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Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 2:50 pm
by ugaarguy
There's been a fair bit of talk about pricing recently, and I've been thinking about over the past few weeks myself. The Native 5 G10 now has a MAP price of $180.95. Spyderco's lowest priced, US made, locking blade, folder is the riveted construction Manix 2 lightweight with FRCP handle and BD1N blade.
Meanwhile, Buck has switched the 110 and 112 Slim Pro over to screw together construction this year. They've managed (based on Knife Center pre-order pricing) to get the street price 112 Slim Pro TRX to a penny under $100. USA made, 3" S30V blade, liner-less G10 handles, metal thread inserst - All just like the Native 5 G10. And Buck is going to ship it with deep carry clip with flush fit / countersunk clip screws. Even the base model plastic handle is now $120.75 MAP. Look at the 2022 MAP prices on the Delica, Endura, and Chaparral as well.
I own four Native 5's, and have a Magancut N5 Salt on pre-order. So, I understand first hand how good the Native 5 is, and I know it's much more refined than almost any other back lock on the market. But I'm not sure that I can adequately articulate why it's that much better. And I'm starting to have a hard time justifying the price of many Spyderco knives vs. competitors.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 3:12 pm
by Mushroom
Buck has been in business since 1902 and they’re a much larger company than Spyderco. Buck and Spyderco operate at different scales, which probably allows Buck to offer lower prices.
There are a plethora of reasons why Spyderco has to price their products the way they do and many of those reasons are simply not going to be shared with the public. I trust that Spyderco is not increasing prices just for the sake of doing so.
Value is subjective. If you can’t personally justify the cost of a Spyderco, I hope you enjoy that new Buck knife.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 3:22 pm
by JRinFL
Look at the Buck blade profile versus the Spyderco you mentioned. The Buck profile allows for many more blades to be cut from a single sheet of steel. In addition, the fit and finish of the Spyderco is higher. Yes, I own many Buck knives and can compare them side by side.
Buck and Spyderco are aiming at slightly different markets with their day to day offerings. Buck's exclusive or special runs are the same price or higher than equivalent Spyderco offerings. We are lucky to have both still producing many models in this country.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 5:37 pm
by bearfacedkiller
Prices have gone up a lot, no denying that. In less than ten years they have gone up 50-75%. That’s hard to swallow. This year Taichung knives went up 15%. I don’t like it but I don’t think complaining will make it any better.
I still hate MAP. My buying decreased when it started.
In the end just vote with your wallet. Spyderco will adapt and survive.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 5:55 pm
by Soanso McMasters
ugaarguy wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 2:50 pm
There's been a fair bit of talk about pricing recently, and I've been thinking about over the past few weeks myself. The Native 5 G10 now has a MAP price of $180.95. Spyderco's lowest priced, US made, locking blade, folder is the riveted construction Manix 2 lightweight with FRCP handle and BD1N blade.
Meanwhile, Buck has switched the 110 and 112 Slim Pro over to screw together construction this year. They've managed (based on Knife Center pre-order pricing) to get the street price 112 Slim Pro TRX to a penny under $100. USA made, 3" S30V blade, liner-less G10 handles, metal thread inserst - All just like the Native 5 G10. And Buck is going to ship it with deep carry clip with flush fit / countersunk clip screws. Even the base model plastic handle is now $120.75 MAP. Look at the 2022 MAP prices on the Delica, Endura, and Chaparral as well.
I own four Native 5's, and have a Magancut N5 Salt on pre-order. So, I understand first hand how good the Native 5 is, and I know it's much more refined than almost any other back lock on the market. But I'm not sure that I can adequately articulate why it's that much better. And I'm starting to have a hard time justifying the price of many Spyderco knives vs. competitors.
It’s a pretty hard pill to swallow for sure. There were multiple models I was trying to buy prior to the price increase but they weren’t available anywhere. They included the Fluted Carbon Fiber S90V Native, Lil Native G10 backlock, and Blurple S110V Native.
