Tactical Mistakes that I Made in a SD Situation

Dr. Snubnose · #1

Tactical Mistakes I made in a SD situation
The idea for this thread is an outgrowth of another thread in the off-topic section started by me entitled “If you want to kick my butt…”. In the thread I mentioned I was once attacked by 11 youths in a robbery attempt and C.Joe wanted to hear the story... I quote from the other post “Ay Chris I have been thinking about your post above...My first thoughts were it's probably inappropriate for me to post one of my many war stories on this forum...it's not like me to toot my own horn or try to impress people with my martial arts skill level. That being said and after some careful consideration, I thought maybe this one story would be Ok. The incident (attempted robbery) mentioned by me earlier in this thread, where I was surrounded by 11 youths who were up to no good and wanted to separate me from my money and steal my car at gunpoint, was very interesting to say the least. Being the teacher that I am, I figured the post would be Ok because I made a lot of tactical errors in this crazy encounter, and my reasoning for the post would be If I could recount the incident for you and explain what tactical errors I made, this might be a learning experience for others who might benefit by understanding what I did wrong in that situation.”

Then I thought about it some more and posted this “ I was thinking...maybe after writing the story I should post a new thread which will allow others to share their stories of tactical mistakes they have made in a SD situation, this way we can all learn from each other....Doc” So that is how this thread got started, please add your stories if you want, if you don’t know what you did wrong in your story we can do an analysis of what could have been done differently. I hope all will learn a thing or two by reading and contributing to this thread.

My Story: Armed Robbery Attempt.
It was a cold and blistery afternoon in February during the 1980s, I think around 1985. The day before there was a pretty nasty ice storm that covered the whole entire area in a sheet of ice. Every leafless tree had ice sickles hanging from every branch in a magnificent display of nature as the landscape looked like one big ice sculpture. It was Saturday afternoon, I had just finished doing a special workshop for my Kung Fu students where I demonstrated and lectured about 20 different Martial Arts. Basically I had students attack me at random and I demonstrated how different Martial Arts would deal with that attack in a different way.

I demonstrated some Japanese Karate, Chen and Sun Style Tai Chi Chuan, Filipino Stick Fighting, Boxing, Wrestling, Aikido, Judo, Five Animal Shaolin Kung Fu, Eagle Claw Kung Fu, White Crane Kung Fu, Northern Long Fist Kung Fu, Praying Mantis Kung Fu, Ba Gua, Hsing-I Kung Fu, Choy Lee Fut Kung Fu, Wing Chun Kung Fu and a few other styles I can’t remember right now. The Demonstration and Lecture took about four hours. All had fun and it was quite informative for students to watch how the styles might differ in their approach to the same tactical situation.

The day of the workshop/Demo I drove my antique 1961 Classic Mercedes Benz 190SL to work. The reason being I desperately needed new windshield wipers for it and I amazingly found an Aids Auto Store the day before that had a pair to fit my car in stock. I figured after the workshop I’d drive over and get the wipers; my only other option was to wait weeks ordering then through a mail order car parts catalogue and have them shipped from another state or country. The problem was that the store was in a very bad neighborhood. I drove to the store park right at the front door and ran inside to buy the wipers hoping that I wouldn’t come back to find my car up on cinder blocks stripped of it’s tires…LOL. The transaction went smooth and quick and I was out of there in a jiff…driving happily home without incident. The temperatures had crept up that day to around 33 degrees and it started to rain lightly. The combination of my bad wipers and now freezing rain sticking to those wipers made it increasingly difficult to see out the windshield. When I reached the border line between bad town and good town (the good town was a very wealthy affluent area) I decided to stop and quickly change the wipers. I pulled the car to the side of the road, turned on the windshield defrost and got out of the car to change the wipers. Rain had turned to sleet at this point and only after exiting the car did I notice a large group of young men (11 to be exact) between the ages of 16-20 were hanging out on the opposite street corner from where I stopped. I did not perceive any threat or danger eyeballing the group and I remember saying to myself, oh it’s just a bunch of kids.

