plain ground vs hollow ground

[fireball]

Are there certain cases where its preferable to buy a hollow ground or a flat ground knife?

Are hollow ground knifes generally sharper?

In my country we like to grill sausages on wood sticks when hiking, see the picture:



In order to grill like this, you have maybe to cut a stick from a tree if there is nothing on the ground, and then you have to sharpen the stick on one end to put your sausage on it. My question to this topic: Are hollow ground blades like these two ....



... stable enough for doing this job, or do I need a flat ground?

[VashHash]

they would do just fine

[Invective]

I've used my Yojimbo2 to chop clean through chicken bone and not had a problem. Isn't the most conclusive test but it's the most I've pushed it. Just make sure not to twist during the cut and you'll be golden.

[MachSchnell]

I guess by plain you mean flat? In any case I much prefer a flat grind to a hollow grind, of course this is just my personal preference. That said, I don't mind high hollow grinds on thin blades, but I'll stay away from hollow ground blades with a thick blade stock.

[Blerv]

Usually plain indicates edge type (plain edge, partially serrated, serrated). Just as a side note.

Hollow grind vs Flat grind is a common debate with Spyderco since so many models are available in both configurations. The Dragonfly2 Salt is actually hollow ground but often that is referred to "high hollow" since the grind line stop over half past the middle of the blade.

Generally...

Flat:
Pros - often thinner tips due to being ground vertical then horizontal (distal taper), less drag on more dense materials, less aggressive looks, less weight.
Cons - more expensive to produce, H1 can't be done that way on a production scale, not quite as much variability due to linear grinding.

Hollow:
Pros: some people like grind lines, can vary the thickness of the blade in different styles/dimensions, basic hollow-grinding is cheaper, in theory less steel behind the edge due to concaved grinding
Cons: I'm tired and it seems this is repeating somehow :)

Hope that gives some extra things to consider! You're going to find a TON of opinions. Ultimately different approaches for different styles/purposes. Variety is the spice of life . I like HG for harder use and FFG for slicers. Thick knives tend to be thick behind the edge; thin ones its harder to tell.

[SolidState]

I've used my hollow ground delica to carve many sticks for marshmallows, hot dogs, sausages etc. I've also used it to clean turkeys, rabbits and pheasant. I've used it to whittle and cut carpet as well. I've also done some leather work with the tip. They hold up well.

[Donut]

I have sharpened pencils with a Serrated Lil Matriarch. It works pretty well.

[phillipsted]

I would concur with what's been said so far - and I generally like full-flat-ground blades. But I also really enjoy the Gayle Bradley with its high hollow grind.

The one grind style with some quirks is the chisel grind - where one side is flat ground and the other side is not ground (like a chisel!). Regardless of whether these blades are serrated, you must account for the unequal grind angles when you are trying to make accurate, precise cuts. The chisel grind has a tendency to "wander off line" if you aren't watching it. On the upside, chisel grinds are extremely good for some specific tasks, like pruning plants, marking lines, and chiseling or planing wood.

TedP

[Jet B]

The blade grind is like tires on a car. They might all feel a bit different but they still get the job done in the end. You will only really notice a difference if you are comparing them side by side and being really picky like most of us here.

Except for chisel grind... That's like having 2 bigger tires on one side so your car always pulls one way.

[Pockets]

As long as the end result is a knife with a blade that is thin behind the edge, you'll be fine.

Welcome to the Forum.

[dbcad]

When sharpening/touching up a hollow grind the cross sectional surface area behind the edge will remain a tad smaller for a bit longer. Aspiring edge nuts enjoy this trait :eek:

[Clip]

Both will do the job nicely, if kept sharp.

[fireball]

First of all: Thank you for all the answers.

I've used my Yojimbo2 to chop clean through chicken bone and not had a problem. Isn't the most conclusive test but it's the most I've pushed it. Just make sure not to twist during the cut and you'll be golden.

Good point. Normally I twist the knife out of my wrist with evey carving motion when sharpening a stick. So I would have to concentrate to not do any more with a hollow grind blade and only do a straight forward motion.

As long as the end result is a knife with a blade that is thin behind the edge, you'll be fine. Welcome to the Forum.

Thank you :)

I guess by plain you mean flat? In any case I much prefer a flat grind to a hollow grind

That's right. And WHY do you prefer a flat grind?

Flat:
Pros - often thinner tips due to being ground vertical then horizontal (distal taper), less drag on more dense materials, less aggressive looks, less weight.
Cons - more expensive to produce, H1 can't be done that way on a production scale, not quite as much variability due to linear grinding.

Hollow:
Pros: some people like grind lines, can vary the thickness of the blade in different styles/dimensions, basic hollow-grinding is cheaper, in theory less steel behind the edge due to concaved grinding

I like HG for harder use and FFG for slicers.

??? This answer confuses me. Did you maybe mix a few thins up? I heard that a hollow grind is harder to do. And that a hollow grinds is not so sturdy because of less material and as Invective said "dont twist it". And given the same spine, a hollow grind should weight less. Etc.

I generally like full-flat-ground blades.

For what reason?

they would do just fine

Its good to hear that both grinds will do the job. But that brings me back to the beginning:


Let me ask again: Are there some applications for which a hollow or a flat grind is better? Do hollow and flat grinds have different properties? Is a hollow grind practically sharper for the price of not being as sturdy and less edge retention as a flat or convex grind? Or ist that all more or less just a matter of appearance and style/design and personal gusto/preference?

[Blerv]

Compare FFG to HG models of the same Spyderco. The flat grind is almost always lighter. There is less steel on the knife and that adds wear to grinding belts (ie more $).

The other comments towards edge geometry are accurate in most cases. There is less material behind the edge for hollow-grind so the edge isn't quite as stout for twisting; the tip and spine are generally much thicker.

Don't know what else to say :) . Let me know if you find more information. I'm always up for more reading.

[fireball]

Compare FFG to HG models of the same Spyderco. The flat grind is almost always lighter.

Yes, I checked it: The dragonfly flat ground is 1 gramm less.

There is less steel on the knife and that adds wear to grinding belts.

Aha, you mean the grinding belts are the expensive part.

The other comments towards edge geometry are accurate in most cases.

I'm not sure if I understand this sentence. Does it mean "yes, hollow grind is sharper but is less sturdy and has less edge retention than flat ground"?

[Zenith]

You might find this interesting: http://www.jayfisher.com/Blades.htm

Look into:
- What is blade geometry, and why is it important?
- Knife blade relief face angle and the cutting edge
- Grind geometry comparison
- Blade Grind Depth

It is a good starting point for anyone wanting to know more.

[Melektau]

What is plain ground?

[Fancier]

Okay, I like flat ground blades for making long slices through stiff material like cardboard, since the spine doesn't bind in the cut and the cuts remain straighter.
Hollow ground knives tend to be "thinner behind the edge" and thus slice flexible or thinner material with less effort, but have a thick spine to keep the knife rigid.
Since I open a lot of packages and break down the boxes afterwards to fit in the recycling bin I tend to carry flat ground knives.
For cutting a wiener stick I think either grind will work fine, although I still prefer a flat grind (with a plain edge because it is easier to sharpen).

[The Deacon]

What is plain ground?

Nothing. But, like most of the folks who responded, I'm fairly certain the OP was using that term to describe flat ground. The only real question would be what "flavor" of flat grind he was thinking of, flat saber, full flat, or zero edge full flat. Only he could say for sure, and I'm not sure if he's even been back since he started this thread three months ago.