Dude, I hear you. The Endela K390 became my favorite after the first day I took it home and used it. I love it so much, I bought another.
I cut up two 8'x4' boxes a shed came in and it was still paper slicing sharp afterward. The pic doesn't do justice to the amount of carboard the knife cut up. The second pic shows a 55 gallon recycle bin nearly full.
Hi guys,
I picked up a Para 3 lightweight the other day. After getting home and really looking at the knife and playing with it a bit, I had to return it. I just can’t get into the FRN models.
Is there anyone else who feels the same? I love all my Spydies (G10 and CF scales), and really wanted to like the lightweight Para 3, but it seemed like an “imposter” of the “real deal” Para 3.
Just curious if I’m the odd man out in this train of thought.
Cheers!
MG
No...you're not the odd man out.
I tried a Spyderco knife with the FRN handle and found it to be junk for my use. The blade held up great but the handle left a lot to be desired. Just my experience.
I can't get enough FRN. I vowed to ONLY buy lightweight knives this year, and I think I broke my own rule just once (for that silly purple G-10 CruWear Manix).
I find I can carry a bigger knife with FRN...I can size up without the "chunk in my pocket" penalty...
Well, that is a pretty sweet Manix and worth the splurge.
I did not think about the size with FRN, but you are right. I was looking for a smaller knife for EDC until I discovered the Seki FRN. Now it's the Endura size that is just right. Plenty of edge in a very slim lightweight handle that does not sacrifice room for your hand.
- Jeff May your feet be warm and dry and your throat warm with whiskey. A knife in hand or in the sock band.
MNOSD Member #0005
I tried a Spyderco knife with the FRN handle and found it to be junk for my use. The blade held up great but the handle left a lot to be desired. Just my experience.
To be clear: I totally respect your opinion, but could you elaborate?
I almost can't imagine that the FRN handle was "junk" functionally speaking. As said, in some aspects FRN is even stronger than G10 (when it comes to impacts for example) and usually better contoured from the factory (with exceptions)
You say that "the blade held up great" but "the handle left a lot to desire". Does that mean that the handle did NOT hold up? Again, hard to believe from my personal experience: I put a lot of FRN Spydies through all kinds of use and abuse. I think on almost all of them no one could even tell this, if I cleaned them up, they'd look like new...
Again, I can understand if you just don't like FRN as a material going by feel in hand or the like.
But "junk" functionally speaking does just not match personal experience at all...
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
I tried a Spyderco knife with the FRN handle and found it to be junk for my use. The blade held up great but the handle left a lot to be desired. Just my experience.
To be clear: I totally respect your opinion, but could you elaborate?
I almost can't imagine that the FRN handle was "junk" functionally speaking. As said, in some aspects FRN is even stronger than G10 (when it comes to impacts for example) and usually better contoured from the factory (with exceptions)
You say that "the blade held up great" but "the handle left a lot to desire". Does that mean that the handle did NOT hold up? Again, hard to believe from my personal experience: I put a lot of FRN Spydies through all kinds of use and abuse. I think on almost all of them no one could even tell this, if I cleaned them up, they'd look like new...
Again, I can understand if you just don't like FRN as a material going by feel in hand or the like.
But "junk" functionally speaking does just not match personal experience at all...
I carried a native five salt with LC200N for about three months. After about a month the blade was so off centered or handle so warped, the blade was cutting into the side of the handle when I closed it. About two months in I noticed the handle started chipping. I used it for about another month until I got a replacement for it, a different Spyderco of course.
To be clear: I totally respect your opinion, but could you elaborate?
I almost can't imagine that the FRN handle was "junk" functionally speaking. As said, in some aspects FRN is even stronger than G10 (when it comes to impacts for example) and usually better contoured from the factory (with exceptions)
You say that "the blade held up great" but "the handle left a lot to desire". Does that mean that the handle did NOT hold up? Again, hard to believe from my personal experience: I put a lot of FRN Spydies through all kinds of use and abuse. I think on almost all of them no one could even tell this, if I cleaned them up, they'd look like new...
Again, I can understand if you just don't like FRN as a material going by feel in hand or the like.
But "junk" functionally speaking does just not match personal experience at all...
I carried a native five salt with LC200N for about three months. After about a month the blade was so off centered or handle so warped, the blade was cutting into the side of the handle when I closed it. About two months in I noticed the handle started chipping. I used it for about another month until I got a replacement for it, a different Spyderco of course.
Thanks for the reply!
That's bad, sorry to hear!
Totally contrary to my experiences so let's hope (generally, does not help you anymore unfortunately) that you just got a lemon...
I have not too much experience with Golden FRN, but a ton with sekis.
Many say (and I have that feeling too) that Golden FRN feels a bit "harder", more "brittle" and plasticy, while Seki FRN more "rubber-ish".