Tactical Mistake #1: I should have known better, a block earlier there wasn’t anyone standing on the street corners and probably a block later the same would exist. But I choose to stop here and discount the fact that 11 kids standing on a street corner in the sleeting rain might pose a threat to me. I had known for a long time even if one gets a flat tire in a bad neighborhood, it is better to drive on the rim for a few blocks till you reach a well lit area with more people around (like a gas station) or a better area period…A few blocks can mean all the difference in the world when it comes to your personal safety. I begin to rip open the packaged wipers when one of the no goods comes over to the car and starts talking to me…I was a little shocked, he kept saying “you want some high power” I was like huh? I didn’t know what he was talking about till he opened the flip-tops on two boxes of Kool cigs to expose drugs stuffed inside. I told him “Naw Naw I don’t do that stuff”, waving him away as I looked down and finished attaching the first wiper.

Tactical Mistake #2: Once again I discounted the serious nature of this approach. I should have never taken my eyes off the guy that’s number one…number two, I should have immediately gotten in my car and drove to a safer location. Instead I proceeded to the opposite side of the car (passenger side to affix the second wiper)

As I was doing this the group managed to cross the street and by the time I got the second wiper on they had surrounded me in a small semi-circle (2 to 3 people deep) Now my internal alarms went off…I quickly looked around and notice two kids stayed behind on the other corner and one was crossing the street in the opposite direction as to say I’m out of here, I don’t want any part of this…so now I took a quick head count, I was dealing with 8 people.

Tactical Mistake #3: I allowed myself to be boxed in. I was trapped with no where to go, no avenue for escape, I allowed my self to be trapped between my own car and this pack of hungry jackals. If I had the car between me and them I would have had other options available to me.

One of the guys in front of me commanded…”Hey! Give me yo money and give me dose keys” Realizing now that I was in trouble, I picked my hands up (open palms facing them, in a non-threatening protective position) to have them ready, I began talking nervously…Actually I couldn’t shut up, I told them “hey you got the wrong guy here”, stuff like “we’re cool”…..”you don’t want to do this man” come on guys give me a break”. I felt like my talking was at least distracting as this bad situation unfolded. Then I saw it, one of the kids in the back row reached into his coat pocket and slid a gun out, keeping it hidden at his side close to his body… it was black, looked like it was a S&W Model 36 .38 special, but I couldn’t be sure…all I knew was the anti had just gone up and I was now dealing with the threat of being shot and or possibly killed. This is where years and years of Martial Arts training came into play and helped me out. The ground on the corner where we all stood was covered in ice. Now for years my teacher in Shaolin Kung Fu thought it important for me to able to fight on all different surfaces and in all different types of environments. So for years I trained in sand, on pebbles and rocks, rolling hills, mountains, in the water, on steps, on a wooden picnic bench, on six foot pilings, on ice, in the rain, snow, wind, heat, you name it…my teacher found a way to torture me. Even when we went into the basement of his home the flooring was linoleum tiles and he would pour talcum powder all over the floors and make me do my forms and spar on those floors….talk about slippery!....took me years to master control…This type of training gave me the tactical advantage that day to win and walk away without a scratch. I was the only one who could use leg tactics and techniques and was assured a position of good solid footing and maneuverability. I thank my teacher for that one CONTINUED...In next Post

Dr. Snubnose · #2

continued:

