For you guys that sell on eBay...

[JBE]

EBay sellers to be banned from criticizing buyers

I just came across this...not sure if it's old news or not...thought everyone would like to see. :o

[anthonyc]

spydieguys should be banned. he gave be a negative review because i told the truth in my feedback on him. i held up my end of the deal, i paid you in full right away. he sent me a damaged knife. all he had to do was the right thing. i guess greed gets the best of some people. what goes around, comes around buddy boy. off to file my complaint.

[anthonyc]

EBay sellers to be banned from criticizing buyers

I just came across this...not sure if it's old news or not...thought everyone would like to see. :o

article is dated February 5, 2008, 5:32 PM PST

[swingshot]

eBay's feedback system is little more than a marketing tool designed to make people think they're safe.

Some sellers hide behind their feedback for sure... 10 negatives in a month is 10 negatives regardless of if they have 150 positives or 1500 positives.

It's quite possible for a seller to end up with a problem buyer though.

I saw one seller get a neutral because the customer was annoyed that their Byrd was made in China.

Is the seller now to spell everything out to the uninformed customer? (by using the word uninformed, i'm being polite)


It's a flawed response to an inherently flawed system.

[The Mastiff]

Anthonyc stated:

spydieguys should be banned. he gave be a negative review because i told the truth in my feedback on him. i held up my end of the deal, i paid you in full right away. he sent me a damaged knife. all he had to do was the right thing. i guess greed gets the best of some people. what goes around, comes around buddy boy. off to file my complaint.

Anthony, this forum is not the place for this kind of post. It's very inappropriate. Perhaps you might consider removing it? Thanks, Joe

[anthonyc]

Anthonyc stated:
Anthony, this forum is not the place for this kind of post. It's very inappropriate. Perhaps you might consider removing it? Thanks, Joe

Hi Joe,
my post is in direct relation to the OP's post/article. what problem do you have with it?

[jujigatame]

Ebay's move seems the perfect case of cutting off your nose to spite your face.

[CombatGrappler]

eBay's feedback system is little more than a marketing tool designed to make people think they're safe.

Some sellers hide behind their feedback for sure... 10 negatives in a month is 10 negatives regardless of if they have 150 positives or 1500 positives.

It's quite possible for a seller to end up with a problem buyer though.

I saw one seller get a neutral because the customer was annoyed that their Byrd was made in China.

Is the seller now to spell everything out to the uninformed customer? (by using the word uninformed, i'm being polite)


It's a flawed response to an inherently flawed system.

I saw a seller with a negative feedback over an auction for a comic book. The buyer left negative feedback because they didn't like the art or the story. How is that in any way the seller's fault? That just blew my mind. :eek:

[The Mastiff]

Hi Joe,
my post is in direct relation to the OP's post/article. what problem do you have with it?

Nothing except your bringing your problem with a different system/ web business here where it has nothing to do with the forum. Wether that guy posts here is irrelevant. This is Sal's house, and he and all of us shouldn't have to deal with fallout from e-bay transactions. Sal is paying for the bandwidth here, not ebay. Show him some respect, along with Tazkristi who has a job in addition to watching over this place. That's the point I'm trying to make. It's also the reason that they don't allow transactions here, so they won't have to deal with fallout exactly like this.

Believe it or not, I don't mean any offense to you. Joe

[FLYcrash]

Yeah, I do think it is a flawed solution...but I really can't think of anything better. Feedback really should go both ways, but then buyers will need to be prepared to take the heat from unscrupulous sellers.

In my own ebaying I've tended to moderate my responses, never having left anything below a neutral, partially for this very reason. I've also been miffed by the paucity of responses in general; I've gotten less than half the feedback than I've left. In my experience if a negative response is tactful, factual, and honest, the vast majority of sellers will simply keep mum and withhold any feedback.

Oh well. In general I've been very satisfied with my transactions on eBay and half.com.

[Gollum]

I think this is good news, if you're a buyer.
I have a 100% feedback rating as both seller and buyer, in part, because the very few times I wanted to leave a well desired negative feedback, I did not. And this was after researching the offender's negative feedback, they had a history of retaliatory negatives to buyers who left them one.
I really felt it was a flawed system because of it and some people may criticize my not leaving negative feedback to help the next buyer, but you live and die with that rating and 1 negative with only a hundred or so feedbacks, your rating starts dropping like a rock. As a buyer, if I see anything less than 99.9%, I start digging.

As a side note, to get directly to a buyers feedback, try this website:

http://www.toolhaus.org/cgi-bin/negs

[araneae]

I have bought and sold on ebay and have seen both ridiculous and legitimate uses of feedback by buyers and sellers alike. Removing the sellers ability to leave neg/neut. feedback is ridiculous. There are plenty of idiots out there that expect sellers to do things that are absolutely unrealistic.

I had one guy buy an item from me after bugging me with about 5 questions regarding it. Then after winning he said sorry, I cannot pay for this. I was out the listing fee and the time I wasted on him. Would you leave him a positive?

[Agent Starling]

Nothing except your bringing your problem with a different system/ web business here where it has nothing to do with the forum. Wether that guy posts here is irrelevant. This is Sal's house, and he and all of us shouldn't have to deal with fallout from e-bay transactions. Sal is paying for the bandwidth here, not ebay. Show him some respect, along with Tazkristi who has a job in addition to watching over this place. That's the point I'm trying to make. It's also the reason that they don't allow transactions here, so they won't have to deal with fallout exactly like this.

Believe it or not, I don't mean any offense to you. Joe

I agree with what has been said here. The policy of not criticizing other knifemakers can be extended to other types of companies as well.

