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Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 5:09 am
by max808
ChrisinHove wrote: ↑Fri Aug 05, 2022 5:29 am
I think these are wise words.
Thanks for the vote of confidence Chris. I hope you're enjoying the mild weather in Hove after these crazy couple weeks. They're saying more heatwaves are on the way...
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 7:01 am
by JD Spydo
Flipping over to fire starting devices I noticed a newer tool in one of my recent "Backwoodsman" magazine ads that is called the "FEUERSTOCK" ferro rod. There is a great Youtube video on this new Ferro Rod and how easy it is to use to start fires even in wet conditions.
If you all know of other nice fire starting devices I would like to review a few of them. Also that fire piston device made by "Wilderness Solutions" is also a great tool. I've got a pal that lives in Arkansas who tells me that their Fire Piston is a great way to start fires. Being able to start a fire in adverse conditions could be a real life saver.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 9:37 am
by TomAiello
max808 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 3:19 am
Thanks for sharing Tom, which Katadyn filter have you been using?
I'll dig it out of the camping supplies and look. I doubt it's a current model, because I've had it for so long.
It's basically the same as this one:
https://www.rei.com/product/653573/kata ... lsrc=aw.ds
Except that mine has a different color main body (same metal ends, though). I rigged up the gravity feed (which was not part of the factory system) many, many years ago.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 9:44 am
by TomAiello
JD Spydo wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 7:01 am
If you all know of other nice fire starting devices I would like to review a few of them. Also that fire piston device made by "Wilderness Solutions" is also a great tool. I've got a pal that lives in Arkansas who tells me that their Fire Piston is a great way to start fires. Being able to start a fire in adverse conditions could be a real life saver.
I geeked out on waterproof fire starting devices (for our emergency kits at work) a few years ago and settled on blast matches. I put in disposable bic lighters as a primary, but found that they can get crushed in hard impacts and broken, so I put in blast matches as backups.
https://www.rei.com/product/775076/ust- ... re-starter
I can't seem to find this version for sale at the moment, but the (less expensive) replacement appears to be this unit:
https://hardwareandmoreee.com/products/ ... NMEALw_wcB
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 3:48 pm
by Naperville
I typically do not post on the Spyderco Forums much because they have to approve each post and it take anywhere from a few hours to a few days to get a post online.
In any case, I was on Instagram and came across an interesting belt knife/sword for SHTF. The knife is interesting!
https://www.razorrazor.com/site/product ... zordagger/
BeltDagger Standard 6"-9" RazorDagger Concealed (EDC) - Civilian & LE/MIL (8" RD-T for SERE Training)
To Purchase – Scroll Down to Bottom of Page – We Ship Internationally
The standard RazorDagger has two variants – the narrower / smaller Executive RazorDagger and the wider / larger Tactical RazorDagger
– – – (1. RazorDagger Executive is 1.0″ wide, with overall lengths of 6″, 7″ and 8″. Designed for ultra narrow men’s belts and small women’s clothing.
– – – (2. RazorDagger Tactical is 1.25” wide, with overall lengths of 7”, 8”, and 9”. The RD-Tactical is wider, stronger, and more “muscular”; designed for elite LE/MIL, Counter Terror training, and civilians. (SERE Training recommends 8″ RD-T)
All “Body Contour Weapon Systems” are capable of sub-second deployment under stress.
RazorDagger Trainer (Below) was developed in collaboration with elite LE/MIL for their global training initiatives. For more information call 414-333-3300
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 4:10 pm
by JD Spydo
TomAiello wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 9:44 am
JD Spydo wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 7:01 am
If you all know of other nice fire starting devices I would like to review a few of them. Also that fire piston device made by "Wilderness Solutions" is also a great tool. I've got a pal that lives in Arkansas who tells me that their Fire Piston is a great way to start fires. Being able to start a fire in adverse conditions could be a real life saver.
