Janky grind on K390 Delica Wharncliffe

[ejames13]

Just picked up a Delica Wharncliffe in K390 and immediately noticed the edge grind looked funky. Not an uneven bevel, but a cutting edge that isn't straight. It almost looks like a micro hawkbill towards the tip. Is this normal? My VG-10 Wharncliffe Delica is almost dead straight.

[Enactive]

It doesn't look great, but can you photograph the edge parallel to a metal straight edge and not backlit?

[twinboysdad]

My last LBHB H1 has a terrible grind especially at the tip. I kept it because it’s a bathing suit knife but some of this should be caught by QC. That Wharn K390 D4 was not cheap either

[ejames13]

It doesn't look great, but can you photograph the edge parallel to a metal straight edge and not backlit?

Best I can get for now.

[Enactive]

Yeah, that's disappointing, but also probably not detrimental to performance.

[benben]

Instant user, I’d cut the crap out of stuff with that knife!

[Mr_Whiskerz]

It doesn't look great, but can you photograph the edge parallel to a metal straight edge and not backlit?

Best I can get for now.

The same person must have ground my K390 Delica Wharnie. It's janky in all the same ways.

It slices quite nicely though.

[vivi]

Just picked up a Delica Wharncliffe in K390 and immediately noticed the edge grind looked funky. Not an uneven bevel, but a cutting edge that isn't straight. It almost looks like a micro hawkbill towards the tip. Is this normal? My VG-10 Wharncliffe Delica is almost dead straight.

I've seen this on a couple of spydies I've owned, and some wharnies from other companies too.

I try to buy wharncliffes in person because of this.

My Ronin 2 is like this. Sharpening the tip area with a wide bench stone is a bit challenging because of that, but the knife still cuts well.

[Traditional.Sharpening]

Yes, it is normal and what I would expect when a human being is grinding a straight edge like a wharnecliffe using a powered grinder. Getting that edge perfectly straight and flat is something that I believe can only be done properly using a perfectly flat bench stone. Ask me how I know... . I may have done a few of them and **** if it's not easy on the grinder at all.

If you want it perfectly flat then you'll need a really flat bench-stone (duh) and focus grinding on only the sections of the blade that are touching when you put the edge along a perfectly straight edge (don't use that Spydie box, it's not that straight). You'll have to keeping checking the straight edge and the preferential grinding until it's perfectly flat.

Perhaps this sort of thing is a reason for the Wharnie's going the way of the Dodo bird. Seems consumers may have very high expectations of what 'proper sharpening' means on a production knife and maybe there were too many returns. If you've never tried to do sharpening work at a reasonable volume and time standard then it's easy to nitpick this stuff to death.

Personally, the picture you provide is why I like edges with a very slight curve to them. The issue will be in sharpening that knife without changing the shape of the edge, that it will be likely be that the recurved spot towards the front and maybe near the plunge line, will not be easily contacted on most benchstones and therefore not get sharp easily.

The other issue presented is once you do get a perfectly straight edge on it then the whole edge contacts the edge at once, which lowers contact pressures on the stone (force applied over a given area) as contact area increases. This can slow grinding on stones and even cause issues with glazing of waterstones, etc., due to the lower pressures.

[ejames13]

Yes, it is normal and what I would expect when a human being is grinding a straight edge like a wharnecliffe using a powered grinder. Getting that edge perfectly straight and flat is something that I believe can only be done properly using a perfectly flat bench stone. Ask me how I know... . I may have done a few of them and **** if it's not easy on the grinder at all.

If you want it perfectly flat then you'll need a really flat bench-stone (duh) and focus grinding on only the sections of the blade that are touching when you put the edge along a perfectly straight edge (don't use that Spydie box, it's not that straight). You'll have to keeping checking the straight edge and the preferential grinding until it's perfectly flat.

Perhaps this sort of thing is a reason for the Wharnie's going the way of the Dodo bird. Seems consumers may have very high expectations of what 'proper sharpening' means on a production knife and maybe there were too many returns. If you've never tried to do sharpening work at a reasonable volume and time standard then it's easy to nitpick this stuff to death.

Personally, the picture you provide is why I like edges with a very slight curve to them. The issue will be in sharpening that knife without changing the shape of the edge, that it will be likely be that the recurved spot towards the front and maybe near the plunge line, will not be easily contacted on most benchstones and therefore not get sharp easily.

The other issue presented is once you do get a perfectly straight edge on it then the whole edge contacts the edge at once, which lowers contact pressures on the stone (force applied over a given area) as contact area increases. This can slow grinding on stones and even cause issues with glazing of waterstones, etc., due to the lower pressures.

What about grinding the edge at 90 degrees on the stone to straighten, then re-sharpen as normal?

[Traditional.Sharpening]

Yes, it is normal and what I would expect when a human being is grinding a straight edge like a wharnecliffe using a powered grinder. Getting that edge perfectly straight and flat is something that I believe can only be done properly using a perfectly flat bench stone. Ask me how I know... . I may have done a few of them and **** if it's not easy on the grinder at all.

