Spyderco Forums

Posted: **Sun Jun 20, 2021 11:14 am**

Went fishing yesterday. Couldn't find my old H1 Pac Salt to take along. Perhaps it sprouted legs.

Poking around this morning to replace it, noticed it is in LC200N now as well. Looked all over online to see if there was anything definitive on which was better, H1 or LC200N, but nothing decisive noted. So I decided to add a few $ and go with the LC200N. Serrated of course, as have found serrated to be a better workhorse edge.

Still wish there were partial serrated options, PE front and SE back edges. The few knives I've had with such blades were quite versatile. Pushed into a corner of choosing one or the other for a working knife in the yard and fishing, I had to go full SE on the new Salt.

Posted: **Sun Jun 20, 2021 11:38 am**

Good choice

Posted: **Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:14 pm**

Very nice choice! My 2 salt folders are both LC200N (Native SE & PacSalt SE) I feel like the SE are almost a requirement in marine environments. But I also don't spend a ton of time working in marine environments so...haha! I guess the SpydieChef is technically a Salt but I don't count it.

I usually take the Native SE when I go fishing (catch and release).

I think you will love LC200N.

Posted: **Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:15 pm**

I did the opposite and recently ordered a PE H1 Pacific 2. I wanted a stock PE H1 Salt to compare head to head against my LC200N version, to try and observe how much of an edge retention difference I can detect.

The LC200N versions are very nice. I have both PE and SE. They're a bit lighter and less blade heavy, giving them a better balance point.

They also feature a full flat grind, giving them better cutting geometry.

Let us know what you think of yours after you get a chance to use it!

Posted: **Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:33 pm**

vivi wrote: ↑
Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:15 pm
I did the opposite and recently ordered a PE H1 Pacific 2. I wanted a stock PE H1 Salt to compare head to head against my LC200N version, to try and observe how much of an edge retention difference I can detect.

Keep us posted, I would expect the PE retention difference to be significant. I have never owned H1. I know SE H1 performs well but the PE H1 has always been on my non-consideration list.

Posted: **Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:55 pm**

Airlsee wrote: ↑
Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:33 pm

vivi wrote: ↑
Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:15 pm
I did the opposite and recently ordered a PE H1 Pacific 2. I wanted a stock PE H1 Salt to compare head to head against my LC200N version, to try and observe how much of an edge retention difference I can detect.

Keep us posted, I would expect the PE retention difference to be significant. I have never owned H1. I know SE H1 performs well but the PE H1 has always been on my non-consideration list.

I've been a little underwhelmed with PE LC200N edge retention the past month, which is what prompted the experiment. I've never made an effort to compare the two side by side like this.

Even if things go as expected, it'll be cool completing my set of Pacific 2's. Now I'll have all edge types in every steel.

Posted: **Sun Jun 20, 2021 2:16 pm**

In my experience plain edge h1 seems to be comparable to decent d2 in edge retention. Make sure to do a few full sharpenings before passing judgement!

To the OP, I’m sure you’ll enjoy your new Spyderco!

Posted: **Sun Jun 20, 2021 3:50 pm**

Comedie wrote: ...
Poking around this morning to replace it, noticed it is in LC200N now as well. Looked all over online to see if there was anything definitive on which was better, H1 or LC200N, but nothing decisive noted.
...

Theres probably 20 different threads just on this website talking about the differences between those 2 steels.

To keep it very simple. I prefer lc200n for a plain edge and h1 for serrated.

Posted: **Mon Jun 21, 2021 12:20 am**

Great choice! :)

Performancewise this knife should really be amazing: Due to the tapering the front part of the blade will proably as thin and slicey as the blade of my Salt 2 ffg SE... and this knife is probably the best cutter I own at the moment when it comes to folders.
Thin stock = win. SE = win. Both combined: Just great! :)

Posted: **Sat Jun 26, 2021 11:08 am**

So it arrived. Sharp and aggressive cutting with the serrations. Good!

Not crazy about the green color of the scales, but is what it is.

Certainly feels lighter, thinner, and less substantial in the hand than I recall my old Pac Salt in H1 being. Personally, I like thicker and heavier knives, so this new version goes the wrong way on my preferences scale in that regard.

My intent was for it to be a workhorse that needs no babying. Won't win any beauty pageants, and won't replace my PM2 in 100V with heavy copper scales,,,, but that was never my intent. Suspect it will fare just fine in saltwater fishing and the occasional yard duties my old one fulfilled.

Posted: **Sat Jun 26, 2021 2:19 pm**

I’m a little curious about everyone’s preference for SE in the marine environment. Why SE?

