Martial Arts Experiences Discussion Thread

[twinboysdad]

I have mentioned before having a son who is a high school (year round with club) wrestler and watching them drill certain things like a snap down-go behind and knowing very few wrestlers snap their opponent onto all fours, bothers me when it’s allowed by coaches. Gable Steveson is one of the very few wrestlers powerful enough to repeatedly snap someone down to all fours, he’s an anomaly. So drilling it with your opponent “going to all fours like a hydraulic press” pushed them down is just inauthentic and as soon as they go LIVE it gets tossed out the window. A snap sets up a shot and a snap timed right can chain into a front headlock go behind, but a snap where the opponent is put on all fours as a result of your powerful snap is just a rarity. So seeing drilling where the opponent offers an inauthentic response just puts a burr under my saddle because I have seen 15 minutes sweated on a technique that when run live doesn’t work 15 minutes later

I train BJJ and on the one hand, I get where you're coming from on spending time training things that don't often happen as idealized in drilling.

On the other hand, sometimes those attacks are used to force other reactions, and if you can't seriously threaten with the first attack eventually your opponent will figure that out and stop responding the way you need to set up the next attack. I'm not much of a wrestler but it sounds like there are various chains you can work towards from the snapdown, and I imagine a weak, half-a***d snapdown attempt to start is not conducive to success.


For a BJJ example of something similar, I like to hit head and arm chokes from mount. In order to get one of my opponent's arms above their head, I'll often start to set up an Ezekiel choke, so they'll at least put their hands to their neck to defend, then pry an arm loose and work to the head and arm from there.

I'm not great at Ezekiels but I do seriously go for them here and occasionally I get a tap before transitioning to the head and arm. If I don't seriously go for it, I'm going to get swept or they just won't respect it and I won't get the reaction I want.

Exactly right. A snap down used as an off balance and then reattack is very useful a snap down and the opponent going to all fours is not because that level of strength is rare

[James Y]

'A Mysterious Soviet Boxer Who Could Knock Out Any Opponent with One Touch'

At his peak, he had absolutely perfect reflexes, timing, and placement. That right hand didn't LOOK like much, but he landed it perfectly, right on the chin.

Tragically, it seems that many people like him, who possess extreme talents in their fields, are not long for this world.

https://youtu.be/dn_K9cw9XWU?si=eENTiOvn82eR-2Bc

Jim

[James Y]

Gas Station Machete Fight

https://youtu.be/aV2F8B1eHV0?si=pmgjvNAwS7SHOK23

Not martial arts-related, but a very important piece of footage one can learn from. One of the biggest takeaways for me is near the end, when the aggressive female accomplice tries to attack the machete-armed clerk with a knife, and receives a blow to her head with the machete. As I always say, never underestimate anyone, or the danger they can pose. It doesn't matter who your attacker is, male or female; if they pose a danger, they should be treated the same in such a situation, without regard to their age or sex. Awhile back, I saw something about a 50-something year-old man who was stabbed to death in Canada (Toronto?) by a group of teenage girls. If you have no choice but to defend yourself, leave your sense of chivalry at home

Of course, if the clerk had had a gun, it would have been much better. But not everyone can get a gun, or get a permit to carry one.

Some might say the clerk shouldn't have fought when the robber first tried to get away. That may be true. We don't know his situation. Perhaps he thought letting them get away would make the gas station look like an easy target. Maybe he or his family even owned the business.

After having seen several videos of real fights involving machetes, one thing I've noticed is that a lot of people seem unafraid of machetes, at least in the heat of a fight. And compared to some other weapons, they come across as fairly unwieldy, unless the person is experienced at using it on other people, and is fully committed.

Jim

[Naperville]

Back around 2010 I had walked the streets of Chicago for months in Canaryville, Chinatown and Pilsen meeting people and getting ready to teach what I knew of martial arts.

