Sharpmaker 204 - Razor Edge/Back Bevel

[Louis Cohen]

I'm very happy with my Sharpmaker 204 - I've finally got the kitchen knives to a very usable edge. They go right through tomatoes and everything else, and I have the sharpest vegetable peelers on the block.



But, I couldn't get a razor edge on the kitchen knives. After steps 1-4, they slice paper fine, and are great in the kitchen, but were not sharp enough to shave hair off my arm. Now, maybe that's good, since a razor edge probably won't last as long in the kitchen, bit if I wanted a razor edge on a kitchen or pocket knife, ho would I get one with the 204?



And, does anyone use the 30°/40° back bevel for kitchen knives - does it make a difference? When you sharpen do you start with the 30° and then do the 40°, or just maintain the 40° edge?



Thanks

[Joe Talmadge]

Louis, can I direct you to the Sharpening FAQ, if you haven't seen it yet?

Thinner edges (like the 30-degree edge) outcut thicker edges (like the 40-degree edge) -- provided the thinner edge does not have problems chipping out, indenting, or rolling (although in the case of kitchen knives, of which 90% are made of soft, weak steel, we expect a lot of rolling, so just plan on steeling a lot). An edge that is at a straight 40 degrees will be outcut every time by an edge that has a 40-degree final bevel, but 30-degree thinning bevels ("backbevels" in Spyderco parlance) above it.

So, here's the procedure:

Is your 30/40 edge chipping out or indenting on you? If so, back off to a straight 40 degree edge.

If the edge isn't getting damaged at all, you might even consider going to a straight 30 degree edge without putting the 40 degree edge on top of it! The performance will astound you. I find that for kitchen use, a number of my knives can take a straight 30 degree edge no problem. However, I'm not much of a chef -- depending on your particular knives and how rough you are on them around bones and the cutting board, your mileage may vary.

So, in summary:

- Do use a 30/40 edge, provided your kitchen knives don't chip out or indent when you do so.

- Start with the 30-degree thinning bevels, lay the 40-degree edge on top of that.

- If your edge is holding up well as 30/40, consider going to a straight 30-degree edge. You can always back it off again.

- Steel frequently! Steel at the beginning of every food prep session, and any time during long sessions that cutting performance seems to decrease at all.

[Clay Kesting]

Louis,

FWIW (about AUS$0.387 <img src="smile.gif" width=15 height=15 align=middle>) I have no problems using a 30 degree bevel on my Spyderco Santoku, but then its MBS-26 steel is probably harder than many kitchen knives (57-59 Rc). BTW the Galley "V" sharpener, which is designed for kitchen knives, is set at 30 degrees only.

Clay

Don't worry that the world might end tomorrow, in Australia it's tomorrow already.

[The Stare]

Welcome to the forum, Louis.

Given your low # of posts, I don't know how much lurking you may have done here or on other knife forums. Given the potential that you are genuinely "new," a couple points.

The FAQ Joe referred to is at Blade Forums. (bladeforums.com) Joe wrote it. Though modest, Joe is considered on of the most knowledgeable experts on sharpening knives on any forum.

I recommend you give his post serious attention.

Stare

[Louis Cohen]

Thanks for the clarifications. I had already found Joe's excellent FAQ, but knowing next to nothing about knives, and being geometry-challenged, some of it wasn't quite clear the first couple of times through.

One thing I did know is steeling; I always steel the knives before each use and sometimes in the middle.

BTW, I have been using a set of Forschner Victorinox stamped knives (8" chef's, utility, boning, and serrated bread knife) for 20 years or so. They were a great bargain compared to, say, Henkels, and they have survived the Chef Choice 110 and various other stuff, and my own freehand sharpening on a stone. Not to mention my wife running them through the dishwasher.