Spyderco Forums

I was initially quite excited when I saw this MULE was coming down the pipeline, however, after spending a bit more time with 15V, I was left sort of wondering if a "less stellar" version is worth forking out more coin on; especially aftering enjoying T15 so much. Usage and testing has halted quite a bit lately, due to other commitments and interest for the time being. With funds being tight at the moment, I'm hoping to score a pair (along with a couple more T15s..) after next payday to see what the fuss (or lack of?) is about. I've not tasted any flavor of 10V.

Anyone have any feedback on sharpening/usage yet?!

Bolster wrote: ↑

Fri Aug 25, 2023 10:27 pm

699 available Aug 25. Scratching my head why these aren't flying off the shelf (well, higher price than normal)...very top grade steel though, and remarkably tough for its very high edge retention. Seems worth the +$20.

Of course, I don't understand why any AEB-L are available either...what an unusual hard heat treat on such a tough steel. Really a unique item.

I think a lot of it just comes down to the fact that there was WAY more hype surrounding steels like 15V or MagnaCut. Then on top of that, I kind of suspect that many people who may be aware of 10V, might not be aware that K294 is a functional equivalent, or perhaps might think the availability and similarity of K390 leaves a dearth of interest.

Personally, I want the AEB-L, but at the same time feel like I don't really have a need for it. It would be nice to get it at a hardness usually only seen from custom makers, but that's all that really interests me about it. Otherwise I have got 420HC and 14C28N blades already if I was interested in a super tough stainless.

Meanwhile the T15 seems kind of interesting, but then also at the same time it seems like it's basically similar to 10V in toughness but with a little less wear resistance.

weeping minora wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 28, 2023 1:25 am

I was initially quite excited when I saw this MULE was coming down the pipeline, however, after spending a bit more time with 15V, I was left sort of wondering if a "less stellar" version is worth forking out more coin on; especially aftering enjoying T15 so much. Usage and testing has halted quite a bit lately, due to other commitments and interest for the time being. With funds being tight at the moment, I'm hoping to score a pair (along with a couple more T15s..) after next payday to see what the fuss (or lack of?) is about. I've not tasted any flavor of 10V.

Anyone have any feedback on sharpening/usage yet?!

I've sharpened up my K294 mule already. Don't have too much usage with it yet, only used it out in the garden yesterday. Tomato stems were no match for it . It did pick up some light corrosion already looking at it later since I didn't clean it afterward. The corrosion came right off with some bar keeper's friend however.

Anyway, freehanded my K294 mule going from F240->F400->F800->F1200 on my Venev resin bonded diamond stones, then 1um->0.25um gunny juice on leather. Not sure what angle it was as I just followed the factory angle for the most part, guessing it's around 12-13dps, but was trying to even out the super wonky bevel from the factory. Did a polished edge since I already put the work into evening out the bevel, and it came out really nice without much fuss. Deburred super easy. Just like 10V in my experience. Super sharp. If it's anything like my 10V Para 3, won't really have to sharpen it often since it'll respond to strops very well. We'll see.

In Stock Mule Teams with Quantity on Hand:

Well, this is certainly nice. I come lazily along a week after the drop date and find this still available. So I just ordered two.

The PMA11 mule was always one of my favorites and I have mine handy at all times -- in fact here it is right now! So I will be happy to have these. Yes it is crazy to have so many mules one after the other.

Guts wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 28, 2023 8:37 am

weeping minora wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 28, 2023 1:25 am

I was initially quite excited when I saw this MULE was coming down the pipeline, however, after spending a bit more time with 15V, I was left sort of wondering if a "less stellar" version is worth forking out more coin on; especially aftering enjoying T15 so much. Usage and testing has halted quite a bit lately, due to other commitments and interest for the time being. With funds being tight at the moment, I'm hoping to score a pair (along with a couple more T15s..) after next payday to see what the fuss (or lack of?) is about. I've not tasted any flavor of 10V.

Anyone have any feedback on sharpening/usage yet?!

