help with Sharpmaker

[Special K]

Hello everyone,

I recently bought a Spyderco Sharpmaker based on reading a number of good reviews on various websites. The only problem is that I can't seem to sharpen any of my kitchen knives or a pocket knife I have with the Sharpmaker.

The first thing I should point out is that these are VERY cheap knives. The kitchen knives are a Farberware set consisting of a chef's knife, a slicer, and a paring knife. The entire set was $8 at Walmart. This is my first set of kitchen knives and my thinking was that I wanted to practice cutting, sharpening, etc. on a cheap set of knives before buying a nice set. I would describe the knives' sharpness as barely functional. The chef's knife can't cleanly cut through an apple in one stroke, for instance.

I'm not sure who made the pocket knife as a friend gave it to me a long time ago, but the handle is cheap plastic so I would imagine it didn't cost much more than the kitchen knives. It is completely dull, both before and after sharpening with the Sharpmaker.

After reading the Sharpmaker manual and watching the DVD, I proceeded to use the standard 20 strokes/side method in each of the 4 block configurations as outlined in the directions. I could clearly see that some metal was being taken off the knives and deposited on the stones, but after going through the sharpening procedure none of my knives seemed any sharper than when I started.

What could I be doing wrong? The method seems foolproof, but maybe there is some detail I am missing. Is it the case that some very cheap knives simply can't be sharpened very much? Were these knives sharpened to some strange angle in the factory that prevents the fixed angle of the sharpmaker from being effective? Do I need to buy the diamond rods?

Any advice would be appreciated.

[dapagco]

Post caught in our imperfect spam filter.

[.357 mag]

the angle on the knives are most likely steeper then the 20 degree angle on the sharpmaker. Paint the edge with a sharpy marker and don't quit the gray corners until the marker is completely gone. Then switch to the flats, white corners, white flats.

[rg02]

the angle on the knives are most likely steeper then the 20 degree angle on the sharpmaker. Paint the edge with a sharpy marker and don't quit the gray corners until the marker is completely gone. Then switch to the flats, white corners, white flats.

x2-----the sharpie trick is awesome

I would also recommend picking up the diamond stones and ultra fine stones to accompany your medium and fine stones.

[1623]

Reprofiling may be your best bet, in which case (as was said) the Diamond rods will be a worthy investment if your primary tool will be the Sharpmaker. It has been said that they take far too long for this kind of work but your knives are most likely a softer Steel so it shouldn't be too bad.

The UF stones are worth picking up as well; they really do finish off the edge very nicely.

[hardkiss]

For me personally i think i might be a combo of if things. Them being on the low end spectrum might be one cause. Chefs knives are sometimes sharpened at a steeper angle like .357 said and your more than likely reprofiling the edge thinking your sharpening the edge. That is why u see metal on the rods but no results.

[dcmartin2001]

A big +1 on the sharpie trick. I would also suggest getting a 10x loupe. Sometimes you think you are getting all of the sharpie but there is still some there at the very leading edge. If there is ANY sharpie visible at the edge, even a faint hint if it you are not getting it as sharp as you can...

Best of Luck!

[BAL]

Reprofiling may be your best bet, in which case (as was said) the Diamond rods will be a worthy investment if your primary tool will be the Sharpmaker. It has been said that they take far too long for this kind of work but your knives are most likely a softer Steel so it shouldn't be too bad.

The UF stones are worth picking up as well; they really do finish off the edge very nicely.

Agree with 1623 on getting the diamond rods for working on older duller knives. The diamond rods allow you to take off more in a shorter amount of time and less work. Sometimes you have to go more than the 20 strokes. It all depends on how dull the edge is when you start.


Also, it may look easy to use the sharpmaker, and basically it is, however, there is a certain amount of muscle memory involveD in getting the exact same stroke down to keep the edge at the same angle. I have had days where I couldn't get anything sharp and others where it was like magic getting a sharp edge. Like with anything, the more you use it the better you will get. Also agree on the UF stones as well. The sharpmaker is a great investment if you have knives. Good luck.

[Special K]

Thanks for the advice everyone. I will definitely try the sharpie trick and it sounds like the diamond stones would help a lot too.

I have another question:

How do I really tell when it is time to switch from one grit of stone to the next? I watched the DVD that came with my Sharpmaker again and the only real guidelines they give are the fingernail trick for moving from the coarse corners to the coarse flats (i.e. drag knife blade across fingernail; if it catches into the nail without sliding off, the edge is set and knife is sharp enough to move from the coarse corners to the coarse flats), and the "20 strokes" count for each of the other 3 configurations.