I geeked out on waterproof fire starting devices (for our emergency kits at work) a few years ago and settled on blast matches. I put in disposable bic lighters as a primary, but found that they can get crushed in hard impacts and broken, so I put in blast matches as backups.
https://www.rei.com/product/775076/ust- ... re-starter
I can't seem to find this version for sale at the moment, but the (less expensive) replacement appears to be this unit:
https://hardwareandmoreee.com/products/ ... NMEALw_wcB
Are these "blastmatches" the same as those windproof matches that they talked so much about on American Survival Guide magazine a few years back? Hey I never said I wouldn't use matches or a Bic Lighter ( or any other Lighter)>> I'm just stressing that having the skill to create fire by other means is vitally important in a very stressful situation.
It goes back to a philosophy that I have lived by since I was in my 20s>> it simply states "WHATEVER WORKS". I"m just saying that it's always wise to have a back up plan for all of these skills and especially with first starting and water filtering.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:37 am
by aicolainen
JD, I don’t read survival magazines nor am I familiar with that particular ferro rod you’re referring to.
It might be very good, I haven’t looked into it. Generally my advice would be to not get too hung up on specific products.
Though the material composition of ferro rods vary a little bit, if you buy from a known/common brand, they perform well, they are affordable and easy to get hold of. My point being that by spending less time and money on the tiny details, you free up time and money for bigger issues.
I have a handful of ferro rods lying around, most I don’t even know the brand name of, and the performance is pretty much indistinguishable. I use them for fun when we are out in the woods on day hikes or camping trips. The kids love to make fires with ferro rods and think it’s super fun. It’s a great way to practice basic skills and learn how to use this robust and reliable backup in case it one day becomes the only available option.
It’s always just for fun, though. If I or someone in my company is really cold or really hungry I opt for the quickest solution.
The 40L backpack I typically carry when I out on day trips with the kids has a couple of small items I never take out, among them; a small-ish ferro rod, Bic lighter, regular matches and storm-/waterproof matches. In addition there’s a piezo igniter in my stove kit. I live in a pretty cold climate, where the weather can turn from warm and nice to full blown blizzard in minutes, so I don’t gamble with being able to stay warm when taking young kids out in nature. Options is your friend, especially in the winter.
This got long winded as usual.. bottom line: get some decent, affordable ferro rods and get out there and use them in varied conditions and on different materials. Experience and skills will be more important than tracking down the ultimate version of a tool. And get a few in different sizes, so you have one close by when you need it.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 1:08 pm
by aicolainen
TomAiello wrote: ↑Thu Aug 04, 2022 5:20 pm
aicolainen wrote: ↑Thu Aug 04, 2022 2:06 pm
I kind of like Joe Rogan's take on how to deal with hardship and the stresses of life, which is basically that he makes sure to voluntarily expose himself to physical stress that is way harder and more painful than the stress of being famous and continuously targeted by critics .
If you have the time, this is an excellent book on that topic:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifragile_(book)
Thanks for the tip!
I haven't stumbled upon that book before, though I'm not new to the concept. The physical aspect of anti fragility is thoroughly covered in evolutionary biology, which I've become quite interested in. And some well known psychologist, like Jonathan Haidt, cover the mental side of it quite convincingly.
My reading list is growing at a faster pace than my reading capacity can keep up with, but your recommendation is added to the list, so I'll get there eventually :)
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Sun Aug 07, 2022 2:09 pm
by TomAiello
JD Spydo wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 4:10 pm
Are these "blastmatches" the same as those windproof matches that they talked so much about on American Survival Guide magazine a few years back?
I don't think so. I don't read any survival magazines, so I can't say for sure, but the BlastMatch is basically just a ferro rod with a built in striking mechanism, so you can strike it quickly and reliably against any surface.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:02 am
by Co Pilot
Have we actually made it to page two of a thread about survival without talking about guns?!? Lol. Seriously you'll probably need some and to know how to use them. Especially in a suburban environment. Where do you think all those pleasant desperate people from the cities are going to end up?
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 8:51 am
by aicolainen
Co Pilot wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:02 am
Have we actually made it to page two of a thread about survival without talking about guns?!? Lol. Seriously you'll probably need some and to know how to use them. Especially in a suburban environment. Where do you think all those pleasant desperate people from the cities are going to end up?
I believe the demographics of this forum is such that most anyone here that could legally own a gun, most probably does so already.