I was almost all set. I had planned to teach indoors in Canaryville at a brand new local gymnasium and had a room all set up and ready to use year round. In Chinatown I was going to teach at Ping Park. Pilsen was going to be backyard instruction. Every location was going to be 2 days per week, and you could travel by car/bicycle to any of the other locations and join in.

Then I managed to get tangled up defending myself legally in Chicago and it all went to h*** in a hand-basket. I gave up. I should not have, it would have been fun dissecting DVDs and the knowledge that I had gained over the years. It would have included judo, hapkido, escrima/arnis, and other Korean styles for general fitness.

The name if the group was going to be Black Swan Tactical, this was my logo, and at the time I had a YouTube channel and a web domain and server. I allowed the domain to expire and some clowns took over the domain after they saw that it was available. Such is life!

[James Y]

Back around 2010 I had walked the streets of Chicago for months in Canaryville, Chinatown and Pilsen meeting people and getting ready to teach what I knew of martial arts.

I was almost all set. I had planned to teach indoors in Canaryville at a brand new local gymnasium and had a room all set up and ready to use year round. In Chinatown I was going to teach at Ping Park. Pilsen was going to be backyard instruction. Every location was going to be 2 days per week, and you could travel by car/bicycle to any of the other locations and join in.

Then I managed to get tangled up defending myself legally in Chicago and it all went to h*** in a hand-basket. I gave up. I should not have, it would have been fun dissecting DVDs and the knowledge that I had gained over the years. It would have included judo, hapkido, escrima/arnis, and other Korean styles for general fitness.

The name if the group was going to be Black Swan Tactical, this was my logo, and at the time I had a YouTube channel and a web domain and server. I allowed the domain to expire and some clowns took over the domain after they saw that it was available. Such is life!

Thank you for sharing that, Naperville. Sucks that someone took over your domain instead of creating something original of their own.

Jim

[James Y]

Art of Self-Defense / Self-Defense Techniques

https://youtu.be/DyhuZEWrZMM?si=BG9Nwfxioitw9qKA

He makes some great points.

I've mentioned before that for real-life SD, I don't do any 'artsy' stuff, though it's all based on and simplified from skills developed in my martial arts training. It has to be workable under sudden stress and adrenaline (no fine or complex motor movements), and intended to cause maximum damage to another person. Unlike the guy in the video, my goal is not to cause pain, but to create physical damage. This is not 'internet tough guy' talk. The effects of adrenaline, drugs, or insanity can make someone far less sensitive, and even immune, to feeling pain in the heat of a real fight. And some people are just physically and mentally tough, and have a very high pain tolerance. But biomechanical damage to the body can occur whether the person feels pain in the moment or not.

I could perform all the 'artsy' stuff when I was younger, and had even enjoyed it; but I never considered complex, showy, or illogical movements for actual SD, even when I was a kid. I've always been aware that things must be ADAPTED and modified to be effective in a real situation.

A real situation also differs from sparring, and even from full-contact competitive sport fighting.

My favorite part of this video is when he starts talking about people who smoke weed.

Jim

[Naperville]

Art of Self-Defense / Self-Defense Techniques

https://youtu.be/DyhuZEWrZMM?si=BG9Nwfxioitw9qKA

He makes some great points.

I've mentioned before that for real-life SD, I don't do any 'artsy' stuff, though it's all based on and simplified from skills developed in my martial arts training. It has to be workable under sudden stress and adrenaline (no fine or complex motor movements), and intended to cause maximum damage to another person. Unlike the guy in the video, my goal is not to cause pain, but to create physical damage. This is not 'internet tough guy' talk. The effects of adrenaline, drugs, or insanity can make someone far less sensitive, and even immune, to feeling pain in the heat of a real fight. And some people are just physically and mentally tough, and have a very high pain tolerance. But biomechanical damage to the body can occur whether the person feels pain in the moment or not.

I could perform all the 'artsy' stuff when I was younger, and had even enjoyed it; but I never considered complex, showy, or illogical movements for actual SD, even when I was a kid. I've always been aware that things must be ADAPTED and modified to be effective in a real situation.

