Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Put me down for something long, thin and slicey.
Every time I carry one of my traditionals, I’m reminded that geometry cuts and all things being equal, I prefer thinner blade stock on an edc knife. Durability is not really an issue when you can simply opt for a more obtuse primary bevel(outside of genuine hard working knives of course)
Every time I carry one of my traditionals, I’m reminded that geometry cuts and all things being equal, I prefer thinner blade stock on an edc knife. Durability is not really an issue when you can simply opt for a more obtuse primary bevel(outside of genuine hard working knives of course)
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Yes, and as I said already: Often times when you want a thin, slicey blade you ALSO want a longer blade (food prep being the most prominent example for that), while many "thick blade" hard use tasks (not all of course), like prying or the like can be done perfectly well or even better with a shorter, stout blade...Tims wrote: ↑Sun Nov 17, 2019 3:20 amPut me down for something long, thin and slicey.
Every time I carry one of my traditionals, I’m reminded that geometry cuts and all things being equal, I prefer thinner blade stock on an edc knife. Durability is not really an issue when you can simply opt for a more obtuse primary bevel(outside of genuine hard working knives of course)
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Back lock would be the easiest yeah. Though i think CBBL is feasible too. They could even go with the Benchmade axis lock since the patent has expired. That lock is even nicer than the CBBL cause it is open completely on the top whereas the CBBL needs a backspacer partly for the lock to function. I'd prefer open construction for cleaning over the backlock and CBBL.Wartstein wrote: ↑Sun Nov 17, 2019 12:55 amIf one only thinks of a really thin blade (which is the more important part, no doubt), probably any lock is thinkable (though I don´t know if 2mm would offer still enough interface for a reliably working liner- or comp. lock?)JacksonKnives wrote: ↑Sat Nov 16, 2019 8:20 pmFor some metrics of performance, not for all.The Meat man wrote: ↑Sat Nov 16, 2019 5:51 pmNo doubt about it, though; a 2mm Endela will outperform a 3mm Endela.
(I'd prefer a BBL or maybe the Stop Lock or frame-compression-lock to a backlock, but hey, I carried a thinned-out Caly 3.5 today so I'm susceptible to thin backlocks too.)
But what I meant in my op was a chaparralish-thin knife both in blade and handle. And I am quite sure that a really thin handle can only (or at least with the least problems) be made with a backlock?
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
I'd be interested in a larger back lock with 2mm stock. However, I do question the market appeal for such a knife.
Sal mentioned doing a high hollow run on an existing model to satisfy perormance oriented forumites. That sounds good to me.
My experience agrees with others here that having a thin grind will effect cutting performance more than thinner stock. Of course both will have the maxiumum impact.
I reground my Centofante 3 to a flat saber grind. The stock hollow grind is not very deep. I have the edge just thick enough to hold up to wood carving. But VG-10 is still not ideal. I'd much prefer a higher hardness steel with decent toughness like Cruwear, 4V, etc.
I'll give an example of thin stock and thick grind being the worst of both. The new Spyderco Z-Cut paring knives. At the spine behind the Spydie hole it measures 1/32" yet it's thick behind the edge because the primary grind is so shallow. Didn't cut well and flexed excessively when cutting.
Using thicker stock and a thinner primary grind would produce a better knife. I thinned the edge but it's still not ideal.
Sal mentioned doing a high hollow run on an existing model to satisfy perormance oriented forumites. That sounds good to me.
My experience agrees with others here that having a thin grind will effect cutting performance more than thinner stock. Of course both will have the maxiumum impact.
I reground my Centofante 3 to a flat saber grind. The stock hollow grind is not very deep. I have the edge just thick enough to hold up to wood carving. But VG-10 is still not ideal. I'd much prefer a higher hardness steel with decent toughness like Cruwear, 4V, etc.
I'll give an example of thin stock and thick grind being the worst of both. The new Spyderco Z-Cut paring knives. At the spine behind the Spydie hole it measures 1/32" yet it's thick behind the edge because the primary grind is so shallow. Didn't cut well and flexed excessively when cutting.
Using thicker stock and a thinner primary grind would produce a better knife. I thinned the edge but it's still not ideal.
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
I'm interested, and still advocating for a PM2 Backlock with thinner stock and handles rather than thicker like the Manix2 Backlock. 2mm and linerless G10 would be awesome IMHO, and match your 3.5" blade length request. Cold Steel pulled off some very thin linerless G10 on the 4" Broken Skull and you don't hear about those breaking.