I’m a former Bering Sea commercial fisherman, and I’ve cleaned tens of thousands of fish, cut tens of thousands of lines, used knives for everything imaginable. Now I’m living on a sailboat, crossing oceans, catching fish, and working my way around the world. I have a few serrated knives, but they are reserved for emergency use only, when I, or something else, needs to be cut free in a hurry without any regard to salvaging or re-using the thing that is cut. I never use serrated edges on fish, food (except for a bread knife on bread), or rope (serrated edges fray and ruin the end.) So for all daily use, I use plain edges. We have serrated knives on deck and in our PFD’s in case something goes awry, but that’s it.

So, I’m genuinely curious about what I am missing. Why SE blades for marine use?

Posted: **Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:58 pm**

Jbaffoh wrote: ↑
Sat Jun 26, 2021 2:19 pm
I’m a little curious about everyone’s preference for SE in the marine environment. Why SE?

I’m a former Bering Sea commercial fisherman, and I’ve cleaned tens of thousands of fish, cut tens of thousands of lines, used knives for everything imaginable. Now I’m living on a sailboat, crossing oceans, catching fish, and working my way around the world. I have a few serrated knives, but they are reserved for emergency use only, when I, or something else, needs to be cut free in a hurry without any regard to salvaging or re-using the thing that is cut. I never use serrated edges on fish, food (except for a bread knife on bread), or rope (serrated edges fray and ruin the end.) So for all daily use, I use plain edges. We have serrated knives on deck and in our PFD’s in case something goes awry, but that’s it.

So, I’m genuinely curious about what I am missing. Why SE blades for marine use?

I can't answer the question but I like SE blades for dry land use :D

Posted: **Sat Jun 26, 2021 11:50 pm**

Jbaffoh wrote: ↑
Sat Jun 26, 2021 2:19 pm
I’m a little curious about everyone’s preference for SE in the marine environment. Why SE?
...

I don't know specifically about marine enviroment or cleaning fish, but there are quite some threads here talking about why some/many (who really tried) feel that Spydercos SE, or at least certain kinds of Spydercos SE, generally work better than PE in most tasks (for me in almost any task).
(Many of course feel differently and prefer PE)

The important part here is "Spydercos very refined SE" and "certain kinds" of it.
So one can't just take a random SE knife, compare it to PE and draw a conclusion.
For general, "normal" (and actually most) tasks Imho (and in the opinion of folks who know more than I do) "mellow", rounded, non aggressive SE patterns work best.
My recommendation would be to get an Endela SE and give it a try, this model has a pretty perfect SE pattern right from the factory, while others need some sharpening to get more rounded.

Since you are rather new to this forum I may point you to these threads for more on SE:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=84985

viewtopic.php?t=85045

Posted: **Mon Jun 28, 2021 9:03 am**

The SE for marine use is how you have detailed your use. SE for emergency use. I always used PE for work at sea such as working with lines or maintenance on board ships.

Posted: **Sat Jul 03, 2021 3:29 pm**

Jbaffoh wrote: ↑
Sat Jun 26, 2021 2:19 pm
I’m a little curious about everyone’s preference for SE in the marine environment. Why SE? .....

More aggressive cutting of whatever is why I like it. Also I don't need to baby the edge to keep it cutting, compared to a plain edge.

Some folks may also have gone SE in the Salts due to the H1 edge supposedly holding up better, due to the heat treatment that happens when the serrations are made. LC200N is supposedly a better starting point than H1 in edge holding,,,, but SE is still going to be a more aggressive cut than PE.

I don't use for filleting. Rather small knife for that anyway. Have always used Salts as workhorse knives myself. Cutting line, rope, and bait when fishing, for example. And for some quick pruning of vines and plants in the yard, when it seems like getting out the dedicated tools for those tasks is more trouble than it is worth.
For me, SE in H1 or HC200N is not for fine or more surgically clean work. For those I'd probably instead be using my S110V PM2

Posted: **Sat Jul 03, 2021 6:12 pm**

Jbaffoh wrote: ↑
Sat Jun 26, 2021 2:19 pm
I’m a little curious about everyone’s preference for SE in the marine environment. Why SE?

I’m a former Bering Sea commercial fisherman, and I’ve cleaned tens of thousands of fish, cut tens of thousands of lines, used knives for everything imaginable. Now I’m living on a sailboat, crossing oceans, catching fish, and working my way around the world. I have a few serrated knives, but they are reserved for emergency use only, when I, or something else, needs to be cut free in a hurry without any regard to salvaging or re-using the thing that is cut. I never use serrated edges on fish, food (except for a bread knife on bread), or rope (serrated edges fray and ruin the end.) So for all daily use, I use plain edges. We have serrated knives on deck and in our PFD’s in case something goes awry, but that’s it.

So, I’m genuinely curious about what I am missing. Why SE blades for marine use?