I have a Spydie Chef, Sage 1 Maxamet, and Pakkawood Damascus Delica, so I’m not adverse to spending in the ~ $200 to $250 range, but I sure wish I could have scored those other three prior to the increases.
I did go ahead and pony up for the G10 Lil Native Backlock and it just arrived. It’s a sweet knife with very smooth action, so no regrets! I don’t yet have a G10 Native 5, and since I don’t need any other knives in black, I’ll be springing for the Blurple at some point. Like you, I pre-ordered the Native 5 in Magnacut and think it is listed at a fair price, even with the increase.
Prices on lots of things are just disheartening at this point.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 6:12 pm
by ladybug93
bearfacedkiller wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 5:37 pm
In the end just vote with your wallet. Spyderco will adapt and survive.
i hope so. i consider myself a loyal fan of spyderco, even though i like other knives as well and often talk about them here. however, this year, i bought both a cold steel rajah ii (6" folding khukri) and a 4max scout (4" beefy hard use folder) for less than $200. that's less than a shaman, or a caribbean, or a spydiechef, or a...
some might say comparing these models is like comparing apples to oranges. if it is, it's two really big, delicious apples compared to a normally sized, delicious orange. i actually prefer oranges, but apples are good too and i get a lot more if i go with apples.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 6:58 pm
by TkoK83Spy
The skyrocketing prices will be near CRK prices before you know it, then CRK's will be considered a bargain
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 7:03 pm
by Spyder-fan
This year's price increase has changed my Spyderco purchasing habits. I bought a couple Taichung models before the price hike. With the new prices I doubt I'll buy another from a dealer. The last couple I have purchased have been second hand, and it will most likely be how I purchase most of my future Spyderco knives. I still love the company, but the value just isn't there for me with the new prices.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 7:27 pm
by SG89
I've bought so many spyderco knives and products over the years... Mostly bc they were under $200. Now that they are more expensive, I will buy less. I am buying less of everything these days. I still love the company.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 8:04 pm
by JRinFL
I know no one wants to hear it, but Spyderco will have to go upmarket in order to survive and keep their standards intact. In fact, it’s already started, see the Drunken, Darn Dao, Paysan, etc. Sometimes you can make the same or better money with fewer customers.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 9:12 pm
by James Y
I may not have as many Spydercos as some of you have, but I own A LOT. Technically, I could stop buying anymore knives right now. I could have done so years ago. Although I do want something in Magnacut, if prices keep rising, I'll simply stop buying knives, without any regrets.
This might not be what people would like to see posted on this forum, but I've got way more Spyderco knives than I could ever use up in a lifetime.
People are complaining about the rising cost of Seki FRN models, but what about when a basic-level Golden-made PM2 starts selling for $400? People may scoff, but at the current rate of increases, that's not too far off.
Jim
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 9:47 pm
by bearfacedkiller
Every year since MAP started we have had multiple threads complaining about either MAP or the price increases. Every year street prices keep soaring yet here we are, Spyderco cannot keep up with demand. This forum could turn into a bunch of old timers just posting pics of the knives we bought when prices were lower and yet still a new generation of knife geeks will continue to gobble up Spydies like candy and Spyderco will be planning yet another factory upgrade. We are a small group here and most of the knife community has moved on to social media. It is what it is and the world keeps on turning.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 10:27 pm
by Sharp Guy
TkoK83Spy wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 6:58 pm
The skyrocketing prices will be near CRK prices before you know it, then CRK's will be considered a bargain
Until CRK realizes their margins are too thin and starts raising prices with everyone else
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 10:30 pm
by spoonrobot
Somewhere, someone is probably crabbing about the cost of the 110. When I first got into knives it was a $20-25 knife on the street and now they're $60. But not really a good comparison, the 110 and 112 aren't one hand closing knives like the Manix 2 or Native.
