My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

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wrdwrght
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My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#1

Post by wrdwrght »

So, the spinning pivot on my K390 Urban has led to me this:

Image

Those are Cuscadi's "Silk" CF handle-slabs. I like 'em!

The Glesser look-and-feel has suited me fine, so I've been disinclined to mod or customize. But, in light of Koenigsegg's report in a recent thread on pivot-spinning, I imagined W&R would give me no joy, and there was Lucas at Cuscadi ready to help.

I've learned a few things along the way and I want to share.

The Urban truly is a wonderfully simple design, but if you treat it like other Spydies, you could find yourself in trouble like me and others.

What sets the Urban apart (and the Squeak, if not the Pingo, too) is that its pivot, a flattened Chicago-screw assembly, relies on an unlined FRN slab for resistance to torque (whereas the metal liners on Japan-made Spydies provide this resistance, or so I infer, as I'm not a disassembler).

No biggie, UNLESS you, like me, are accustomed to torquing (always gently, of course) a pivot-screw to remove blade play.

My Urban kept getting this play (the male part of the Chicago-screw assembly always backed out during my compulsive open-close fidgets) and, before even contemplating thread-locker, I had ended up turning the male part deeper and deeper, overcoming the handle's resistance, and creating a spin that prevented me from backing out the male part. And still I had side-to-side blade play. :mad:

Once the Cuscadi slabs arrived, I tried numerous desperate methods to get the pivot-screw out of the original ones, including buying a special leather tool, heating the pivot (with a soldering pen; in boiling water), and applying TedP's dowel and Superglue, all to no avail.

Then I removed the handle's other Chicago-screws. My thought was that I could pry the FRN slabs apart to get the resistance I needed (if the slabs snapped, so be it). I pried, unscrewed, and out came the male part!

But I doubt prying was the critical force. Superglue had seeped into the FRN slab to secure the female part of the Chicago-screw assembly to the slab...

Hey, Sal, I think this fact speaks volumes for CQI, if opposing screw-heads (as on costlier Taichung- and Golden-made Spydies) do not.

Once I reassembled my Urban, I immediately sought just the tension needed to prevent blade play (didn't really need to fight the resistance), backed out the male part of the Chicago-screw assembly, dropped a dab of clear nail-polish into the female part, and returned the male part to the same tension.

Since letting the nail polish dry for a few hours yesterday, my subsequent repeated fidget tests have yet to dislodge the male part of the Chicago-screw assembly. My Urban still has no blade-play.
Last edited by wrdwrght on Sun Jun 24, 2018 12:29 pm, edited 4 times in total.
-Marc (pocketing an S30V Military2 today)

“When science changes its opinion, it didn’t lie to you. It learned more.”
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Calicoast
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#2

Post by Calicoast »

Thanks for the details.
Looking at purchasing the same scales, can you tell us how much you paid with ship?
C
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wrdwrght
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#3

Post by wrdwrght »

Calicoast wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 9:54 am
Thanks for the details.
Looking at purchasing the same scales, can you tell us how much you paid with ship?
C
70€ to my door. Took just over a week. Lucas will talk you through it.
-Marc (pocketing an S30V Military2 today)

“When science changes its opinion, it didn’t lie to you. It learned more.”
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#4

Post by koenigsegg »

Looks great! Glad you got the thing apart might have to ca glue my pivot
S30V, VG10, M4, XHP, BD1, Cruwear, Elmax, Maxamet, 204P, H1, K390, A11, Rex45, LC200N, M390, 20CV, BD1N, S45VN waiting to afford MagnaCut
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#5

Post by StuntZombie »

I kind of wish I had gone this route with my Urban, but I felt like my Squeak fulfilled pretty much the same role, while having a smaller footprint.