One of the fellows in front reaches out with his left hand and grabs my right wrist. I didn’t go into any fancy martial arts stances nor did I use any fancy kung fu techniques (I know you are disappointed to hear that LOL) In fact I used the same technique and hand formation three times in different ways to protect myself, and it was a simple technique…one I teach to beginning level students…The hand formation is called a Tiger’s Mouth. It is nothing more than an open palm with a large separation forming a U-Channel between my index finger and thumb ( much like if you had a headache and you were to drag an open palm down the front of your face). I took my Tiger’s Mouth and rolled it around the outside of his limb, breaking his hold on me and grabbing him back in return pushing and pressing his limb across his body and directing him into the gunman who was trying to get closer to me. I used this guy as my shield, but he slipped on the ice and fell to the ground. Everyone was in motion, and I was still talking and moving. I took a left hand Tiger’s Mouth thrusting it forwards towards the throat of another guy to my left (the direction the gunman was moving). I missed the throat as he retracted but hit him square in the manubrium, the upper part of his sternum) he went down hard as his feet slipped out in front from underneath him. He stayed down, cracking his head open from the fall on the ice. I started to back up and move to the rear end of the car hoping to reach the drivers door on the other side…you know the expression “To many cooks spoil the broth” Well in this case it was too many people botching up the robbery attempt, it was like everyone was getting into everyone’s way and the gunman couldn’t reach me. I was able to make it around the other side of the car without anyone touching me….as I reached to the drivers side door handle, the gunman realized I was basically walking away from his robbery attempt. It was do or die time on his part. He rushed at me holding the gun up aim at my face and yelled “freeze Mother------“ It was pure kung fu survival instinct that took over at this point, no more thinking…just action, I slid my front foot forwards and outwards, sliding it against the surface of the ice while bending my other knee lowering my level to the ground, (we call it a snake stance in Kung Fu) I was avoiding being in line with the pointed gun, I came up fast from under his extended arm and smashed another Tiger’s Mouth into his elbow, shattering his elbow…he gave out a blood curt ling scream, the gun went flying in the air and everyone else took off in different directions…The two guys that first attacked me were still on the ground as the others ran away. One even tried to explain to me how he didn’t even know those other guys….LOL…
I picked up the gun and inspected it to find a red plastic X in the front barrel…it wasn’t real…it was a starter pistol, but I didn’t know that fact till I picked it up…it looked too real to me when the guy shoved it at my face.

Tactical Mistake #4: I am almost ashamed to mention this one…first off I reached into my coat pockets and found I was carrying two balisongs…forgot they were even there…I had them with me for the earlier demonstration. Secondly I wanted these street punks to realize that they got off easy and were lucky this day, I wanted them to know that they took their lives in their hands trying a stunt like they tried…because you never know who you are messing with. I was angry…very angry, specially since this guy on the ground is telling me he didn’t even know these guys and the fact that I went through this whole ordeal thinking I was being held up with a real live gun, going through all the physiological and psychological reactions and scare my body had to deal with. I was soooo mad. I took out one of my business cards and threw it down on the guys chest…telling him to let his friends know how close they came to dying… What’s up with that….Is that crazy on my part…giving the criminal who just attacked me my name and address at work…..was I out of my mind… I must have been…Today, I wonder what movie I saw that in….but it’s got to be one of the stupidest things I ever did…I got into my car and drove away….
Well live and learn…three days later they came back and damaged my antique Mercedes while parked at work, poking a hole right through my trunk which costs me a small fortune to repair. After that they left me alone....Doc :D

FissionMailed · #3

Jesus Doc, that's crazy. You gotta lay off the action flicks. :P Glad you're alright though. Did this happen on Long Island?

Dr. Snubnose · #4

FissionMailed wrote:Jesus Doc, that's crazy. You gotta lay off the action flicks. :P Glad you're alright though. Did this happen on Long Island?

Yes, The Old Lawrence-Inwood Borderline...Five Towns Nassau County...Happened about 26 years ago though...and I'm a little smarter now...Doc :D

tonydahose · #5

great story Doc, i don't have any tactical mistakes stories unless you want to count stupid stuff i have done at fires and i dont think this thread is about that.