I've sharpened up my K294 mule already. Don't have too much usage with it yet, only used it out in the garden yesterday. Tomato stems were no match for it . It did pick up some light corrosion already looking at it later since I didn't clean it afterward. The corrosion came right off with some bar keeper's friend however.

Anyway, freehanded my K294 mule going from F240->F400->F800->F1200 on my Venev resin bonded diamond stones, then 1um->0.25um gunny juice on leather. Not sure what angle it was as I just followed the factory angle for the most part, guessing it's around 12-13dps, but was trying to even out the super wonky bevel from the factory. Did a polished edge since I already put the work into evening out the bevel, and it came out really nice without much fuss. Deburred super easy. Just like 10V in my experience. Super sharp. If it's anything like my 10V Para 3, won't really have to sharpen it often since it'll respond to strops very well. We'll see.

Thanks, Guts!

I see Seki is still not sharpening to the plunge .

Do you find the edge polishes out, or retains aggression when taking it to the higher grits? I typically stop my progression with the Venev 400 and get incredible aggression from the stone. I find if I sharpen using their OCB stones, they seem to lose too much aggression for my taste (I prefer their "Legacy" binder stones, which are the lower grits: 240/400 and below).

weeping minora wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 8:41 pm

Thanks, Guts!

I see Seki is still not sharpening to the plunge .

Do you find the edge polishes out, or retains aggression when taking it to the higher grits? I typically stop my progression with the Venev 400 and get incredible aggression from the stone. I find if I sharpen using their OCB stones, they seem to lose too much aggression for my taste (I prefer their "Legacy" binder stones, which are the lower grits: 240/400 and below).

On the mules I own, only the AEB-L mule was sharpened down to the plunge from the factory, slightly lower than the plunge actually .

As far as aggression after sharpening, I'd say it retains a decent amount. The K294 mule sharpening happened to turn out well for me. It could easily slice through a paper towel just held in my hand, which for me only happens if the edge has a bit of aggression. Whittled hair as well, so good enough for me. Could still do this too after my progression, which isn't happening unless it has aggression for sure https://i.imgur.com/gAPeVOt.gifv

I agree though, the F400 is generally what I'd stop at if I just wanted good aggression but not too jagged a bevel. When I get new (to me) steels I do the full progression just to see how it responds. I really like the edges that come off the Venev stones though. Been wanting to try out some of the CGSW resin bonded stones, but they're pretty pricy. Technically double what a Venev costs these days since you get two sides of abrasives with the Venev, whereas you only get one side of abrasive with the CGSW for around the same price.

Nice work on that edge Guts! Hoping to reprofile my K294 Mule in the next couple days or so.

Guts wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 30, 2023 8:53 am

weeping minora wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 8:41 pm

Thanks, Guts!

I see Seki is still not sharpening to the plunge .

Do you find the edge polishes out, or retains aggression when taking it to the higher grits? I typically stop my progression with the Venev 400 and get incredible aggression from the stone. I find if I sharpen using their OCB stones, they seem to lose too much aggression for my taste (I prefer their "Legacy" binder stones, which are the lower grits: 240/400 and below).

On the mules I own, only the AEB-L mule was sharpened down to the plunge from the factory, slightly lower than the plunge actually .

As far as aggression after sharpening, I'd say it retains a decent amount. The K294 mule sharpening happened to turn out well for me. It could easily slice through a paper towel just held in my hand, which for me only happens if the edge has a bit of aggression. Whittled hair as well, so good enough for me. Could still do this too after my progression, which isn't happening unless it has aggression for sure https://i.imgur.com/gAPeVOt.gifv

I agree though, the F400 is generally what I'd stop at if I just wanted good aggression but not too jagged a bevel. When I get new (to me) steels I do the full progression just to see how it responds. I really like the edges that come off the Venev stones though. Been wanting to try out some of the CGSW resin bonded stones, but they're pretty pricy. Technically double what a Venev costs these days since you get two sides of abrasives with the Venev, whereas you only get one side of abrasive with the CGSW for around the same price.