Last edited by abbazaba on Sun Nov 17, 2019 12:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Thin PM2 backlock?! Great idea!! :) (Though FRN would be the icing on the cake for me personally... or just a "thin edition" of the upcoming Straight Spine Stretch..
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
I really like FRN, but it may make it thicker than G10 would, using the Police4 G10 vs FRN as an example, and the CS Broken Skull mentioned above. It worked for the Chaparral, but that might partly be because of its length vs bendiness.
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
The Chap actually has nested steel liners... I think if one aims for the thinnest (and not necessarely lightest handle possible, linered FRN (or linered G10) is the way to go probably. Thin steel liners nested in thin FRN (or G10) should be the best when it comes very thin, but still not bendy?abbazaba wrote: ↑Sun Nov 17, 2019 12:56 pmI really like FRN, but it may make it thicker than G10 would, using the Police4 G10 vs FRN as an example, and the CS Broken Skull mentioned above. It worked for the Chaparral, but that might partly be because of its length vs bendiness.
My original proposal when starting this thread was indeed something like the Chap, just larger. So a very thin blade in a very thin handle (which probably needs steel liners to remain rigid enough)
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- Coffeetron
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Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
2mm ffg is plenty imo. I would not choose the chaparral platform since it looses edge because of the choil. An all edge model like the caribbean with ~100mm edge length would be great.
I read something about a planned cpm 15v knife and I think that this combination would be the best. :)
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Wouldn't a Chaparral XL be basically a Sage?
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
I think it would be a little more slender/elongated than a Sage.
I had my Ti Chap out of the drawer today and was imagining it a little longer in the handle and a little longer in the blade when I had it in hand; and thought, wow, that would be really cool.
Count me in!
CG
P.S. I'd also like a Caribbean at about 3/4 its current size.
So many knives - so little funds!!!
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
A Chap XL would mabye look a lot like a Sage, but the Sage is not what I am proposing in this thread, but just another 3mm stock knife with an handle of "regular" thickness. Which is fine, don´t get me wrong, but as said: NOT the longer, very thin both in handle and blade (2mm) folder that´s somewhat missing in Spydercos lineup (or in the lineup of most companies, Spyderco makes many rather thin and slicey blades anyway compared to other brands)cycleguy wrote:I think it would be a little more slender/elongated than a Sage.
I had my Ti Chap out of the drawer today and was imagining it a little longer in the handle and a little longer in the blade when I had it in hand; and thought, wow, that would be really cool.
Count me in!
CG
P.S. I'd also like a Caribbean at about 3/4 its current size.
I would also like that "thin edition" knife to offer a bit more edge than the Sage. At least like a Stretch / Endela does.
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
You are right, while I like the choil in the existing Chap (cause its handle is overall so short, that the choil is somewhat mandatory to get a good four finger grip, even if the handle was designed "choilless"), in such a loinger slicer I´d like to see an edge as long as possible.Coffeetron wrote: ↑Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:08 pm2mm ffg is plenty imo. I would not choose the chaparral platform since it looses edge because of the choil. An all edge model like the caribbean with ~100mm edge length would be great.
I read something about a planned cpm 15v knife and I think that this combination would be the best. :)
Though concerning a "thin Caribbean": I don´t know how a comp.lock would work with such a thin bladestock, that offers not much lock interface.
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- Coffeetron
- Member
- Posts: 65
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- Location: Austria
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
I mentioned the caribbean because of the choil-less design which is rather uncommon with Spyderco. I think backlock would be totally fine.Wartstein wrote: ↑Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:04 amYou are right, while I like the choil in the existing Chap (cause its handle is overall so short, that the choil is somewhat mandatory to get a good four finger grip, even if the handle was designed "choilless"), in such a loinger slicer I´d like to see an edge as long as possible.Coffeetron wrote: ↑Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:08 pm2mm ffg is plenty imo. I would not choose the chaparral platform since it looses edge because of the choil. An all edge model like the caribbean with ~100mm edge length would be great.
I read something about a planned cpm 15v knife and I think that this combination would be the best. :)
Though concerning a "thin Caribbean": I don´t know how a comp.lock would work with such a thin bladestock, that offers not much lock interface.
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
There is a chaparral xl. Its called a native.
“Putting fancy thoughts in a woman’s head is like putting lace on a bowling ball.....no good can come of it.” - Archie Bunker.
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
No offense, but did you actually read my original post? I may quote myself:
"Still, whenever I use my Chap FRN I wish there would be a longer version of it, or just any model in the Endela / Stretch size with both such a thin, slicey ffg blade (2mm) and such a thin handle and by that thin profile in the pocket..."
