I love lock back knives!

[Surfingringo]

I know the back lock isn't the newest or most glamorous designs and doesn't always get a lot of love on the forums but they are one of my favorites. I love the simplicity and the ambidextrous function. I love the strong natural detent. I even love the way they sound when you open them and that back lock snaps into place. I enjoy my other locks too but I'm glad that Spyderco is still making plenty of lock backs. I would never overlook a knife because it has a backlock...if anything it makes the knife even more attractive to me. Anyone else feel the same?

Speaking of these locks, if anyone doesn't own the new Native you might want to give it a look. That knife has the most solid lockup of any backlock I have ever handled. I wish that I could get that level of perfection in the Japanese knives. I would love to have a Pacific Salt and a Delica that locked up as solid as my Native. There's nothing "wrong" with the japanese knives but they just aren't quite as tight as what Golden is doing with the backlock these days.

[average-Joe]

Agreed

[PM1]

I am left-handed, so back-locks are all good by me: much better than liner or frame locks. I like the compression lock, but it is also awkward for a lefty. Unsurprisingly, I have gravitated to the back-locks in Spyderco's locking-folder line-up. My only exception is the PM2.

Speaking about the Native 5 lock vs. the Japanese back-locks. I find the difference to be not relevant to me; however, I do see what you mean. If you want a Japanese back-lock knife with extra strength and power, check out a Ulize some time. It is beefy.

As an aside, when a knife that I like comes out with a right-hand only configuration, I find it frustrating. For example, open up your 2015 Spyderco catalogue and imagine what it is like for lefties with these: Slysz Bowie, Nilakka, and Memory. To a lesser extent this also applies to the Air and PPT. Oh well, at least Spyderco has other models for me.

[average-Joe]

^^^ follow lefty

[Holland]

I have to disagree. My favorite knives (dragonfly, chaparral, delica, caly) are all lockback, but the lockback is by far my least favourite lock. I have learned to deal with the up and down movement in the Japanese knives, but it still bothers me at times. Also, when I worked construction the lockbacks were more susceptible to dust and dirt. I would take a comp lock or liner lock over a backlock any day

[TomAiello]

The only lock that's really clicked with me is the CBBL (and BBL, bolt action and axis lock). Everything else is more or less the same to me. I know lots of people who love the comp lock (and the PM2) and I've tried repeatedly to warm up to it and I still always come back to the CBBL.

I'm just as happy with a lock back as anything else--except the CBBL, which I prefer to everything.

[Bill S.]

I have to disagree. My favorite knives (dragonfly, chaparral, delica, caly) are all lockback, but the lockback is by far my least favourite lock. I have learned to deal with the up and down movement in the Japanese knives, but it still bothers me at times. Also, when I worked construction the lockbacks were more susceptible to dust and dirt. I would take a comp lock or liner lock over a backlock any day

This. I love the pillar construction, too.

[SpyderNut]

I've got a soft spot for lock-backs too, although my favorite lock is probably still the Walker Liner Lock. RIL (Reeve Integral Lock) is also a favorite of mine.

[paladin]

All Aboard....Keep that mid-lock train rollin' ! :cool:

The Native 5 is the best iteration of the midlock by far, IMHO also Lance :spyder:

The walk & talk on my N5's is music to my ears!

Here's Mr. Blonde's vid with a GREAT explanation of that refined N5 lock by Eric, starting at about :50 sec mark:

https://youtu.be/XTSaVW0XSO0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Cujobob]

I can totally understand where lefties are coming from here, but being in the minority is what it is... Because personally, I hate when knives are open to pocket clips in a variety of carry methods and have holes placed all over.

Backlocks, to me, are okay, but not preferred. Most will get blade play of some kind. They often experience issues with material (usually lint) getting stuck inside that prevents the knife from fully locking up at times. There is a greater chance of accidentally unlocking the blade (I would guess) because the hand is always placed on the unlocking mechanism.

I like liner locks on light duty knives. I like well executed frame locks. The compression lock is fantastic (though I think a push button method of unlocking may be preferred). The CBBL is just a bit more of a nuisance than other types of locks, for me, but it's a great lock.

[TheOutdoorNerd]

I think the light weight of a lock back trumps the tradeoffs for EDC, which is why my EDC all time favorites are Dragonfly, Delica and Native. But if I worked in a dusty or dirty environment, I would probably have a different favorite, too. As far as the strength of the lock itself, if it's an issue, then I'm carrying a fixed blade. I don't see myself ever stressing a lock enough to find out the difference in lock strengths.

[SuckSqueezeBangBlow]

Love the sound!