Maniago sure did get the first few (handful) of sharpenings out of the AEB-L MULE for us all to enjoy our post factory edges !!

Looks like it's working out very well. That Mule Will Kick!

I usually start off taking my edges to that 400 grit standard and every once in a while (usually steel dependant, personally) when I'm feeling froggy, I'll leap up to finish on the 800 or 1200 stone. I agree with you, Venev offers an exceptional edge.

Columbia Gorge was on my radar, since the Venev stones seem to be quite sparse these days (for the political reasons that I will refrain from), as I was looking for an additional stone and a back-up. The one thing that hung me up when looking at CGSW was that they rate their grits in micron. It has been a while since I've used my handy Shapton Glass stones, doing the grit/micron conversion for me .

Nonetheless, they seem to be very well received (at least the Edge Pro Matrix stones, which are supposedly the same stones as the CGSW, being made and marketed solely for the guided system instead of freehand). One day I'm sure I'll pull the trigger on a set, as I'll just have to know how they compare .

weeping minora wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 31, 2023 9:51 pm

Maniago sure did get the first few (handful) of sharpenings out of the AEB-L MULE for us all to enjoy our post factory edges !!

Looks like it's working out very well. That Mule Will Kick!

I usually start off taking my edges to that 400 grit standard and every once in a while (usually steel dependant, personally) when I'm feeling froggy, I'll leap up to finish on the 800 or 1200 stone. I agree with you, Venev offers an exceptional edge.

Columbia Gorge was on my radar, since the Venev stones seem to be quite sparse these days (for the political reasons that I will refrain from), as I was looking for an additional stone and a back-up. The one thing that hung me up when looking at CGSW was that they rate their grits in micron. It has been a while since I've used my handy Shapton Glass stones, doing the grit/micron conversion for me .

Nonetheless, they seem to be very well received (at least the Edge Pro Matrix stones, which are supposedly the same stones as the CGSW, being made and marketed solely for the guided system instead of freehand). One day I'm sure I'll pull the trigger on a set, as I'll just have to know how they compare .

Lol yeah I try and think in terms of microns these days since every stone mfg seems to have their own unique grit rating (seems like it anyway), yet microns are the same across the board. Trying to decipher that gritomatic grit chart is an exercise in patience sometimes .

Regarding the CGSW stones, I too saw that they're the ones making the Edge Pro stones. They do have very good feedback on all the reviews I've read so I'll definitely be grabbing some in the future too, just not sure which micron rating I want to go with. Likely the 5 micron first just to see how it fares as a finishing stone. Saw a direct comparison of the CGSW over on bladeforum with the Venev stones that showed the former in 5 micron having a nicer scratch pattern vs the latter at 3/2 micron (F1200) which was interesting.

vanka wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 09, 2023 5:58 am

I'm on it. K294 is the European equivalent of CPM 10V.

that's what I read somewhere else, so that begs the question, what's the motivation for making it a mule?

weeping minora wrote: ↑

Tue Aug 29, 2023 8:41 pm

Guts wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 28, 2023 8:37 am

weeping minora wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 28, 2023 1:25 am

I was initially quite excited when I saw this MULE was coming down the pipeline, however, after spending a bit more time with 15V, I was left sort of wondering if a "less stellar" version is worth forking out more coin on; especially aftering enjoying T15 so much. Usage and testing has halted quite a bit lately, due to other commitments and interest for the time being. With funds being tight at the moment, I'm hoping to score a pair (along with a couple more T15s..) after next payday to see what the fuss (or lack of?) is about. I've not tasted any flavor of 10V.

Anyone have any feedback on sharpening/usage yet?!

I've sharpened up my K294 mule already. Don't have too much usage with it yet, only used it out in the garden yesterday. Tomato stems were no match for it . It did pick up some light corrosion already looking at it later since I didn't clean it afterward. The corrosion came right off with some bar keeper's friend however.