FissionMailed · #6

Dr. Snubnose wrote:Yes, The Old Lawrence-Inwood Borderline...Five Towns Nassau County...Happened about 26 years ago though...and I'm a little smarter now...Doc :D

Long Island is crazy like that. I live like 5 minutes from one of the poorest sections of the whole island and 20 from the wealthiest. But yeah i missed the part where you said in the 80s hahaha.

HotSoup · #7

Doc, excellent story! Happy that you made it out okay despite your 'mistakes'. Seems to me you did good!

Creepo · #8

Cool/(not-cool) story Doc! :cool:
That really demonstates the importance of street smarts and a good situation evaluation, best way to survive such an encounter is to not get in one in the first place.

As far the TM #4, can't blame you, pretty much anyone would be pretty **** pissed at that point. And with all that adrenaline running in your veins, it's hard to think straight.
Maybe you should have another business card made, without a real name and address, just Dr. Snubnose + badass title. :D

SolidState · #9

Hi Doc,

I can't blame you for the missteps, but your car probably still holds a grudge about that business card. I have a few stories about tactical mistakes, and I know how it is in those situations. When people try to take important psychological things from you, people rarely react well. I've had some really horrible behavior after surviving questionable situations that I can only attribute to natural territorial urination after a display of dominance. When the reptile brain takes over, it really takes over.

It's really good that you did a redux on the event afterwards. Turning those things into unplanned learning opportunities is wonderful.

c.joe · #10

Doc, first of all, thank you so much for sharing and relieving our curiosity. I really hope it wasn't too much trouble to type all that out as I was almost joking for you to tell it here. I haven't read something this great in a long time now. (school textbooks has granted me nothing but a boring life) Your story really motivates me to get out and dedicate a part of my life to a fighting or self defensive art. I have done BJJ for a little bit and use to practice it a lot but I have never really dedicated completely. I am really interested in taking up something that one day I might have to apply. (especially to protect my family and friends) Problem is, I really don't know where to start. At first MBC (which I was most interested in initially) seemed like something that I would learn and practice for fun and knowledge, but now I wouldn't mind taking it seriously. However, I would also like to have a nonlethal option for SD too. (and maybe something more practical especially for someone like me who considers the blade as a last resort. But I hear a lot of MBC's concepts can be applied in a nonlethal manner as well.)

Like SolidState said, you really can't blame yourself for all those mistakes. In my opinion, it couldn't have gone any better. You were alive and well, and that's all that counts. I am glad that you were able to apply what you have mastered for so long and experience what it feels to have so much stress and adrenaline running through you. It is good to know that there is a "good" in the world that might save another life one day.

Things that I have learned and relearned from your post that I could apply for myself:
-try to defuse the situation verbally
-Calm down and assess the situation
-Don't get cornered (I have honestly never thought much about this)
-Find an escape route (something that I have always done whenever things got ugly around me. But it doesn't hurt for another reminder through someone else's experience)

^Simple things to do that could do incredible amounts.

I took out one of my business cards and threw it down on the guys chest…telling him to let his friends know how close they came to dying…

Priceless. Going in my book of awesome quotes.

As for my own tactical mistakes, I don't have any that I can really share since I haven't gotten into any big, life threatening street fights etc. But there is one that I always caught myself doing. Back in my high school and early college, we always had gangsters who go around taunting people and white kids who do nothing but cause trouble. (no offense, I live in a very asian area) Every time these kids approach my friends and I, I felt confident that we could take them on knowing that we had a little wrestling experience. As time passed, I realized how easy it was to acquire a gun and how stupid I was back then. If I didn't verbally defuse the situations back then and instead attempted to go for a take down and ground and pound, who knew if those kids could have been packing a knife or gun.