[ChrisinHove]

All Aboard....Keep that mid-lock train rollin' ! :cool:

The Native 5 is the best iteration of the midlock by far, IMHO also Lance :spyder:

The walk & talk on my N5's is music to my ears!

Here's Mr. Blonde's vid with a GREAT explanation of that refined N5 lock by Eric, starting at about :50 sec mark:

https://youtu.be/XTSaVW0XSO0" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I hadn't seen that - it explains a lot.

The only thing I dislike about the N5 G10 is that I have to think of reasons to keep any other knife!

[Brock O Lee]

...the lockback is by far my least favourite lock. I have learned to deal with the up and down movement in the Japanese knives, but it still bothers me at times. Also, when I worked construction the lockbacks were more susceptible to dust and dirt. I would take a comp lock or liner lock over a backlock any day

Same here... I appreciate the strong self-close and simplicity, but the inherent up-down play always bothers me. An exception is the Native 5 (G10 and LW), the 3 I have are all rock solid.

[elena86]

This is a hot subject for me because as much as I like my japanese frn models I hate the up/down blade play they develop sooner or later .It is interesting but the linerless models or the pinned ones are less proned to develop vertical blade play.They seem more rigid.I don't understand why don't they implement the new improved back lock on all their models??? What's so complicated ?!

P.S All my Caly 3.5's had vertical blade play right from the factory .I was so frustrated Maybe I'm OCD but still unacceptable

[PM1]

as much as I like my japanese frn models I hate the up/down blade play they develop sooner or later .

Hmmm....

I just checked 6 different Japanese FRN models that I have: Delica 4, Endura 4, Matriarch 2, Salt I, Pacific Salt and Tasman. None of them have any up/down blade play.

Several questions occurred to me:

1) What exactly changes or wears that causes this up/down play?
2) Can it be eliminated by tightening the pivot screw?
3) Do the newer Spyderco models from Japan still have this blade play issue, or, has Spyderco's frequently talked about C.Q.I. fixed this problem?
4) If this is still a problem, why do none of my Japanese FRN models have such an issue? I bring one to work and use them every day.

Comments?

[elena86]

I forgot to mention that I never abuse or even hard use my folders,Maybe the solution would be to implement some sort of internal stop pin and AFAIK they did this in a few models.Maybe it's time for me to get my first Native5.The fact that they shortened the cutting edge and the lack of a thumb ramp drew me back.I once had a Native4 and I liked that one quite a lot.

[TheOutdoorNerd]

I just checked my Dragonfly, Delica and Native FRN and none have any blade play at all. They've all been carried extensively and have been treated to be what I consider to be harshly, but I guess there's different levels of harsh.

[Surfingringo]

I forgot to mention that I never abuse or even hard use my folders,Maybe the solution would be to implement some sort of internal stop pin and AFAIK they did this in a few models.Maybe it's time for me to get my first Native5.The fact that they shortened the cutting edge and the lack of a thumb ramp drew me back.I once had a Native4 and I liked that one quite a lot.

Every Japanese backlock I have owned has had slight up and down play. Of course, I am kind of OCD about blade play like you so we might be talking about an amount of play that other people wouldn't even notice. Anyway, I notice it but it doesn't really bother me. My absolute favorite and most used knives are the salts and though none of them lock up as solid as the Native 5, it doesn't stop them from being my favorites.

[PM1]

After thinking about it, I'm going to try to answer my own questions.

I don't see why up/down blade play is inevitable or even probable for the Spyderco Seki City FRN models that I own. I can't comment on how these knives were designed or made in the past; however, I have examined the guts of these current models and, upon reflection, I am not surprised there is no up/down play and I don't expect it to ever happen with my knives.

The initial fitting of the pieces, of course, is essential. It is also essential that all parts are properly hardened to an extent that they won't functionally deform through normal use. If these 2 criteria are met then these FRN Seki City lock-back knives, as currently designed by Spyderco, should be good to go.

The knives that I checked have "up" blade play prevented because a flat on the back of the blade pushes against a flat on the lock bar. Unless the lock bar can be shoved horizontally, which shouldn't be possible if the lock bar screw/housing is fitted and secure, then the blade can't move "up". Similarly, the blade can't move "down" because a flat-edged hook on the back of the blade is butted against another flat surface on the underside of the lock bar. Once again, unless the lock bar can be moved in a way which the lock bar screw/housing should not allow to happen, the blade can't move "down".

I don't know what happened with elena86's Caly 3.5s, but they are not FRN Seki City knives. It sounds like there was a bad batch of those that were not properly made in the first place, since she had the same issue with more than one of them.

In my opinion, the initial fitting of parts and part quality is the key. My Spyderco FRN Seki City lock-backs are all well made, and the current design seems sound to me.

If I'm wrong, tell me why.