My kitchen knives and pocket knive mentioned in my first post seem to pass the fingernail test, but they also don't seem very sharp when I'm actually using them.

Similarly, how would I know how long to use the diamond rods before switching to the coarse stones if I were to buy them?

I did some reading online about knife sharpening and many articles mention sharpening with a given grit until you get a burr on each side, then switching to the next finer grit and repeating the process. That seems to assume you are only sharpening one side at a time. With the Sharpmaker, you alternate strokes. Wouldn't that effectively eliminate any burr that would otherwise form?

[Special K]

Just to add a follow up to my last post, I tried the sharpie trick on the pocket knife I have been trying to sharpen. All of the ink has come off just from using corners of the coarse stones that came with my Sharpmaker, but the knife doesn't seem much sharper. Does that just mean I need to keep sharpening and/or get coarser stones?

BTW I also learned that cleaning the stones off every 10-20 strokes seems to make a difference. You can feel and hear the difference when the stones aren't clogged with steel from the knife.

[.357 mag]

Try this... http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=-MHe_8wTHmg

[Donut]

Mag, that link doesn't seem very useful.

You shouldn't have to clean it every 10-20 strokes, I can go for hundreds of strokes and don't need to clean them.

Try to keep the knife straight while sharpening. That's the only thing I can think that if you're removing the sharpie all the way to the edge, would be stopping your knife from getting sharp.

[Special K]

Try this... http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=-MHe_8wTHmg

That link doesn't seem to work. It just takes me to a page with sections titled "Subscriptions", "Recommended", and "Trends".

[Knutty]

I wouldn't use a Sharpie on any knife that was going to be used on food. But that's me.

[rg02]

I wouldn't use a Sharpie on any knife that was going to be used on food. But that's me.

The stone removes all of the sharpie assuming you are hitting all of the bevel/micro bevel dependIng on what you are working on. I do always was my blades with warm soapy water after sharpening as well.

The Sharpie trick is a great tool to make sure you are sharpening where you want to.....

To the OP, check this out on YouTube :

Jdavis882 knows his stuff IMO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MHe_8wT ... ata_player

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_mSNfJh ... ata_player

Hope these help you out. Let us know how you progress....

[dbcad]

I would suggest getting some magnification. For me the Lee Valley 15X lighted loupe lets me know clearly what I'm doing or not doing to the edge :)

[Special K]

I wouldn't use a Sharpie on any knife that was going to be used on food. But that's me.

I see your point. I'm only using the sharpie on the pocket knife. I'm also only using the pocket knife to learn how to sharpen knives, so I really don't care what happens to it in the end (although hopefully I can get it really sharp).

[Special K]

The stone removes all of the sharpie assuming you are hitting all of the bevel/micro bevel dependIng on what you are working on. I do always was my blades with warm soapy water after sharpening as well.

The Sharpie trick is a great tool to make sure you are sharpening where you want to.....

To the OP, check this out on YouTube :

Jdavis882 knows his stuff IMO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MHe_8wT ... ata_player

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_mSNfJh ... ata_player

Hope these help you out. Let us know how you progress....

Those were useful videos, although he says that the Sharpmaker is really more of a Sharpkeeper, and that if you want to sharpen a really dull knife you would be better off using some other method (although he doesn't say what method that would be).

I did some more searching and have found mixed reviews of the diamond rods. Some say they work fine for restoring a dull knife, others say they still take too long to be practical.

I still have one question: how do I know when to move from one grit to the next? Is it when a burr is formed on both sides?

Are you still forming burrs with the Sharpmaker if you alternate strokes on each side?

[dbcad]

Don't move off of the brown stones until the knife cuts paper easily. You need to make sure you have reached the edge. The fine stones are more for polishing than metal removal.

I'll reiterate my suggestion about a loupe. For $35 it has been one of the best sharpening investments I've made. It helps so much when you can clearly see what you are doing to the edge :)

"Loupe is #1 teacher"

[rg02]

Jdavis882 does refer to the SM as a "sharp keeper ", however he does not consider the diamond stones in his videos. I do know that he owns an edge pro and a bunch of free hand stones which I believe is his current method to sharpen.

Personally, I have completely reprofiled back bevels and micro bevels on 4 different knives and didn't think the diamond stones took too long. I don't think my knives were super messed up though.

As for knowing when to stop with the brown stones, use them until the sharpie is all gone on the micro bevel and until the knife can cut computer paper. Then do the same with the fine and ultra fine stones but switch to phone book paper. Even with just the fine stones you should be able to shave hair and cut phone book paper easily.....

I would also get a loupe(as many have said). Sometimes it looks like all of the sharpie is gone to the naked eye, but you may be missing it on the micro bevel.