Speaking about weapons, I also caught myself reaching for my knife in many sticky situations when I'm with my family. (single mother, little cousin, grandma, and older brother who works many hours and is rarely with us; in other words, we are pretty vulnerable.). As time passed, I realized that if I have ever pulled that knife out, not only would I get in trouble, but in times when it was only fist to fist, I could have changed the worst case scenario from being robbed by a bunch of guys with my dignity stripped from my body to having my knife turned on me and my family. I have never had to physically engage in a fight because I was able to verbally defuse every situation; even without getting robbed. Since then I have lived by the concept of "blade as my last option". I now carry nonlethal sprays and a Comtech stinger attached to my car keys, SD pen, or flashlight. Although any of these weapons can be turned on me just as easily as my knife can be, I just pray that I would have the ability to defend myself with these without having to worry about technique (something a knife would need). I just want to defend myself and my family and get out of there.

I just wanted to stress that I also don't want to rely on such things as my source of self defense. As a part time magician, I found that a good magician should be able to apply his magic anywhere and with anything even if he doesn't have his props and gimmicks. Impromptu magic is what we call it. I wouldn't mind impromptu self defense as well.

Thanks again for sharing Doc. Get well soon and have a splendid, happy holidays. :)

-Chris

chuck_roxas45 · #11

The business card thing reminds me of an experience I had when I first started driving when I was in my teens. Our small town was then pretty lax about traffic laws(no plate on my newly rebuilt beetle), so I was driving about and almost had a fender bender with a nice new car. This important looking guy started berating me and telling me how he knew the chief of police and how he might send me to jail. Here's part if the dialogue(approximate)

Important looking guy: Do you know I can send you to jail if I want?

Me: Do you know who I am?(in a loud voice)

Important looking guy: No, I don't(in an equally loud voice)

Me: Whew! what a relief!

After which I go on my way. :D

JabFynger · #12

Thanks for sharing Doc. And I'm glad to read that you came out unscratched. I think a "tactical mistakes" thread is a great idea. We train mentally and physically for such situations but seeing and hearing specific accounts reminds us just how weird and unpredictable real-life events can play out.

I'll have to look more into that Tiger's Mouth technique seeing as Jung Fan Gung Fu is about as Kung Fu as I get training wise. It sounds effective. I may also do a few rounds of tonight's workout outside on the ice.

Again, thanks for sharing. The more we can hear about real situations the better prepared we can be.

nuubee · #13

Doc,
I'm glad you came through the situation okay, and I appreciate your honesty in listing your mistakes. I think that there are a lot of martial arts instructors would have too much ego to share that.

Jowens · #14

Luckily I've never been put in an SD situation where I had to fight off 8 guys with my bare hands and mad kung fu skills.

However, I did save $ 300 by switching to Geico today.

jackburton9807 · #15

I'm sure I have made loads of tactical errors in SD situations over the years. It seems like when I have not made errors the only ones that would recognize the potential for conflict are me and the BG. Awareness goes a real long way when someone is sizing you up for some nefarious plan.

The mistake that stands out the most for me is a home invasion in the early 90's. I had upset some folks due to my habit for voicing my opinion regarding my distaste for a particular fellow that was at my apartment. He left stating that he was going to bring some folks back to sort me out. I suggested that he bring back whomever he pleased (mistake #1, he took my macho advice).

A few hours later after everyone was gone my buddy and I were sitting at the kitchen table drinking tequila and laughing it up when we heard a sound the you could easily confuse for a hoard of people running up the stairs to my apt (mistake # 2 and 3, I should have put 2 and 2 together and assumed the noise was coming for me. I should not have continued to set a land speed record for drinking and instead maybe left for the night).