A real situation also differs from sparring, and even from full-contact competitive sport fighting.

My favorite part of this video is when he starts talking about people who smoke weed.

Jim

A few Filipino martial artists that I know would eat you alive with limb tapping/trapping. How they got so fast I do not know, but I would not want to fight them. It is not going to be a conventional fight and they are probably going to beat me senseless! These are/were very advanced students.

Guro John Peterson(dec.) of Inayan showed me many times in drills a passing attack and it happens so fast I was astounded. The closest thing that I can equate some of the moves would have hapkido. The person who thinks they are attacking is just providing a carcass to be climbed on or manipulated.

[James Y]

Art of Self-Defense / Self-Defense Techniques

https://youtu.be/DyhuZEWrZMM?si=BG9Nwfxioitw9qKA

He makes some great points.

I've mentioned before that for real-life SD, I don't do any 'artsy' stuff, though it's all based on and simplified from skills developed in my martial arts training. It has to be workable under sudden stress and adrenaline (no fine or complex motor movements), and intended to cause maximum damage to another person. Unlike the guy in the video, my goal is not to cause pain, but to create physical damage. This is not 'internet tough guy' talk. The effects of adrenaline, drugs, or insanity can make someone far less sensitive, and even immune, to feeling pain in the heat of a real fight. And some people are just physically and mentally tough, and have a very high pain tolerance. But biomechanical damage to the body can occur whether the person feels pain in the moment or not.

I could perform all the 'artsy' stuff when I was younger, and had even enjoyed it; but I never considered complex, showy, or illogical movements for actual SD, even when I was a kid. I've always been aware that things must be ADAPTED and modified to be effective in a real situation.

A real situation also differs from sparring, and even from full-contact competitive sport fighting.

My favorite part of this video is when he starts talking about people who smoke weed.

Jim

A few Filipino martial artists that I know would eat you alive with limb tapping/trapping. How they got so fast I do not know, but I would not want to fight them. It is not going to be a conventional fight and they are probably going to beat me senseless! These are/were very advanced students.

Guro John Peterson(dec.) of Inayan showed me many times in drills a passing attack and it happens so fast I was astounded. The closest thing that I can equate some of the moves would have hapkido. The person who thinks they are attacking is just providing a carcass to be climbed on or manipulated.

You are also correct.

I'm mainly talking about myself and what I've done with what I have. The men you mentioned were beyond exceptional practitioners. I've known practitioners who have been so highly skilled and experienced at applying their art, they could apply it on the street and destroy the vast majority of men, very quickly, even at advanced ages. My Choy Lee Fut sifu being one of them. My first Mantis sifu in Taiwan. My Shito-ryu Karate sensei. My Kenpo teacher for sure, but he wasn't "pure" Kenpo in his practice or in his fighting; he also combined FMA, Jujutsu, boxing, wrestling, and Kung Fu into his personal method. They all still simplified what they did in practical application, and their speed, power, and precision could be mind-boggling. I visited my CLF sifu last year, and in his early 80s he still has amazing speed, power, and maneuverability. Such people are exceptionally high-level practitioners, IMO.

I myself have simplified and adapted certain aspects for myself that I deem separate from the "art" side of what I do. It DOES require a lot of training and practice, just like any fighting method does. I've trained in a LOT of different systems, so my SD-specific aspect is not style-or-system-specific. And there are not a lot of different things to have to remember.

I haven't had a ton of street experiences, but the ones I did have showed me to keep things simple, unconventional, and to be aggressive. And dirty. These are aspects that worked for me. I want effective methods I can apply regardless of what age I become (having at least reasonable health, of course). It's not the same as training for a competition when I was young. The mindset and skillsets are very different. One is a combat sport for young men; the other is a life skill that needs to remain viable far beyond one's athletic peak years. And the latter must be unique to the individual through his/her own experiences. I suspect this was at least partly the idea behind Bruce Lee's concept of Jeet Kune Do, which some have systematized into its own "style," which I believe that Bruce Lee had been against doing.