If you want it perfectly flat then you'll need a really flat bench-stone (duh) and focus grinding on only the sections of the blade that are touching when you put the edge along a perfectly straight edge (don't use that Spydie box, it's not that straight). You'll have to keeping checking the straight edge and the preferential grinding until it's perfectly flat.

Perhaps this sort of thing is a reason for the Wharnie's going the way of the Dodo bird. Seems consumers may have very high expectations of what 'proper sharpening' means on a production knife and maybe there were too many returns. If you've never tried to do sharpening work at a reasonable volume and time standard then it's easy to nitpick this stuff to death.

Personally, the picture you provide is why I like edges with a very slight curve to them. The issue will be in sharpening that knife without changing the shape of the edge, that it will be likely be that the recurved spot towards the front and maybe near the plunge line, will not be easily contacted on most benchstones and therefore not get sharp easily.

The other issue presented is once you do get a perfectly straight edge on it then the whole edge contacts the edge at once, which lowers contact pressures on the stone (force applied over a given area) as contact area increases. This can slow grinding on stones and even cause issues with glazing of waterstones, etc., due to the lower pressures.

What about grinding the edge at 90 degrees on the stone to straighten, then re-sharpen as normal?

That's probably the fastest way but depending on your bench-stone it's also the approach that's likely to damage the stone the most rapidly. Normally I'd say grab a coarse India stone but in this case it's a very Vanadium carbide-rich steel and may just glaze that stone too rapidly to keep cutting well. You might do better with a coarse Crystolon in this case but even that may wear too quickly. If you do this with diamond/CBN plates then they really stand a high chance of being damaged this way. Softer waterstones will wear very quickly doing this and likely gouge as well.

[ejames13]

Yes, it is normal and what I would expect when a human being is grinding a straight edge like a wharnecliffe using a powered grinder. Getting that edge perfectly straight and flat is something that I believe can only be done properly using a perfectly flat bench stone. Ask me how I know... . I may have done a few of them and **** if it's not easy on the grinder at all.

If you want it perfectly flat then you'll need a really flat bench-stone (duh) and focus grinding on only the sections of the blade that are touching when you put the edge along a perfectly straight edge (don't use that Spydie box, it's not that straight). You'll have to keeping checking the straight edge and the preferential grinding until it's perfectly flat.

Perhaps this sort of thing is a reason for the Wharnie's going the way of the Dodo bird. Seems consumers may have very high expectations of what 'proper sharpening' means on a production knife and maybe there were too many returns. If you've never tried to do sharpening work at a reasonable volume and time standard then it's easy to nitpick this stuff to death.

Personally, the picture you provide is why I like edges with a very slight curve to them. The issue will be in sharpening that knife without changing the shape of the edge, that it will be likely be that the recurved spot towards the front and maybe near the plunge line, will not be easily contacted on most benchstones and therefore not get sharp easily.

The other issue presented is once you do get a perfectly straight edge on it then the whole edge contacts the edge at once, which lowers contact pressures on the stone (force applied over a given area) as contact area increases. This can slow grinding on stones and even cause issues with glazing of waterstones, etc., due to the lower pressures.

What about grinding the edge at 90 degrees on the stone to straighten, then re-sharpen as normal?

That's probably the fastest way but depending on your bench-stone it's also the approach that's likely to damage the stone the most rapidly. Normally I'd say grab a coarse India stone but in this case it's a very Vanadium carbide-rich steel and may just glaze that stone too rapidly to keep cutting well. You might do better with a coarse Crystolon in this case but even that may wear too quickly. If you do this with diamond/CBN plates then they really stand a high chance of being damaged this way. Softer waterstones will wear very quickly doing this and likely gouge as well.

I have a CKTG 180 grit diamond flattening plate that's already seen a fair amount of hard use and just keeps on going. I might give it a go on that. It was relatively inexpensive.

[Traditional.Sharpening]

Yes, it is normal and what I would expect when a human being is grinding a straight edge like a wharnecliffe using a powered grinder. Getting that edge perfectly straight and flat is something that I believe can only be done properly using a perfectly flat bench stone. Ask me how I know... . I may have done a few of them and **** if it's not easy on the grinder at all.

If you want it perfectly flat then you'll need a really flat bench-stone (duh) and focus grinding on only the sections of the blade that are touching when you put the edge along a perfectly straight edge (don't use that Spydie box, it's not that straight). You'll have to keeping checking the straight edge and the preferential grinding until it's perfectly flat.

Perhaps this sort of thing is a reason for the Wharnie's going the way of the Dodo bird. Seems consumers may have very high expectations of what 'proper sharpening' means on a production knife and maybe there were too many returns. If you've never tried to do sharpening work at a reasonable volume and time standard then it's easy to nitpick this stuff to death.

Personally, the picture you provide is why I like edges with a very slight curve to them. The issue will be in sharpening that knife without changing the shape of the edge, that it will be likely be that the recurved spot towards the front and maybe near the plunge line, will not be easily contacted on most benchstones and therefore not get sharp easily.

