Spyderco Forums

Sal has mentioned many times the past experience with S60V/440V and the steel not being able to achieve a useable high working hardness and also being miserable to sharpen at lower hardness.

It seems with CPM S60V, things have changed in recent years especially new batches of CPM S60V versus the original mid to late 1990s batches. So, in reflection of this I have been asked at Sal's request to make him a high performance custom knife to evaluate the current state of CPM S60V thanks to Matt Maola sharing his experience with a CPM S60V I gave him to try.

Honestly,I am quite flattered, perhaps no greater honor than to make a "mule" for the godfather of exotic steel production knives. Sal has certainly spoiled all of us over the years by getting impossible materials into production knives for us edge junkies to play with and to answer the ultimate question: "What is the limit of edge performance?"


My mind raced with what design I was going to make.
Needs to be something pure, a true slicer and cutter.
I looked at my CPM S60V supply and realized I needed a bigger piece for the design I wanted.

CPM steels are very expensive in comparison to more common cast ingot carbon steels.

The EDC community makes up their own value system for knives of different steels that has zero reflection to the actual costs involved in buying materials to make the blades.


For example the piece of CPM S60V I needed cost me $150, that's more than the price then what most regular people spend on a complete knife.

52100 in the same dimensions for example would cost $40

That should really help put into perspective to some people that don't understand the cost involved but that's another topic.

Is this a folder or a fixed blade?

RugerNurse wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 11, 2024 4:37 pm

Is this a folder or a fixed blade?

I'll leave the folders to Spyderco.

When Sal was testing my folding collaboration design I remember he said it cut his sushi well.

I think Sal needs a bigger blade for his sushi.

This is going to be an awesome thread. I can just tell.

First step as a handmade custom knife maker is to select a pattern, I've been designing a kitchen knife pattern that has the same line flow and ergonomics of my trapper knife pattern which a enjoy considerably.



The steel is marked with Machinist dye and the pattern is scribed onto the steel.




The pattern is cut out to final 2d size with a variety of methods




I think this pattern with special heat treatment and laser thin grind will be good for evaluation of S60V and cut proteins very well.



A bold size for a CPM steel. This should give adequate length for drawing the edge across materials for slicing keeping the cut forces low and less smashing of materials, especially with a thin grind.

Draw cuts are always less force than push cuts.



Handle is drilled, reamed and countersunk for mechanical fastening corby bolts and epoxy bridges.



Clean, degrease and deburr and prepare for heat treatment.




I always double check to make sure a pattern pleases my hands and eyes. I am pleased so far.

Deadboxhero wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 11, 2024 5:00 pm

I think this pattern with special heat treatment and laser thin grind will be good for evaluation of S60V and cut proteins very well.

No doubt.

I love seeing this kind of stuff!

HI Shawn,

Thanx much. Looking forward to it. How hard will you make it?

Thanx for the kind words.

sal

That's a biiiiig piece of s60v for the redemption tour

I'm stoked. I know what this steel and heat treat are capable of. I believe Sal is in for a real treat when he puts it thru the paces. Looking forward to more updates as well.

Steeltoez83 wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:50 pm

I'm stoked. I know what this steel and heat treat are capable of. I believe Sal is in for a real treat when he puts it thru the paces. Looking forward to more updates as well.

Matt,

Do you want handles on your Rex 76 mule?

sal wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 11, 2024 5:57 pm

HI Shawn,

Thanx much. Looking forward to it. How hard will you make it?

Thanx for the kind words.

sal

Well, thank you for sharing the passion with all of us.

As for the hardness, we'll measure the hardness on this piece when it is done.

The furnaces are heating up.

309 SS foil is ready.

Should be a good cook.

Deadboxhero wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:54 pm

Steeltoez83 wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 11, 2024 6:50 pm

I'm stoked. I know what this steel and heat treat are capable of. I believe Sal is in for a real treat when he puts it thru the paces. Looking forward to more updates as well.

Matt,

Do you want handles on your Rex 76 mule?

That would be awesome thankyou. I'm not picky about the material as long as it doesn't look like a disco ball.

While the furnace is heating, it we'll be nice to share some color metallography I made of CPM S60V and what excites me about it.

The microstructure is actually finer than CPM S90V and M390.



CPM S60V


CPM S90V


Bohler M390



The color metallography colors the different carbide types differently, CPM S60V has a higher volume of vanadium carbides than M390.

Finer and harder carbides than M390 can translate to more "horsepower" with a good heat treatment on the matrix to support the carbides at the edge.

Shawn,

Thanks for sharing, always good to see how your knives are made.

What are you going to use for a handle? I have a lot more luck working with wood and have a ton of fun making handles for my mules. I have some Gabon Ebony I want to try next but running out of excuses to buy more mules.

Can’t wait to see the final product.

Coastal wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 11, 2024 4:42 pm

This is going to be an awesome thread. I can just tell.

Agreed, it’s fascinating stuff for sure

Fascinating stuff, Shawn. Thanks for the micrographs, those are really interesting to see! You pull no punches when it comes to big kitchen knives with the high carbide steels. That big 15V kitchen knife you made some time back still haunts my thoughts from time to time (in the best way).

Fascinating and insightful thread!

Thank you for letting us see some of the process as you make this amazing knife for Sal. This is going to be one of my favorite threads to read.

Good thread!

I knew that you were heavily involved in knife making, but had no idea you had all of that equipment.

Do you take orders for knives at this time?

Deadboxhero wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 11, 2024 7:14 pm

While the furnace is heating, it we'll be nice to share some color metallography I made of CPM S60V and what excites me about it.

Thanks for showing us the process.
Her's a couple questions, perhaps relevant, perhaps not.

When you heat treat this blade, are you using a "recipe" that is published by others? Do you use your own recipe arrived at through your own experimentation? Or are you able to look at the specs, and intuitively know what you need to do?