Spyderco Forums

Let me preface this by saying that I have no desire or intention whatsoever for this thread to become a Benchmade vs. Spyderco discussion. I own a number of knives from both companies, and to borrow one of Sal's phrases, "All good, just different."

I'm simply trying to gather some information regarding Benchmade's recent Vex. Upon first examining this new addition to the Red Class, three things jumped out at me. It has the round hole, it has G10 scales, and it uses 8cr14MoV steel. The round hole raises the obvious question as to whether Spyderco licensed this feature to Benchmade. The G10 (which looks somewhat Byrd-like in the photos) and the steel similar to that of the Byrd line also makes me wonder if perhaps this knife is made in one of the same factories as the Byrd class knives, rather than in Taiwan as other Red Class knives are.

I'm not sure if this belongs in Off-Topic since it is not a directly related to a Spyderco product, but I thought some members might be interested in discussing it.

I started the same thread about 2 hours ago. :)

http://spyderco.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24413

Oops. I missed yours. :o

Padawan wrote:I'm not sure if this belongs in Off-Topic since it is not a directly related to a Spyderco product, but I thought some members might be interested in discussing it.

Since this Forum say's it is to "Discuss Spyderco's products and history" while the "Off Topic" Forum says "If your topic has nothing to do with Spyderco, you can post it here" it is obvious where the discussion of Benchmade products belongs.

The "Off Topic" forum is where topics "not directly related to a Spyderco product, but I thought some members might be interested in discussing it" belong (or on the Benchmade Forum).

Since Benchmade's sales text says "In addition, we have added a rounded thumbhole to the blade for ease of opening and adding that extra eye-catching touch" without any credit to Spyderco, I doubt this round opening hole has been licenced either. However, after the Skirmish, actions like this from Benchmade shouldn't be a surprise.

Many tried to justify the Skirmish be claiming the round opening hole was a Blackwood design feature. The Vex is described only as a "Benchmade design". I wonder how the Benchmade fans will try to justify this one?

4 s ter wrote:Since Benchmade's sales text says "In addition, we have added a rounded thumbhole to the blade for ease of opening and adding that extra eye-catching touch" without any credit to Spyderco, I doubt this round opening hole has been licenced either. However, after the Skirmish, actions like this from Benchmade shouldn't be a surprise.

Many tried to justify the Skirmish be claiming the round opening hole was a Blackwood design feature. The Vex is described only as a "Benchmade design". I wonder how the Benchmade fans will try to justify this one?

That's the truth. We've already heard defenders saying that the Spyderhole shouldn't be a Trademark because it's functional, so I guess it's no surprise that BM would eventually get around to attacking the Trademark. While I reserve judgement untill it's known for sure if BM is working with the liscense, I highly doubt it to be so after thier behaviour on the Skirmish.

I would be willing to bet this is not licenced by Spyderco. It appears to be an all out attack on the trademark. It also appears that I have purcased my LAST Benchmade product. :mad:

I think it looks like a spydie rip off.

I was just starting to think about giving Benchmade another chance after the Blackwood affair. Thanks, Benchmade for shaking my head again :rolleyes: .

Speaking of the Blackwood and the Skirmish, I'm willing to bet that because Spyderco didn't do anything about it then, they're interpreting it as saying that it's fine to do it.

Sal, I don't know if you're still away, but if you read this, <u><b>JUST SUE THEM!</b></u>

To whomever asked the question "how do the BM fans handle this?"

Just read this thread for some responses..

"Please no more talk about the holes. I dont see how someone could think they own all round voids in the world related to knives. Its laughable at best."

"Unless they strached the argument a whole lot I don't htink that spyderco could ever claim to own the hole as an opening device. I have never been fond of the hole for either spyderco or BM but at the price it will be a knife to check out."

Anyone know what strached means?

In response to our very own yablanowitz's post:
"Okay, guys. I tried to leave this alone, but I couldn't sleep. Until I read a post on the Spyderco forum saying this was a licensed use, I'm gone. It looks to me like a blatant attack on another company's trademark. I thought Benchmade had more integrity than that, but that's what I get for thinking without the proper equipment."

"Benchmade Nut" goes on to say this:

"Later :rolleyes: "

Someone else chimes in:

"lol @ Benchmade nut :D They're just mad cuz BM makes the hole look good. Z"


And so on. You can read the whole thing in my link. It sounds to me like the BM fans have no real argument as to whether or not BM is actually stealing Spyderco's design, they just drop it and come up with childish comments.

Django,

I also read that post. It is however not good forum etiqute to cross forum quote.

Just my $.02 :)

Django wrote:To whomever asked the question "how do the BM fans handle this?"


And so on. You can read the whole thing in my link. It sounds to me like the BM fans have no real argument as to whether or not BM is actually stealing Spyderco's design, they just drop it and come up with childish comments.

I went over as well and became more ticked off by the cavalier attitude the BM fans displayed towards the issue. That "so what , what are you going to do about it?" mentality blows me away.
Doing the wrong thing is one issue, but the sticking the tongue out just...I can't even put into words without a pile of swearing.
There's a new way to spell thief- B E N C H M A D E
Like I said here and on other forums, I'll take back what I said if I'm wrong.

Django, it's bad Internet etiquette to cross forum post and quote like that. Just letting you know.

flipe8, let us not jump to conclusions before knowing what's really going on. Unless I'm mistaken you have no idea if they had permission or not to use the hole.

Why can't these threads continue to be civil?

David Lowry wrote:
flipe8, let us not jump to conclusions before knowing what's really going on. Unless I'm mistaken you have no idea if they had permission or not to use the hole.

Why can't these threads continue to be civil?

Point Taken David. But I have made it clear on this and two other forums that if I'm wrong, I'd apologize. I hope the two have come to some sort of agreement, for what it's worth. There are a few BMs I'd like to own, but I won't do it if BM has wronged Spyderco,...again. To me, if you purchase from BM(if they've done wrong), you're enabling them to steal from Spyderco. We speak with our money and I can't in good conscience make a purchase knowing that one company's views on right and wrong aren't more or less in line with mine.

With the custom version of the Skirmish, there's a violation of Spyderco's trademarked round opening hole and a violation of Ken Onion's design patent (not found on the production version made by Benchmade).

You can hoot and holler about how it was wrong for Benchmade to do what they did like I do or you can let Spyderco and Benchmade hash it out amongst themselves and save your energies for those parts of your world that you can control.

David Lowry wrote:...

Why can't these threads continue to be civil?

I read this line and upon giving it a moment of thought I came up with the answer.

It's because, when people lie, cheat, and steal, civility gets "thrown out the window". People get angry with someone who do such things too them, and rightously so.

Setting aside the cross forum posting, I haven't seen any lack of civility on this thread. I don't see saying that, "BM is a thief if the used the hole without liscense." as uncivil, and that's about all anyone here has done, other than point out the callous and calvalier attitude that is sadly becomming all too common in todays society.

thombrogan,

I agree. However if BM has used the hole on the Vex without permission then it affects what I can control. As in, I will stop buying BM all together.

ghostrider,

I also agree with you. I was simply reminding folks to not let this get out of hand. I just would not want this to be closed.

I really hope the companies have come to an agreement, as I like the look of that knife and would consider buying it for the price. Thing is, the advertising of it just doesn't lead me to that conclusion. You would think BM would make it very clear all was well with Spyderco if it were the case. Admitting that I'm overly sensitive, the advertising almost appears boastful or something. I can't put my finger on it, but there's just something about how they describe the Hole.

Does anyone believe that Spyderco would license their trademark round hole to Benchmade after the Blackwood Skirmish incident?