Anyway, perhaps one day you'll give a linered Seki FRN a chance. I am sure you'll have better luck and with the K390 line there are really nice offerings out there..
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
Given the choice between g10 and frn type handles, I’ll always lean towards g10. But I recently bought the 20cv manix 2 lightweight and I actually prefer it to my g10 manii.
The Para 3 Lightweight is so far the only lightweight that I really did not like. The Native 5 is probably my favorite lightweight/FRN version. I do tend to prefer G10 models, but FRN has a utility and economy that is hard to argue against for most users.
Because desolate places allow us to breathe. And most people don't even know they're out of breath.
I really like Spyderco's FRN, they do a great texturing to them. I prefer the seki-city FRN as it has a more blasted finish and is less smooth than the golden variety.
I don't mind FRN scales per se, but I do in general prefer my linered Spyderco's (FRN, G10, CF) to my linerless FRN Spyderco's. I guess this is especially true of the P3, my newer G10 came out of the box with such a nicer action than my carried and un-carried LWs, that I was a bit taken aback. I like My Native 5 LWs better than my P3s, and Salts have their place, but for my everyday use, I prefer a slicker operating linered knife like my Kapara or TRMs to my P3s LWs, and my Delica to my Salts.
Of all the lightweights, the Para 3 LW is the only one I have trouble with. And yes I intellectually know it is tough and usable, but it feels flimsy and cheap. By contrast the Native 5 LW feels sturdy and more substantial. The models with liners just feel like normal knives, albeit light ones. I can’t help wondering whether if Spyderco made the scales on these solid slabs of FRN, instead of giving them that “milled out” look, they would avoid that cheap, hollow vibe and give the knives a more substantial feel. Sure, .25 oz heavier and a slight increase in materials cost, but the knives would be sturdier and feel more durable.
Of all the lightweights, the Para 3 LW is the only one I have trouble with. And yes I intellectually know it is tough and usable, but it feels flimsy and cheap. By contrast the Native 5 LW feels sturdy and more substantial. The models with liners just feel like normal knives, albeit light ones. I can’t help wondering whether if Spyderco made the scales on these solid slabs of FRN, instead of giving them that “milled out” look, they would avoid that cheap, hollow vibe and give the knives a more substantial feel. Sure, .25 oz heavier and a slight increase in materials cost, but the knives would be sturdier and feel more durable.
The FRN models up through the Endura 3 and Delica 3 era handle designs (including the Salt models with the “3” handles) all had solid FRN without being milled-out on the inside. Personally, I don’t notice much difference in solidity of the FRN scales compared to the milled-out ones now. Although I do prefer them without the milled-out pattern on the inside. And although I prefer the “4” handle shapes, IMO, the inner checkering pattern just gives more potential spaces for stuff like sand or mud to accumulate.
I tried a Spyderco knife with the FRN handle and found it to be junk for my use. The blade held up great but the handle left a lot to be desired. Just my experience.
To be clear: I totally respect your opinion, but could you elaborate?
I almost can't imagine that the FRN handle was "junk" functionally speaking. As said, in some aspects FRN is even stronger than G10 (when it comes to impacts for example) and usually better contoured from the factory (with exceptions)
You say that "the blade held up great" but "the handle left a lot to desire". Does that mean that the handle did NOT hold up? Again, hard to believe from my personal experience: I put a lot of FRN Spydies through all kinds of use and abuse. I think on almost all of them no one could even tell this, if I cleaned them up, they'd look like new...
Again, I can understand if you just don't like FRN as a material going by feel in hand or the like.
But "junk" functionally speaking does just not match personal experience at all...
I carried a native five salt with LC200N for about three months. After about a month the blade was so off centered or handle so warped, the blade was cutting into the side of the handle when I closed it. About two months in I noticed the handle started chipping. I used it for about another month until I got a replacement for it, a different Spyderco of course.
Because there are no PB washers, the action is horrible on my 1yo Native Salt LC200N and because of this, I need to press against the spydie hole much much harder than on a G10 model. The blade/edge of my Native Salt is also contacting the scales, the friction is audible and if there is grit in there, it is getting really bad. There are even nail on the chalkboard sounds. I should add I can press the FRN scales together, where they almost touch. I could probably press them together fully if I really want to.
I can't do that with G10 scales.
edit: ok, I disassembled and cleaned the pivot area, applied heavy oil and that helped the situation.
Upon closer inspection I can see a circular mark on the blade tang. I think this is from the embedded steel anchors. As the FRN wears down they are becoming prominent and making contact with the blade. This would explain the "nail on the chalkboard" sound. Either way, I want to reiterate my opinion that PB washers are a must in all FRN models.