I will say that I know next to nothing about commercial fishing or the needs of those in the industry. That said, can you tell me of a single example where using a serrated edge ruined something or made that something much less useful than it would have been had you used a plain edge? I get that you don't filet a fish with an SE though I think it could be done, but it would be a PITA. But obvious stuff like that aside, I can't think of a situation where you would use an SE and then think, "Dang it, I should have used a PE and now I need to fix this." Does that make sense? I am genuinely curious and looking for knowledge here. For example, I never thought that the end of a rope would be more frayed when using a SE versus a PE though I can see that that would be the case. But even so, who cares? Why would that make a difference in anything?

Posted: **Sat Jul 31, 2021 3:44 pm**

Hi, I just got your message. When it comes to cleaning or filleting fish, you need clean cuts. Serrated edges don’t give you that—instead you get jagged/fuzzy edges that do not look appealing. Further, serrated edges bring zero advantages for cutting fish. A good sharp plain edge always works better. With regard to rope, serrated edges are great for hacking through something in a hurry, which is great if you are being dragged underwater by fishing gear or something. I use serrated edges for emergencies. Fortunately, I don’t have emergencies very often, but I still keep one handy on boats. However, 99% of the time I cut rope, I intend to splice the end or do something else that requires a clean, even, cut. Serrated edges will fray the **** out of three-strand, and nylon double-braid on the sailboat turns into an exploded Himalayan kitten. Each of those little teeth snag and pull the fibers to the point that the lay of the rope is unrecognizable. Either way, the ends are unusable and will need to be re-cut with a good edge or a hot knife.

Posted: **Sat Jul 31, 2021 7:13 pm**

Love the exploded Himalayan kitten analogy. Pretty much spot on when it comes to fish prep. Don't much care if it's SE or PE when it comes to slitting open fish bellies, but I have a definite preference for SE when it comes to bleeding fish by slicing their gills. Otherwise PE all the way for fish prep. My pleas for an LC200N PE filet seem to be falling on deaf ears.

Posted: **Sat Jul 31, 2021 7:23 pm**

Jbaffoh wrote: ↑
Sat Jul 31, 2021 3:44 pm
Hi, I just got your message. When it comes to cleaning or filleting fish, you need clean cuts. Serrated edges don’t give you that—instead you get jagged/fuzzy edges that do not look appealing. Further, serrated edges bring zero advantages for cutting fish. A good sharp plain edge always works better. With regard to rope, serrated edges are great for hacking through something in a hurry, which is great if you are being dragged underwater by fishing gear or something. I use serrated edges for emergencies. Fortunately, I don’t have emergencies very often, but I still keep one handy on boats. However, 99% of the time I cut rope, I intend to splice the end or do something else that requires a clean, even, cut. Serrated edges will fray the **** out of three-strand, and nylon double-braid on the sailboat turns into an exploded Himalayan kitten. Each of those little teeth snag and pull the fibers to the point that the lay of the rope is unrecognizable. Either way, the ends are unusable and will need to be re-cut with a good edge or a hot knife.

Sounds like you've been using serrated edges that aren't very sharp. A serrated knife sharp enough to push cut a receipt doesn't cut rope that way.

Posted: **Sat Jul 31, 2021 7:49 pm**

Jbaffoh wrote: ↑
Sat Jun 26, 2021 2:19 pm
I’m a little curious about everyone’s preference for SE in the marine environment. Why SE?

I’m a former Bering Sea commercial fisherman, and I’ve cleaned tens of thousands of fish, cut tens of thousands of lines, used knives for everything imaginable. Now I’m living on a sailboat, crossing oceans, catching fish, and working my way around the world. I have a few serrated knives, but they are reserved for emergency use only, when I, or something else, needs to be cut free in a hurry without any regard to salvaging or re-using the thing that is cut. I never use serrated edges on fish, food (except for a bread knife on bread), or rope (serrated edges fray and ruin the end.) So for all daily use, I use plain edges. We have serrated knives on deck and in our PFD’s in case something goes awry, but that’s it.

So, I’m genuinely curious about what I am missing. Why SE blades for marine use?

Im sure others here wont like this answer but...

For me the advantage of the serrared edge is it still cuts when dull. It also doesnt need the sharpening maintenance a plain edge does.
So you know your serrated knife is always going to work.

As far as a bullet proof, rust proof, folding knife that lives in your pocket, the serrated edge makes a lot of sense. It is about as close as can be to a zero maintenance knife. (If you dont care about "dull" serrations.)

You absolutely can fillet fish with a serrated knife, or really with anything if you dont have a choice about it. But I get what youre saying, there is a reason most fillet knives use a plain edge.

Spyderco Forums

LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way

Re: LC200N Pac Salt SE on the way