While it is all well and good to warn others of less than stellar business practices, there is a way to do it that is not disparaging to the company in question.

Just my $0.02

Agent Starling

[anthonyc]

Joe and Starling,

i was screwed by this guy on ebay, and then he left ME a negative feedback. the only negative feedback that i have. i did nothing wrong, and i wouldnt wish that on anyone.

thats why im glad that ebay is implementing this. these sellers are out of control and think they can do whatever they want. its not right. i work hard for my money, and dont like to be jerked around.

if the the seller on ebay is straight up, there are no issues. plain and simple. after ebay implements this, i will buy from there again.

just sharing my experience.

[JBE]

Anthony - respectfully - please leave these type of posts out of my threads and off of Spyderco's forums. If you have a problem with a seller on eBay - regardless of whose product he sells - that's an eBay issue between you and him best handled elsewhere, not on these forums. I can appreciate your frustration with a negative experience, but let's wipe off of our feet and leave the dirt at the door when we visit Sal's "House." Thanks. The intention of this thread when it was started was to inform, not to inflame.

[anthonyc]

too many chiefs, not enough indians.

[Ian UK]

I use e-bay alot as its quite hard to colect Spydie's in the UK, what I have found is if I leave negative feedback (which is only ever justified) the seller who ever it maybe retaliates and you get it too, thats why I think it was unfair as unless they had said "prompt payer" etc first you dare not leave neg feedback as you would get it and ruin your own rating!

That said I also agree with other posters here I do use the feedback score as a guide to who I buy from anything under 99% and I start digging, however I do read the neg and then make a decission weather to buy or not :confused:

I think the the new system will be interesting as they are going to add to your total all the past positive feedback from the same buyer you have had in the past providing that each one is a week apart :)

[tonydahose]

i kind of like this idea but i know there are buyers out there who will take advantage of the new format. i have 2 negative marks on my ebay and of course they are there because i left negative feedback for some yahoos who never had the knives in stock to begin with and after many contacts and finally going through ebay i get my money back and then they expect not to get the feedback they deserve. :rolleyes: we will see how this new system works. as a buyer ( i have sold a few knives, 100% good feedback on those :D ) i think if you have a few good pictures and a true description (NIB or used, etc) you should still get good feedback 99% of the time...you have to leave the 1% for the morons out there who are never satisfied.

*** on a side note i can understand how pissed off you are, AnthonyC, but i dont think this is the place to do it even though this thread is about ebay. you could have said there are some very unscrupulous (i am not saying he is or isnt) sellers that are members on this board and have their own ebay store and this should hopefully stop their crappy pratice of shafting buyers..etc. to name a person or store goes against Sal's shiny footprints and i just think it is wrong. just my opinion.

[JspyEDC]

spydieguys should be banned. he gave be a negative review because i told the truth in my feedback on him. i held up my end of the deal, i paid you in full right away. he sent me a damaged knife. all he had to do was the right thing. i guess greed gets the best of some people. what goes around, comes around buddy boy. off to file my complaint.

You failed to mention something..... You got a swift, full refund for your purchase. You also failed to mention that you were very rude and insinuated that I had bought a 'second' and sold it to you intentionally. I am unable to buy seconds from Spyderco...they don't sell them!

I only buy directly from Golden, and yes, sometimes I do not take Byrd's out of their awkward clamshell and look at it because I am accustomed to their extreme high quality. My bad.

On the thread subject...... Take a look at 99% of the NEG feedback posted by buyers on eBay... and it's usually from someone with less than 10 feedbacks. And as one poster already mentioned... I did receive a "neutral" from a buyer that was angry his Byrd Knife was made in China. LOL!!!

[The Deacon]

eBay's feedback system is little more than a marketing tool designed to make people think they're safe.

It's certainly an imperfect solution, but it is better than no feedback system at all. I can't really think of a system that would be 100% fair to both buyers and sellers and still provide some rational basis for deciding whether to pull the pin or pull the plug. I do think the more detailed feedback that has been in use for a while now is better than the older system.

Some sellers hide behind their feedback for sure... 10 negatives in a month is 10 negatives regardless of if they have 150 positives or 1500 positives.

Depends. If I'm shooting, 10 misfires out of 150 rounds fired is not the same as 10 out of 1500. On the other hand, in either feedback scenario, there's the chance all ten came as the result of a single buying spree by a single "uninformed" customer.

It's quite possible for a seller to end up with a problem buyer though.

I saw one seller get a neutral because the customer was annoyed that their Byrd was made in China.

Definitely, but the "good news" is most of those buyers make it easy to tell they're idiots if you take time to actually read the negs they leave. Then again, have seen sellers who make a major point of the fact Spyderco is located in Golden CO, but no mention of where the knife they have listed is actually made. Would I give a neutral for that, no, but could understand someone else feeling strongly enough about it to do so.

It's a flawed response to an inherently flawed system.

True, but there's no perfect answer. I don't see Amazon's, for example, being any better, as you have no way to determine if a negative was left by a customer whose absurdly unrealistic expectations were not met.

Anthony, this forum is not the place for this kind of post. It's very inappropriate. Perhaps you might consider removing it? Thanks, Joe

Joe, with all due respect, the thread is in off topic, it is about the eBay feedback system, and specifically about the way that system has been abused in the past by some seller's to retaliate for negative feedback they received, and a step (however unrealistic) the eBay is taking to address that. Anthony's post cites a specific case of such abuse by a specific eBay seller. I fail to see how it could be considered inappropriate.

I think the the new system will be interesting as they are going to add to your total all the past positive feedback from the same buyer you have had in the past providing that each one is a week apart :)

Wow, if they do the same for the feedback which buyers receive from sellers, my score might darn near triple overnight. :D