Anyway, freehanded my K294 mule going from F240->F400->F800->F1200 on my Venev resin bonded diamond stones, then 1um->0.25um gunny juice on leather. Not sure what angle it was as I just followed the factory angle for the most part, guessing it's around 12-13dps, but was trying to even out the super wonky bevel from the factory. Did a polished edge since I already put the work into evening out the bevel, and it came out really nice without much fuss. Deburred super easy. Just like 10V in my experience. Super sharp. If it's anything like my 10V Para 3, won't really have to sharpen it often since it'll respond to strops very well. We'll see.

Thanks, Guts!

I see Seki is still not sharpening to the plunge .

Do you find the edge polishes out, or retains aggression when taking it to the higher grits? I typically stop my progression with the Venev 400 and get incredible aggression from the stone. I find if I sharpen using their OCB stones, they seem to lose too much aggression for my taste (I prefer their "Legacy" binder stones, which are the lower grits: 240/400 and below).

Nice scales. Where did you get them?

alphaneuron9 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 07, 2023 2:39 pm

vanka wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 09, 2023 5:58 am

I'm on it. K294 is the European equivalent of CPM 10V.

that's what I read somewhere else, so that begs the question, what's the motivation for making it a mule?

Not enough 10V is my best guess. It's most likely the availability at the time frame in the production plants. The pipeline is very busy and if a certain steel can't make it on time...
The fact that certain dealers have strips of 10V available or few knifemakers have small runs of knives, it doesn't mean it's readily available from Crucible. Those could be in circulation in the market for months. Spyderco needs sheets at certain thickness and size and that's a custom order. Or maybe i'm talking nonesence.

It sounds reasonable. One of the guys that works in production side of things should chime in. I imagine marketing could play a role.

alphaneuron9 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 07, 2023 2:43 pm

Nice scales. Where did you get them?

They're 3D printed. Found the model over on thingiverse and printed them myself. Saves me a good bit of money for every mule vs paying an extra $50 a pop for the G10 scales, plus there's tons of color options in terms of filament. I just put the extra money towards more Spyderco's . Pretty sure it was a member here who designed this particular set.

alphaneuron9 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 07, 2023 2:43 pm

Nice scales. Where did you get them?

Looks like one of the many scales I uploaded to thingiverse for 3d printing.
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5560027

Edit; got sniped copying the link lol.

So, did tried to force a patina with cranberry juice yesterday. Four hours, clean and dry, another two to get some depth. Here's what it looks like compared to REX 76:



Experiment to see if it helps with corrosion resistance as I plan to get this one out in the woods to compare it with stainless. We'll see!

aprivetera wrote: ↑

Fri Sep 08, 2023 6:55 am

So, did tried to force a patina with cranberry juice yesterday. Four hours, clean and dry, another two to get some depth. Here's what it looks like compared to REX 76:



Experiment to see if it helps with corrosion resistance as I plan to get this one out in the woods to compare it with stainless. We'll see!

Nice, cranberry juice is the best at being able to gauge it over time slowly with only subtle changes compared to other ingredients

Guts wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 07, 2023 4:17 pm

alphaneuron9 wrote: ↑

Thu Sep 07, 2023 2:43 pm

Nice scales. Where did you get them?

They're 3D printed. Found the model over on thingiverse and printed them myself. Saves me a good bit of money for every mule vs paying an extra $50 a pop for the G10 scales, plus there's tons of color options in terms of filament. I just put the extra money towards more Spyderco's . Pretty sure it was a member here who designed this particular set.

Man, Im glad I asked. Ive been wanting to get into 3D printing... suggest a website to learn about 3D printers so I can get on the bandwagon?

alphaneuron9 wrote: ↑

Sat Sep 09, 2023 4:41 pm

Man, Im glad I asked. Ive been wanting to get into 3D printing... suggest a website to learn about 3D printers so I can get on the bandwagon?

While you are gearing up, you can contact Josh Crutchley (the designer) or FullScaler (both on this forum) and see if they will print you a pair. FullScaler printed me a green set.