Anyway, Chinese manufacturers squeezed out the low end years ago, now they're wrapping up their destruction at the high end, what's left? The price is the price, many of the factors why are invisible but the threads are there. Higher prices suck, but I'd rather support Spyderco than buy slightly more, lower quality, knives.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 10:37 pm
by Sharp Guy
bearfacedkiller wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 9:47 pm
Every year since MAP started we have had multiple threads complaining about either MAP or the price increases. Every year street prices keep soaring yet here we are, Spyderco cannot keep up with demand. This forum could turn into a bunch of old timers just posting pics of the knives we bought when prices were lower and yet still a new generation of knife geeks will continue to gobble up Spydies like candy and Spyderco will be planning yet another factory upgrade. We are a small group here and most of the knife community has moved on to social media. It is what it is and the world keeps on turning.
Yep!
I saw another thread in one of the Spyderco Facebook groups tonight where someone was complaining about prices. I noted that Sal has been pretty transparent about trying to keep prices fair and yet keep the company running, employees paid, etc. Nobody's forcing anyone to buy anything yet these knives still seem to be hot sellers.
On a similar note...I went to the grocery store for a few things a couple days ago and spent $150 for what seemed like maybe $110 worth of stuff. I complain but for some reason they don't seem to be lowering the prices
Re: Pricing
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 11:09 pm
by Manifestgtr
The effect it’s gonna have on me is just selectivity…something like the stretch xl, I’m going to pick that up without a moment’s pause. I love the stretch, love VG-10 and love bigger knives. It’s a slam dunk and the asking price seems entirely reasonable to me given Spyderco’s near-flawless backlock implementation, next level blade geometry, etc. Elsewhere, things just might be a tiny bit more sparse.
It’s the difference between buying something that’s appealing for $220 vs buying something I REALLY want for $220…that kind of thing.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 12:14 am
by mikey177
I was able to squeeze in a few purchases before the 2022 price increase, which is why I haven't bought a single knife this year.
I will be more discerning regarding my purchasing decisions this year, not only because of the price hikes, but also due to personal financial priorities.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 12:21 am
by Naperville
It is a fact that everything for the last 250 years goods have gone up in price and will continue to do so.
Governments want a minimum of 2% inflation per year. They want to avoid deflation. They control the money supply and work their magic to keep that 2% number. Sometimes it gets out of hand as it is now and prices jump 10% to 30% per year and cause pain. Pain everywhere. Pain at the grocer, pain at the gas pump, pain at the car dealership. We are in an inflationary period.
Every manufacturer and retailer is cutting the fat to maintain prices.
Another way to look at it is if you own $1,000 in knives, and there is 10% inflation and the knives are desirable and kept immaculate, in one year you will MAKE $100. It might then be time to sell a few to buy a few of the newer models.
No matter how you look at it though, you control your wallet. Nobody controls much of anything else, other than the governments who control the money supply.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 1:17 am
by standy99
Keen fisherman and this is the exact same type of thread every year on a fishing forum.
Reels have gone up
Fishing braided line has gone up
Lures and hooks have gone up
Like there with fishing reels and rods, we could buy a $50 product and use it. But we want a better product.
Re: Pricing
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 2:22 am
by kobold
Mushroom wrote: ↑Thu Feb 03, 2022 3:12 pm
Buck has been in business since 1902 and they’re a much larger company than Spyderco. Buck and Spyderco operate at different scales, which probably allows Buck to offer lower prices.
There are a plethora of reasons why Spyderco has to price their products the way they do and many of those reasons are simply not going to be shared with the public. I trust that Spyderco is not increasing prices just for the sake of doing so.
Value is subjective. If you can’t personally justify the cost of a Spyderco, I hope you enjoy that new Buck knife.
You rejected my comparison with CRK because it is smaller scale, now you reject OPs comparison because Buck is larger scale. Come on, you can't be serious. :-)