fishing, kayaking, diving etc.

For instance I use PE H1 for kayak fishing and I'll agree it's fine for occasional light use like cutting thin line or prepping fish. But anything more demanding, such as cutting a few lobster pot lines, means I'm stuck with a blunt knife for the rest of the day. Whereas the same model in either LC200N or MagnaCut would be almost as rust resistant and I would still have a knife that cut could properly.

I guess what I'm saying is that even if there is a specialist use-case for plain-edge H1/2, my money is on most users wanting something with much better edge retention. I would further guess that it's logistical or commercial challenges keeping MagnaCut out of the Seki Salt models, rather than a belief at Spyderco that PE H2 is a better option.

Yeah, although i agree with Wartstein that there are still some special use cases where pe might be preferred for extreme corrosion resistance/toughness, I think your assessment pretty much nails it. I think I’m probably an extreme outlier when it comes to what I demand of my rust proof knives and even I can’t really make a case for using H1/H2 pe over either lc200n or Magnacut. Serrated H1 is a completely different story. Serrations work so well in H1 that the toughness and corrosion resistance aren’t excuses to tolerate poor edge performance, but rather added and welcome bonuses to a great performing steel.

[Surfingringo]

What we really need is a siren with yellow or green G10 and Magnacut..!
...

Almost perfect, but make it FRN instead of G10... (and add an SE option!)

FRN for a Siren XL Slim model, and G10 for new and improved magnacut Siren.

I’m not a big fan of serrations, personally, but if Spyderco made both (pe and se) I’d buy them.

I appreciate the siren love and the confidence from you guys but if i’m being honest, when it comes to a slim Siren that’s more of a folding fillet, I really don’t think I could improve on what Sal already did with the Catcherman. The mini Siren on the other hand…that is the design i’m most proud of. I thought that one was a nice bridge between an outdoor rust proof folder and a smaller gents EDC.

[Wartstein]

What we really need is a siren with yellow or green G10 and Magnacut..!
...

Almost perfect, but make it FRN instead of G10... (and add an SE option!)

FRN for a Siren XL Slim model, and G10 for new and improved magnacut Siren.

I’m not a big fan of serrations, personally, but if Spyderco made both (pe and se) I’d buy them.

I appreciate the siren love and the confidence from you guys but if i’m being honest, when it comes to a slim Siren that’s more of a folding fillet, I really don’t think I could improve on what Sal already did with the Catcherman. The mini Siren on the other hand…that is the design i’m most proud of. I thought that one was a nice bridge between an outdoor rust proof folder and a smaller gents EDC.

A "slim" Siren in the sense of having a thinner blade would be a shorter, more convenient carry than the Catcherman and offer an a bit more robust tip and also more robust overall blade (just cause the blade is shorter)...so I am sure the Catcherman would be the superior "folding filet", but a slim Siren the better general EDC, but still with focus on slicing performance...

[SaltyCaribbeanDfly]

What we really need is a siren with yellow or green G10 and Magnacut..!
...

Almost perfect, but make it FRN instead of G10... (and add an SE option!)

FRN for a Siren XL Slim model, and G10 for new and improved magnacut Siren.

I’m not a big fan of serrations, personally, but if Spyderco made both (pe and se) I’d buy them.

I appreciate the siren love and the confidence from you guys but if i’m being honest, when it comes to a slim Siren that’s more of a folding fillet, I really don’t think I could improve on what Sal already did with the Catcherman. The mini Siren on the other hand…that is the design i’m most proud of. I thought that one was a nice bridge between an outdoor rust proof folder and a smaller gents EDC.

I think I remember seeing a mini Siren prototype at BladeShow last year or maybe it was the year before whichever the case I’d get one in a heartbeat!!!

[olywa]

Mini Siren? Any pics available?

[Wartstein]

Yeah, although i agree with Wartstein that there are still some special use cases where pe might be preferred for extreme corrosion resistance/toughness, I think your assessment pretty much nails it. I think I’m probably an extreme outlier when it comes to what I demand of my rust proof knives and even I can’t really make a case for using H1/H2 pe over either lc200n or Magnacut. Serrated H1 is a completely different story. Serrations work so well in H1 that the toughness and corrosion resistance aren’t excuses to tolerate poor edge performance, but rather added and welcome bonuses to a great performing steel.

I hear you folks who really need that high levels of corrosion resistance and can actually compare steels in that regard.
In my use - despite I am using my Spydies in wet and humid outdoor conditions and for food prep and so on all the time - even VG10 is rustproof enough.

And I actually never tried H1/H2 in PE, just in SE, and with teeth it is really good as you say.

The other thing I sometimes like with H1/H2 is, as said, the sabre hollow grind with the no-taper-spine and the strong blade and tip this offers. There are occasions where I want that. But you could give LC or MC that kind of grind too, so it is not an inherent H1/H2 feature and possible advantage