And while you're right about the advantage of owning guns and being proficient, it's a situation we all like to avoid. There's a lot one can do to improve ones situation in uncertain times. Building communities and make robust plans to ensure you always have a better option than (armed) conflict is some of what goes into that. If the day comes when I have to defend my family and resources with a gun, I'll be glad to have that option, but no matter the outcome, it will be the saddest and most heartbreaking day ever.
While having access to firearms most likely puts you in a better position than not having that access, it comes (as always) with great responsibility.
Especially with family and or some kind of community involved, you don't want to risk unnecessary escalation.
And... always plan to fail.
If you're not able defend yourself, make sure you leave as few functioning firearms and ammunition behind as possible. Enabling immoral people to hurt others is not the legacy you'll like to leave behind.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 10:40 am
by JRinFL
400 million people (in the US) all starving, angry, & desperate? Hiding will be the key to survival. If you have it and they need it AND can find you, they will take it. Banding together will help, as long as your band is bigger and/or stronger than their band. Strong, unified communities are also key, but we have spent 40 -50 years making sure our communities are divided. In my opinion at least.
I only prep for short term emergencies, 30 days or less. Anything more is pointless for someone my age, I think. You gotta be honest about these things.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 11:59 am
by TomAiello
I don't think that it's realistic to plan for a total, nation (or world) wide societal breakdown. If a situation lasts longer than 30 days, something is desperately wrong, and you're going to want to start planting seeds so you have food next year.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:51 pm
by TomAiello
Co Pilot wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:02 am
Have we actually made it to page two of a thread about survival without talking about guns?!? Lol. Seriously you'll probably need some and to know how to use them. Especially in a suburban environment. Where do you think all those pleasant desperate people from the cities are going to end up?
I actually think a bolt action rifle in a common caliber is likely to be a lot more useful in a survival situation than a lighter semi-auto like and AR or AK. If I had to pick one 'survival' rifle it would be something like my Ruger Scout Rifle in .308. If I needed a defensive weapon, then I'd be looking at semi-autos.
I live in a relatively peaceful, fairly rural area with virtually no crime, and I don't think general social unrest would get very far here. Honestly, that's one of the best reasons to live somewhere like this.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 5:04 pm
by JD Spydo
Co Pilot wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:02 am
Have we actually made it to page two of a thread about survival without talking about guns?!? Lol. Seriously you'll probably need some and to know how to use them. Especially in a suburban environment. Where do you think all those pleasant desperate people from the cities are going to end up?
No doubt that dependable firearms are an extremely important part of a survival strategy. As far as adding them to this conversation there is so much difference of opinion on that subject that I just don't really know where to begin. It's really deep enough to be a subject and thread all it's own.
Plus gun laws vary so much in many different states here in the USA I'm kind of leery to recommend certain firearms because again I don't know all the laws in all the states. Some states like Massachusetts for instance have such draconian laws on all guns that it's just hard to share that kind of information without the risk of giving people information that could get them in a legal nightmare. So I'm going to let people check the laws in their own states, counties, provinces and municipalities and they can determine that for themselves.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 5:17 pm
by JD Spydo
TomAiello wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 11:59 am
I don't think that it's realistic to plan for a total, nation (or world) wide societal breakdown. If a situation lasts longer than 30 days, something is desperately wrong, and you're going to want to start planting seeds so you have food next year.
And Tom if that is truly the case I'm wondering just how many people could endure an extended long term survival situation unless they've had a lot of extensive training and have access to vast resources. It does bother me to think that such a huge percentage of average people would really be behind the 8 ball so to speak if some type of tragedy would last for 30 days plus.
I do know that there is a group of people that hang out here on Spyderco.com that are up to speed on the subject of survival.
But other than guns there are so many more tools and supplies we can focus on. However if all the guys/gals here on this thread want to discuss firearms I just hope they use some wisdom in doing so.
I will say one thing about guns in a survival situation. I do think everyone should own at least one shotgun. Not only are they good for self defense they are great for all kinds of hunting as well.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2022 9:07 pm
by TomAiello
If you want to talk about scenarios of total societal collapse, I'd start thinking about arable land, seed libraries, and access to water. If that's where your reasoning is headed, I think that 'move to somewhere rural' would probably be at the top of the agenda, so you could buy enough land to support yourself (and any family) for the long term.