The Native does not have that great thin blade, nor that thin handle and by that thin profile in the pocket
The Native also does not offer more edge than the Chap (while being much thicker), it is not really a larger knife (and for me personally even LESS stable in hand than the Chap when I really USE and not just HOLD the knives).
So, while the Native is totally fine, it is "just" another rather regular 3 mm stock Spyderco and not a "thin edition" or "Chap XL".
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Ah, I thought you just meant blade length and shape.
I agree with the thin blade. I have the titanium native and adore it, as it slices better than most any other knife I have.
Recently I bought 2 zt 0562 knives and they are like folding hatchets. Great for cutting mudflaps a d traffic cones, but thats it. They even suck whittling wood. They say “proudly overbuilt” but in reality they are so thick they are not great at cutting much.
The chaparral is magnificent at slicing and cutting. The native is no slouch there either. I bought 4 of the g10 that are lined with the s35vn when I heard they were going all plastic and linerless. I got one by mistake and it looked and felt cheap. I swapped my native maxamet blade into the black g10 so it was not a total loss.
I do agree folding knives are better suited to slicing and cutting than batoning, chopping, drilling, hammering and such.
I agree with the thin blade. I have the titanium native and adore it, as it slices better than most any other knife I have.
Recently I bought 2 zt 0562 knives and they are like folding hatchets. Great for cutting mudflaps a d traffic cones, but thats it. They even suck whittling wood. They say “proudly overbuilt” but in reality they are so thick they are not great at cutting much.
The chaparral is magnificent at slicing and cutting. The native is no slouch there either. I bought 4 of the g10 that are lined with the s35vn when I heard they were going all plastic and linerless. I got one by mistake and it looked and felt cheap. I swapped my native maxamet blade into the black g10 so it was not a total loss.
I do agree folding knives are better suited to slicing and cutting than batoning, chopping, drilling, hammering and such.
“Putting fancy thoughts in a woman’s head is like putting lace on a bowling ball.....no good can come of it.” - Archie Bunker.
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Thanks for your reply!Robishere wrote: ↑Mon Nov 18, 2019 12:08 pmAh, I thought you just meant blade length and shape.
I agree with the thin blade. I have the titanium native and adore it, as it slices better than most any other knife I have.
Recently I bought 2 zt 0562 knives and they are like folding hatchets. Great for cutting mudflaps a d traffic cones, but thats it. They even suck whittling wood. They say “proudly overbuilt” but in reality they are so thick they are not great at cutting much.
The chaparral is magnificent at slicing and cutting. The native is no slouch there either. I bought 4 of the g10 that are lined with the s35vn when I heard they were going all plastic and linerless. I got one by mistake and it looked and felt cheap. I swapped my native maxamet blade into the black g10 so it was not a total loss.
I do agree folding knives are better suited to slicing and cutting than batoning, chopping, drilling, hammering and such.
I think that 3mm bladestock (Native) is a good choice for a general utility folder! Though a blade as short as the Natives could go with 2.5 (as the Delica does), and 3mm is a better general thickness for knives in the Endura size range, just imho of course
So I would not want to have ONLY 2mm / "thin editions" like the Chap is, but at least ONE bigger "thin edition" knife (Stretch / PM2 / Endela size) would be great!! :)
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
BUMP
Anyone interested in 3.5 inch (8,8 cm) 2 mm thin stock knife? I am for sure. True dedicated slicer, Chaparral on steroids :D
But thicker handle would be better
Anyone interested in 3.5 inch (8,8 cm) 2 mm thin stock knife? I am for sure. True dedicated slicer, Chaparral on steroids :D
But thicker handle would be better
In the pocket: Chaparral FRN, Native Chief, Police 4 K390, Pacific Salt SE, Manix 2 G10 REX45
Re: Still wishing for a Chaparral XL / Endela "thin edition" / or something along that lines
Pancake, thanks for bumbing "my" thread! :)
Chap XL: Still 2mm ffg blade and the handle could stay as thin as in the current one too for me...
Chap XL: Still 2mm ffg blade and the handle could stay as thin as in the current one too for me...
Top three going by pocket-time (update March 24):
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)
- EDC: Endura thin red line ffg combo edge (VG10); Wayne Goddard PE (4V), Endela SE (VG10)
-Mountains/outdoors: Pac.Salt 1 SE (H1), Salt 2 SE (LC200N), and also Wayne Goddard PE (4V)