Almost immediately it became clear that the noise was 7 guys that came looking for me for reasons other than rumors of my terrific sense of humor. They started to break the front windows and kick in the door in an attempt to gain entry (Mistake 4, since I was stupid enough to still be there I should have scooped up my pistol, pry bar, bat or whatever). Next is the good part, I decided that with my years of MA, boxing and general badness I would stand toe to toe with 7 BIG guys. For the young guys out there reading this, NEVER DO THAT. They rushed me and the 1st guy to get close enough was removed from the argument with a right hammer fist to the nose. They formed a rough circle around me and proceeded to lump me up with sticks and frying pans. In the middle of this circle of fun I am bobbing and weaving and throwing whenever I feel i can connect. At one point in the middle of a bob I come eye level with a guy's waist (he was 6'5"ish), I rush him, pick him up and throw him into a wall followed by the worlds biggest uppercut to his stones. He went down in a hurry and was no longer problematic for me. At this point I'm thinking 2 down, 5 to go. Sadly it did not go much like that. They proceeded to beat me, maybe a little more cautiously, but beat me they did. This went on until they got bored I guess and they left in a similar fashion to the one in which they arrived, loudly and breaking stuff.

So, my advice is as follows;
Don't run your mouth and invite people to come beat you up, they will beat you up.
If you think trouble is coming, don't sit around and drink waiting for trouble, LEAVE.
If you find yourself in a situation where multiple attackers are intent to seriously harm you and they present themselves in a bottleneck (fatal funnel) take advanage of that and hit them over the head one by one as they clear the funnel.

At the end of it all I was pretty lumped up and mighty sore for a few days, but I'm very lucky that it did not turn out much worse for me.

Jeff

Dr. Snubnose · #16

Well Jeff seems like though you made some mistakes...the tequila was not one of them....it probably softened the blows from your attacking intruders....Doc :D

The Mastiff · #17

Doc, that came out pretty well. You have changed, learned and likely the outcome would now be completely different. I'll not go farther in that direction as some things can be left unsaid.

I'll guess that I've experienced 4-500 use of force situations in my different jobs since 1980 or so, when I started LE with a stint as an army MP.

I can pick apart and find mistakes I, and other parties have made in every one. There is no one that was perfect, and I don't expect there will ever be. I do try to debrief and learn and not repeat mistakes. I have substantially lowered the incidence and severity of mistakes but the perfect contact eludes me.

I guess the point is I'm alive and relatively intact so we'll count them as wins despite mistakes. To me, a win means surviving with my health and career intact.

I've been an instructor in several things from radar and intoxilyzers to firearms but that was always reading and following an approved lesson plan taking not only laws, but department policies into account. I've had to teach things I myself didn't believe in, nor would try in real life.

To be honest, I've been accused of advocating "butchery" and " street executions" in dealings with non LE people, yet I felt that I was giving information that complied and stayed within the boundries of the law. One reason I try to stay away from the advise giving and formal teaching outside a department where I have a set of guidelines decided by lawyers that I teach.

I know this. In my old age there's very little chance I would be attempting to fight using unarmed combat techniques any more than one person at a time. Perhaps not even one. I am getting old after all, and have the scars to show for it.

It's great living in a place that not only allows firearm carry, but self defense. No, that doesn't mean don't prepare for unarmed combat but it sure is no longer my first choice in a list of fun things to do for an afternoon.

By the way, too many attackers getting in each other way is a very real thing. Julius Ceaser's attackers attacked so wildly two of the attackers were stabbed or slashed themselves. Good use of what was available to gain advantage.