On the subject of rifles, a bolt action hunting rifle with a magazine less than 5 rounds is going to be legal everywhere in the USA, and is probably going to be a lot more useful than most 'gun guy' type guns. Even more useful will be _practice_ in hunting with your rifle and a knowledge of where in your local area you can find game. Skill trumps equipment every single time. Rather than spending a ton of money on equipment, spend a ton of time on practice and skill building.
Another subject that is often overlooked by survival hobbyists is personal fitness. No amount of equipment is going to help if you can't hike around carrying it, and someone who has maintained some fitness prior to a societal collapse will be in a much better position to survive the initial phases.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 6:58 am
by max808
TomAiello wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 9:37 am
max808 wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 3:19 am
Thanks for sharing Tom, which Katadyn filter have you been using?
I'll dig it out of the camping supplies and look. I doubt it's a current model, because I've had it for so long.
It's basically the same as this one:
https://www.rei.com/product/653573/kata ... lsrc=aw.ds
Except that mine has a different color main body (same metal ends, though). I rigged up the gravity feed (which was not part of the factory system) many, many years ago.
Good call Tom, that's probably the one to own in the long run. They now make that Pocket in a blacked out version too but I'm always partial to blank steel.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 7:02 am
by ChrisinHove
I find it hard to imagine how a total societal breakdown where everyone runs to the hills could come about. Martial law would be quickly and effectively imposed, although there would probably be some window of chaos.
Certainly you would want to be located further than a gas tank plus at least one days walk from any large centre of population. That’s probably why the survivalist-type ethos is not particularly common over here.
Re: Suburban Survival: Options? Tools & Supplies?
Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2022 9:21 am
by Ankerson
JD Spydo wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 1:26 pm
I live about 25 miles east of a major metropolitan city here in the USA ( Kansas City, MO USA). I've been doing a lot of deep thinking in the past 6 months or so regarding what I'm seeing taking place around me. Here in our community we are having a huge amount of mortgage foreclosures, skyrocketing rent prices, skyrocketing food prices, gasoline ects not like I've ever remember ever seeing before. It truly seems like everyone I know that I'm close to are currently under severe financial strain of some sort. Personally I feel like I've got a pretty secure situation at this time but I don't feel totally safe because there is so much happening around me that would indicate the possibility of some type of financial or societal collapse looming. And I hope I'm completely wrong.
My title Surburban Survival is just something that popped into my head today. Because I'm seeing so many people so stressed out here lately that I really don't feel so secure in an otherwise very financially secure town/city here in the USA. My older relatives which are mostly passed on now all told me of the horrors of the Great Depression of the late 20s/early 30s. At the time when I first heard it all I thought a lot of it was just BS and gross exaggeration but after doing my own research it was truly a miserable time for most people who lived through it.
I'm 68 and I've lived through a lot of recessions, 2 stock market crashes and a personal financial trainwreck I endured in 2010-11. I've taken it on the chin a couple of times in my lifespan but I've never seen anything like I'm seeing now. It never hurts to know more about basic survival skills and knowledge of where to go to hide in case of a SHTF scenario. I've been studying survival as kind of a hobby for over 20 years as a past time and read magazines like the "Backwoodsman", American Survival Guide and OFF GRID just to name a few. And there is good wisdom and knowledge to be gained from those sources and several other sources of information that are currently available. But I doubt if anything can truly prepare a person who has had it pretty good most of their life ( as I have had) for an all out collapse. I'm fearful that my generation and generations behind me like GEN X, Millenials ect. are mostly going to be caught totally unprepared. Because let's face it most of us here in the USA are soft and pampered compared to many other countries.
I feel like I have several advantages living in a upper class suburb but I think we need to talk about this subject if we can. But I also feel like this current unrest that is going on in most of the country could get way out of a hand pretty quickly. So I hope we can share information on what to be prepared for. I'm looking forward to your replies and any pertinent information you all can share. And maybe there are game plans that everyone here could benefit from.
Personally I think people have watched RED DAWN too many times.
If something actually really did happen here in the US, there are about what 350 Million people here now....
Bottom line here, things will get better, the supply chains will open back up and the prices will go back down again.
Well
some people just love Capitalism, that is until it hits them right in the wallet...
Seems to me however the ones who love it the most are crying and screaming the loudest right now.