The other issue presented is once you do get a perfectly straight edge on it then the whole edge contacts the edge at once, which lowers contact pressures on the stone (force applied over a given area) as contact area increases. This can slow grinding on stones and even cause issues with glazing of waterstones, etc., due to the lower pressures.

What about grinding the edge at 90 degrees on the stone to straighten, then re-sharpen as normal?

That's probably the fastest way but depending on your bench-stone it's also the approach that's likely to damage the stone the most rapidly. Normally I'd say grab a coarse India stone but in this case it's a very Vanadium carbide-rich steel and may just glaze that stone too rapidly to keep cutting well. You might do better with a coarse Crystolon in this case but even that may wear too quickly. If you do this with diamond/CBN plates then they really stand a high chance of being damaged this way. Softer waterstones will wear very quickly doing this and likely gouge as well.

I have a CKTG 180 grit diamond flattening plate that's already seen a fair amount of hard use and just keeps on going. I might give it a go on that. It was relatively inexpensive.

Best in that case to go over 90 degrees then I'd say. Use lightest force possible as contact pressure will be very high regardless. Use a lubricant, an oil may be best there but water is better than nothing.

[Guts]

The wharncliffes have had pretty wonky factory bevels in my experience. Just the nature of a long straight edge being sharpened on a belt grinder I suppose. Almost every single one I own from Spyderco, no matter the factory (Dragonfly, Rockjumper, Manbug, PM2, Yojimbo, McBee, etc.) has exhibited the uneven grind. Some were worse than others. The Yojimbo has been the best actually now that I think about it. Go figure.

Here's a mid-sharpening shot of my Cutleryshoppe PM2 wharnie exclusive, and you can see the remains of the factory edge and how uneven the bevel was from the factory. Doesn't bother me too much since I generally sharpen up any knife right away, but still a little annoying to correct. They cut like lasers once the bevel is evened out and sharpend though that's for sure.

[Flash]

Duplicate

[Flash]

Not the worst I’ve seen on a wharncliffe blade.
I had a Rough Rodger wharny once that was more like a full on recurve! But it was very cheap. …unlike the Delica.

Send it back if you can.

One of the main draws of a wharncliffe blade is the edge is easy to sharpen - yours is not going to be, and because of the state it’s in you will need to hog a lot of life off that edge with diamond stones for it to become straight and even.

The bare minimum of new knife ownership in my opinion is that don’t have to spend hours of your life rubbing your new knife on a diamond stone before you even get to cut anything with it.

[ejames13]

Not the worst I’ve seen on a wharncliffe blade.
I had a Rough Rodger wharny once that was more like a full on recurve! But it was very cheap. …unlike the Delica.

Send it back if you can.

One of the main draws of a wharncliffe blade is the edge is easy to sharpen - yours is not going to be, and because of the state it’s in you will need to hog a lot of life off that edge with diamond stones for it to become straight and even.

The bare minimum of new knife ownership in my opinion is that don’t have to spend hours of your life rubbing your new knife on a diamond stone before you even get to cut anything with it.

I contacted the seller (National Knives). They checked their remaining inventory and said every Delica K390 had a similar “hawkbill” profile toward the tip.

[endura3]

My K390 wharnie came from the factory pretty uneven too - I don't have any pictures prior to sharpening but it was noticeably uneven with that same mini 'hawkbill' near the tip and another uneven spot near the heel of the blade.

It sharpened up just fine - the only downside was that I had to take off a lot of material to get the edge straight enough to sharpen properly on a bench stone.

[ejames13]

My K390 wharnie came from the factory pretty uneven too - I don't have any pictures prior to sharpening but it was noticeably uneven with that same mini 'hawkbill' near the tip and another uneven spot near the heel of the blade.

It sharpened up just fine - the only downside was that I had to take off a lot of material to get the edge straight enough to sharpen properly on a bench stone.

How did you true up the edge?

[Flash]

Not the worst I’ve seen on a wharncliffe blade.
I had a Rough Rodger wharny once that was more like a full on recurve! But it was very cheap. …unlike the Delica.

Send it back if you can.

One of the main draws of a wharncliffe blade is the edge is easy to sharpen - yours is not going to be, and because of the state it’s in you will need to hog a lot of life off that edge with diamond stones for it to become straight and even.

The bare minimum of new knife ownership in my opinion is that don’t have to spend hours of your life rubbing your new knife on a diamond stone before you even get to cut anything with it.

I contacted the seller (National Knives). They checked their remaining inventory and said every Delica K390 had a similar “hawkbill” profile toward the tip.

Send back for a refund then put a wanted ad out there. There must be plenty of K390 wharny delicas in circulation that do not have a hawksbill - I own one myself.

I have no idea how Seki are allowed to pass off hawkbill shaped blades as a Wharncliffe. The Wharncliffe blade shape is supposed to have a straight edge, it is essentially it’s defining feature.

Maybe the apprentice was doing the grinding …or maybe he was on QC inspection that day?