Regards, Joe

Dr. Snubnose · #18

I'll tell you a story (not mine) that was told to me by a Police Officers during a Defensive Tactics class I was giving. The story is about a Nassau County, NY Police Officer (a rookie officer at the time). The Nassau County Officer made a traffic stop of an individual riding around an affluent area in a beat up Honda Civic at 1:00 am in the morn. The driver was driving around with his high beams on. This was at a time when there was a string of incidents where gang members (forgot which gang) were driving around Miracle Mile (a name given to a popular strip of expensive retail stores in the Roslyn, Great Neck area of Long Island), with their high beams on. The deal was if someone would flash them with their own high beams to let them know that they had theirs on....they would then follow that person home and individuals from the gang would beat that person up when they existed their cars in their driveway...It was some sick initiation thingy for the gang. So my student made the stop on this Honda, just a block away from the Miracle Mile on a dim lit residential street, The Street light bulb was not working. (Mistake #1: The Officer should have waited to pulled the car over if he was aware that the street was dimly lit at that point in the road, since other lights on the block were operational and waiting 10 seconds longer to stop the vehicle would have been a better idea and a more lit area.)When he shined his flashlight into the car he saw a revolver siting on the passenger side seat. He drew his gun and ordered the driver to exit the car and place his hands on the hood of the car. He began to pat down the driver looking for more weapons. (Mistake #2: Once seeing the gun he should have drawn his gun ordered the occupant from the vehicle and placed him in handcuffs. Or waited for Back up to arrive while holding him at gunpoint)
Seems like that year Honda Civic had a lower wheelbase than other model cars making it possible for the driver to gain push off leverage, and swing an elbow back at the PO. which connected to his nose. The police officer fell backwards onto his butt, his eyes were tearing making it difficult for him to see but he still had his P226 Sig Sauer 9mm in his hand. When his eyes cleared a bit and the daze of being struck was wearing off he opened his eyes to see the drivers body was stuffed through his car's open window and all he could see was the guys legs and butt. He scramble to his feet. (Mistake #3: It was obvious to the Police Officer that the driver was reaching for his gun inside the vehicle, waiting to get back on his feet to take action was a mistake when he could have shot from the ground emptying his high capacity magazine into the guys butt and legs. But he didn't do this...can't really fault the PO to much, cause when you are flat out on your back it is only natural to want to get back onto your feet to do battle rather than being in the one down (pun intended) Position)
When he finally got up on his feet, the driver turned towards him with a his gun in hand pointing it at the officers chest. The Police Officer shot six rounds from his gun, and all except one impacted on the vehicle door, one of the 9mm rounds hit the driver in his stomach. The driver though he still had his gun pointing at the Officer did not fire, (he was kinda shocked) The officer stopped firing his semi-automatic. Mistake #4: Even though he hit the driver with one round, the driver was still pointing a loaded revolver at his chest and could have very easily emptied his own gun into the officers chest, (mind you this was at contact range, within 3 feet of one another) The threat had not ceased and the officer should have not stopped shooting his firearm till it did.
Next the turn of events gets even more bizarre. The driver opens the door of his car gets inside with his gun and drives away. He didn't get far, it was about a block of driving before he passed out from the stomach wound and smashed his car into a tree. (Mistake #5: Why did the PO let the driver get back into his car with a loaded gun and drive away, well he probably could have done something different and I'll leave that up to your imagination as to what he could have done differently but he too was in shock, he couldn't believe that he shot this guy and the guy didn't fall down. Furthermore the guy was able to get back into his car, start it up and drive away...a definite failure of the bullet (9mm round) to stop, and lots of tactical mistakes on this officers part. )
BTW The perp did survive the gunshot wound and was able to stand trial. The Police officer was very lucky for the way this situation played out, smarter and wiser now that he is aware of the mistakes he made that day and is still serving with NCPD with one lesson learned the hard way.....Doc :D

Jowens · #19

The deal was if someone would flash them with their own high beams to let them know that they had theirs on....they would then follow that person home and individuals from the gang would beat that person up when they existed their cars in their driveway...It was some sick initiation thingy for the gang.

That's sort of similar to that internet hoax that was going around a few years ago.

http://www.snopes.com/crime/gangs/pullover.asp

Dr. Snubnose · #20

Yeah that was an internet hoax back in like 2006...The incident I'm referring to happening in the late 80's early 90's. The county police were on alert for this type of gang behavior, there were no fatalities as I can recall, but people were being beaten in their driveways in this method. And there was also driveway robberies taken place...and if the take wasn't big enough, they would force the people into their homes in search of more valuables...Can't speak for Georgia or any other state, but the gang members here usually beat on their own for initiation, but this was like a test for them after initiation....and was going on for a short while....and nobody was murdered...Doc :D