Jim

[Naperville]

I never discussed the foundation that these 2 escrimador guros had. It may have been trapping hands or tapping hands from Filipino martial arts but it looked a lot like Jeet Kun Do with some of Ip Man's Wing Chun. It was blistering fast.

I alreadt told you about Guro John Peterson(dec.) of Inayan martial arts. The other was Guro Terry Joven of Bahala Na. The training that these two had/have is extensive spanning 40+ years and 20+ hours each week. They are/were instructors.

[Naperville]

I forgot to post this earlier. It is a spinning elbow in Muay Thai. Note that it looks like he is going to clinch and instead throws a spinning elbow.

https://odysee.com/@Siamscholar1:7/andy ... muaythai:8

[James Y]

I never discussed the foundation that these 2 escrimador guros had. It may have been trapping hands or tapping hands from Filipino martial arts but it looked a lot like Jeet Kun Do with some of Ip Man's Wing Chun. It was blistering fast.

I alreadt told you about Guro John Peterson(dec.) of Inayan martial arts. The other was Guro Terry Joven of Bahala Na. The training that these two had/have is extensive spanning 40+ years and 20+ hours each week. They are/were instructors.

Thanks for sharing.

There are certainly exceptional practitioners/teachers.

I'm not saying that FMA isn't effective. I don't agree with everything the guy in the video said. I do agree with him that SD demonstrations that are overly stylized like the one he described (and like ones I've seen in all kinds of MA systems) are not practical without being modified and adapted. Which I feel that all exceptional practitioners tend to do out of their own experiences.

Jim

[Naperville]

I never discussed the foundation that these 2 escrimador guros had. It may have been trapping hands or tapping hands from Filipino martial arts but it looked a lot like Jeet Kun Do with some of Ip Man's Wing Chun. It was blistering fast.

I alreadt told you about Guro John Peterson(dec.) of Inayan martial arts. The other was Guro Terry Joven of Bahala Na. The training that these two had/have is extensive spanning 40+ years and 20+ hours each week. They are/were instructors.

Thanks for sharing.

There are certainly exceptional practitioners/teachers.

I'm not saying that FMA isn't effective. I don't agree with everything the guy in the video said. I do agree with him that SD demonstrations that are overly stylized like the one he described (and like ones I've seen in all kinds of MA systems) are not practical without being modified and adapted. Which I feel that all exceptional practitioners tend to do out of their own experiences.

Jim

I did not take your comment that way, I know you pretty well by now. They are all as effective as their better practitioners. I am not that great a martial artist. I may use a technique or two if given the time to think or plan.

[James Y]

I never discussed the foundation that these 2 escrimador guros had. It may have been trapping hands or tapping hands from Filipino martial arts but it looked a lot like Jeet Kun Do with some of Ip Man's Wing Chun. It was blistering fast.

I alreadt told you about Guro John Peterson(dec.) of Inayan martial arts. The other was Guro Terry Joven of Bahala Na. The training that these two had/have is extensive spanning 40+ years and 20+ hours each week. They are/were instructors.

Thanks for sharing.

There are certainly exceptional practitioners/teachers.

I'm not saying that FMA isn't effective. I don't agree with everything the guy in the video said. I do agree with him that SD demonstrations that are overly stylized like the one he described (and like ones I've seen in all kinds of MA systems) are not practical without being modified and adapted. Which I feel that all exceptional practitioners tend to do out of their own experiences.

Jim

I did not take your comment that way, I know you pretty well by now. They are all as effective as their better practitioners. I am not that great a martial artist. I may use a technique or two if given the time to think or plan.

Thanks. I always try to make sure I'm not misunderstood. It's happened to me in the past.

Yes, IMO there are no superior arts (though some may be, or seem to be, more practical than others); there are only superior practitioners.