I carried a native five salt with LC200N for about three months. After about a month the blade was so off centered or handle so warped, the blade was cutting into the side of the handle when I closed it. About two months in I noticed the handle started chipping. I used it for about another month until I got a replacement for it, a different Spyderco of course.
Well other lightweight models do have steel liners so hopefully they would do better.
But now I have to throw this out there. I have seen some pretty beat up salts and linerless lightweights that still hold up fine. I cant see how the handle would warp that much. I can see how the blade would get off center, theres an easy fix for that though, adjust the blade and tighten the pivot and screws. Granted this needs to be done before the frn/frcp in the pivot area can get damaged.
It sounds to me like the knife got very out of spec and then continued to be used to the point of damage instead of being adjusted. Maybe the tang damaged some of the inside frcp around the pivot area letting the blade get way too loose. I could maybe see this happening if the knife was used to pry a lot, or once again if the pivot got loose and the knife kept getting used without being adjusted.
Frn/frcp also can scratch and chip but I dont let it bother me.
"Rome's greatest contribution to mathematics was the killing of Archimedes."
I carried a native five salt with LC200N for about three months. After about a month the blade was so off centered or handle so warped, the blade was cutting into the side of the handle when I closed it. About two months in I noticed the handle started chipping. I used it for about another month until I got a replacement for it, a different Spyderco of course.
Well other lightweight models do have steel liners so hopefully they would do better.
But now I have to throw this out there. I have seen some pretty beat up salts and linerless lightweights that still hold up fine. I cant see how the handle would warp that much. I can see how the blade would get off center, theres an easy fix for that though, adjust the blade and tighten the pivot and screws. Granted this needs to be done before the frn/frcp in the pivot area can get damaged.
It sounds to me like the knife got very out of spec and then continued to be used to the point of damage instead of being adjusted. Maybe the tang damaged some of the inside frcp around the pivot area letting the blade get way too loose. I could maybe see this happening if the knife was used to pry a lot, or once again if the pivot got loose and the knife kept getting used without being adjusted.
Frn/frcp also can scratch and chip but I dont let it bother me.
I could bend the handle back and forth with my fingers with very little effort. The pivot was tightened with loctite applied and the blade wasn't loose. If a little grit is all it takes to ruin the FRN handle...Well....that makes it a very cheap plastic handle.
Chuck James wrote:
I could bend the handle back and forth with my fingers with very little effort...
Thats the weird part. All of mine are very stiff and rigid. No handle flex.
Maybe you broke the handle/backspacer. And those should hold up pretty well, I feel like I would have to try to break mine.
Maybe you got a lemon.
No pocket jewelry here. I just cant figure why yours would be like that.
"Rome's greatest contribution to mathematics was the killing of Archimedes."
Chuck James wrote:
I could bend the handle back and forth with my fingers with very little effort...
Thats the weird part. All of mine are very stiff and rigid. No handle flex.
Maybe you broke the handle/backspacer. And those should hold up pretty well, I feel like I would have to try to break mine.
Maybe you got a lemon.
No pocket jewelry here. I just cant figure why yours would be like that.
I will say I was expecting more out of it....could have been a lemon as you said.
Good thing is Spyderco has a lot of different models to choose from.....something for most everyone!!!
I didn't know some FRN handles come with liners... Thanks for the info!!!
Personally I like the FRN lightweights, especially for true pocket carry. The dragonfly FRN versions are an excellent knife to carry clipless in the pocket. I like the g10 dragonfly and the slim all SS model, but the FRN gets carried/used much more frequently. Same with the awesome Chaparral and its scale options.
The FRN knives I have used hold up quite well. I used a less expensive cheap plastic handled knife prior to my first dragonfly in the 90s, and the plastic did break/crack over time/use. I figured the dragonfly would do the same, but it really surprised me. I had that knife for years before it disappeared at my sons workplace. There is a difference in Spyderco frn and some of the other plastics out there.
Anything can truly be broken, and wear out. And sometimes products fail due to defects/abnormalities in production and assembly.
One of the great things about Spyderco is the variety available. There are different designs, different materials, and options to choose from. I prefer to use and carry knives I like. Over the years, my tastes have changed. In the past I would carry heavier items than truly necessary, just in case. Comfort combined with performance are now my preference. So I may not be able to cut a car clean in half with my frn dragonfly where my g10 lil native back lock sure feels like it could - but I no longer consider cutting a car clean in half something a clipless pocket knife has to be capable of. I know an FRN dragonfly can cut quite a bit more than some other knives I have owned, and the comfort combined with the performance is quite satisfying.
I find it fascinating that three features on Spyderco folders that were all introduced (and popular!) decades ago are undergoing a renaissance among Spyderco’s staunchest fans.
Those features are FRN handles, fully serrated edges, and mid-locks. Everything old is new again. The classics never go completely out of style.