I still find it interesting that it seems like the Urban has this problem, while the UKPK does not. It makes me wonder what differences there are between the handles of the two knives.
Chris

Haves: Lava, Delica 4 Sante Fe Stoneworks, Spy-DK x2,

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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#6

Post by Liquid Cobra »

I’ve had the same problem on an urban and some ukpk’s. One method that helped was pushing down on the fence of the blade on a cutting board while I unscrew the pivot. The pressure helped keep he other side from spinning.
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#7

Post by Evil D »

I've got a Dragonfly with a spinning pivot. I really think linerless knives need to be fitted with the small 8 shaped liner/washer like the Manix 2 LW has. That way the D bolt has something more rigid holding it in place. It doesn't take much to strip FRN pivots.
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wrdwrght
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#8

Post by wrdwrght »

Hey Chris. I opened this thread hoping Sal will comment. It sure does seem that the Urban has a proclivity--under certain conditions--that needs to be addressed.

David, I didn't know the Dragonfly was prone to spin. My lined G10 one is rock-solid but I had forgotten that Salts, including another of my DFs, are unlined without opposing screw-heads. Are lightweight DFs the same?

Had LC not chimed in, I would have said that my linerless G10 UKPK's pivot was not fated to spin because it has opposing screw-heads.
-Marc (pocketing an S30V Military2 today)

“When science changes its opinion, it didn’t lie to you. It learned more.”
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#9

Post by Evil D »

wrdwrght wrote:
Sun Jun 24, 2018 3:06 pm

David, I didn't know the Dragonfly was prone to spin. My lined G10 one is rock-solid but I had forgotten that Salts, including another of my DFs, are unlined without opposing screw-heads. Are lightweight DFs the same?



Yeah they use the two piece make/female style pivot with only one screw. I wouldn't expect the G10 version to give you problems since the pivot goes through the liners, but it doesn't seem to take much to round out the hole in FRN. I had it happen on a Ladybug too and I overlooked that since the pivot is so tiny but I didn't expect it with the Dragonfly. I don't use any locktite on those anymore just in case.
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#10

Post by chocolatyshatner »

I've also had the Urban spinning pivot screw issue. My fault, I tightened the pivot screw a bit, and that did it. The blade play and action were actually at a good place at that point and then I made it way worse trying to get the thing apart :)
To be clear, the blade play and walk and talk were fine when I got the knife, I just felt that it could have been slightly tighter for my taste.

I LOVE the Urban's ergonomics and the k390 blade and still carry and use it daily for work. I'll probably get replacement scales eventually.
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#11

Post by Slumblor »

I've had this issue with a UKPK before. This thread has made me consider getting some aftermarket scales for my Urban though, I noticed recently that I tend to carry my K390 Urban quite a bit.
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wrdwrght
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#12

Post by wrdwrght »

FYI, my Chicago-screw assembly’s male part has just backed out in spite of the clear nail-polish I put in the female part. This, after several hours of gentle on-again off-again opening and closing.

What to do...
-Marc (pocketing an S30V Military2 today)

“When science changes its opinion, it didn’t lie to you. It learned more.”
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#13

Post by MichaelScott »

This is a heads-up for me. I have a UKPK coming. I plan to leave it the way it is. If I should encounter this issue, I will box it up and send it to the techs at Spyderco.
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#14

Post by aesmith »

I've not had problems with these and I have a couple of linerless knives. However if this is in fact a problem, wouldn't the best solution be to have screws with the slot or socket on both parts? Then the holes in the frn could just be round holes.
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wrdwrght
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#15

Post by wrdwrght »

aesmith wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 6:08 am
I've not had problems with these and I have a couple of linerless knives. However if this is in fact a problem, wouldn't the best solution be to have screws with the slot or socket on both parts? Then the holes in the frn could just be round holes.
Such were my thoughts for CQI.
-Marc (pocketing an S30V Military2 today)

“When science changes its opinion, it didn’t lie to you. It learned more.”
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#16

Post by GarageBoy »

How was this done on old liner less knives?

Is the other solution a fidget spinner?
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#17

Post by ZMW »

Mine spins as well, I tried most of the tricks you mentioned and could never get it to work :(
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Re: My Urban's Spinning Pivot: Lessons Learned

#18

Post by polyhexamethyl »

beautiful scales!
do the guys from cuscadi use washers?
the original scales have „built in“ washers if i remember correctly, right?
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