Jim

[James Y]

Invincible Florida Woman Stabs Deputy - Police Shooting Breakdown

Not really MA-related, but not totally unrelated either, because you could possibly end up facing someone like this. Like I've said before, some people, through adrenaline, drugs, insanity, or otherwise, can take an incredible amount of physical trauma and keep coming at you, seemingly almost unaffected, like the Terminator. And they don't have to be big, buffed guys, either. There have been small, skinny men and women who have seemed to possess almost superhuman strength and resilience.

As always, Never Underestimate Anyone.

And as the narrator points out, disarming a knife from someone is not as easy as many internet keyboard warriors seem to think it is.

Unfortunately, the video is age-restricted, so you must log onto YouTube to watch it.

https://youtu.be/-fBKDAZFpsM?si=9DvZRqn3NXyV4kiy

Jim

[James Y]

World's Wildest Police Videos: Invincible Maniac Loves Pepper Spray

https://youtu.be/HolkgvpKghg?si=qX7svsZKlPUAl4qH

This continues my point in the previous post. Some people can not only shrug off blows, but are unaffected by pepper spray. Many people deny this reality, and believe that any blow of a baton, or any pepper spray to the face will make anyone crumble, because such things hurt. But not everyone is affected by things in the same way. A certain percentage of people are highly resistant to pain, or are unaffected by things like pepper spray. To such people, spraying them with pepper spray will have the same effect as spritzing them with water. It may only enrage them.

I remember one guy telling me that NOBODY is immune to the effects of pepper spray; that such people do not exist. How wrong he was.

There are also many instances of people who were shot or stabbed multiple times, often fatally, but who continued to function and fight on, until their wounds eventually took effect.

To some people, this video will be funny, because of its context. But if you're smart, you will study it and remember that there are other people like this out there who, instead of only being some guy selling produce without a permit, imagine an unprovoked predatory attack by such a person.

Jim

[James Y]

Bully Receives a "Glasgow Kiss"

The bully completely underestimated the guy in the glasses. Probably thought that, judging from his appearance, he wouldn't be able to do anything. I'm willing to bet that, had the bully wanted more, the man in the glasses had a lot more ready where that came from.

Never Underestimate Anyone.

https://youtube.com/shorts/KsQoAlOkE2A?si=8hsAzsOSXIdMg9Kt

Jim

[James Y]

Chuck Norris - Early Role in Episode of "Room 222" (1970)

The awkward young kid is Eric Laneuville, who later co-starred as Chuck Norris's adopted son in A Force of One (1979).

This was Chuck Norris's first speaking role, but was not his first role. His first role was as a henchman in The Wrecking Crew (1968), which starred Dean Martin and Sharon Tate, and was fight choreographed by Bruce Lee.

https://youtu.be/fAsB0oZRMeU?si=p9mBSH9Dcr2_YpsN

Jim

[James Y]

From Dispute to Disaster: A Fatal Fight in the Bronx

Another example of the importance of not underestimating anyone, and of not getting into stupid, meaningless ego fights.

The guy in red tries a double-leg takedown, which he may have trained, but probably picked up from watching MMA fights. If knives are so easy to disarm from someone, the guy in red should have seen it and been able to take it away from him, neither of which happened.

Although the type of knife that was used is impossible to identify, it was most likely some cheap folding knife. It looks to have been a fairly small blade, as it's difficult or impossible to even see. I guess that makes a lie out of the popular internet statement that "folding knives are ineffective weapons." There is a big difference between popular speculations people have on the internet, and what happens in real life.

Understandably, this video is age-restricted, so you'll have to sign in to watch it on YouTube.

https://youtu.be/p0z1H-_AnkQ?si=M2YbUEffw6CJudC1

Jim

[Naperville]

Knife drills:

https://youtu.be/5Ps4poQ0w7A

https://youtu.be/5Ps4poQ0w7A

[Naperville]

Maybe a few DVDs for Christmas and the new year will set everything in the right mood.


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