MacLaren wrote:Im seriously considering a Shirogorov 111 CF 3D MRBS in M390. It could be considered a "high dollar knife"
Of course, theres a lot of high dollar knives out there.
Spyderco imo, are certainly high dollar knives.
I feel with most anything ya get what ya pay for.
Kinda like the Custom Folder I just got done testing, makes a Sebenza look inexpensive price wise. :D
Yup
If they think a Sebenza is expensive they would have a heart attack pricing knives like that. :D
MacLaren wrote:Im seriously considering a Shirogorov 111 CF 3D MRBS in M390. It could be considered a "high dollar knife"
Of course, theres a lot of high dollar knives out there.
Spyderco imo, are certainly high dollar knives.
I feel with most anything ya get what ya pay for.
Kinda like the Custom Folder I just got done testing, makes a Sebenza look inexpensive price wise. :D
Yup
If they think a Sebenza is expensive they would have a heart attack pricing knives like that. :D
You mighty right Jim. Ive saw some of the Shirogorovs go for 3k. I reckon some Bodegas do as well.
The one I mentioned is 1265 on the Shirogorov site, but can be had for 800 tyd. Still mighty pricey
Ankerson wrote:
Kinda like the Custom Folder I just got done testing, makes a Sebenza look inexpensive price wise. :D
Yup
If they think a Sebenza is expensive they would have a heart attack pricing knives like that. :D
You mighty right Jim. Ive saw some of the Shirogorovs go for 3k. I reckon some Bodegas do as well.
The one I mentioned is 1265 on the Shirogorov site, but can be had for 800 tyd. Still mighty pricey
The Michael Raymond custom I just ran was in the $1,200 range and that's where that model starts, goes up from there depending on options.
You guys after getting into pocket jewelry territory now. To each his own but there's definitely s limit to what if spend on a knife even if having the money weren't an issue. That amount has gone up quite a bit over the years as I've learned to appreciate the materials and manufacturing that go into a knife, and I definitely understand how a hand made custom raises that price even more but at some point the cost becomes more about adornment than performance.
Well, thats why I havent bought one yet, and probably wont. Mainly because it would require me selling off most of my Spydie collection to pay for it.
Therefore loosing even more money. But at any rate, ive still got over 800 bucks in knives as most of us probably do. However, as with Spydies one could recoup most of the money spent providing they are taken good care of.
I dont care if you spend $1,000,000.00 I don't think you will get a better built knife than a sebenza I really truly mean that. I have owned a bunch of knives way more expensive by famous knife makers MS folders-big name customs and mid tech and none I mean none have been as good as the Sebenza when it comes to build quality, tolerances,etc. You can pay more for design or exotic materials and steels but build quality no one I have owned does it better than CRK. It's the fact that everything every little detail no matter how small has been thought out and then engineered to perfection for what it is. I mean tolerance most people cant even achieve let alone reproduce over and over. Its a great company that makes in my opinion the only knife absolutely worth the money. You can feel the time and effort that went into it. I preface this next statement by saying I love my Manix2 more than a Sebenza. My $95.00 Manix2 is not as well built (tolerances,pivot size fit and finish etc) for sure no offense to Spyderco but it has awesome ergonomics I can beat it or trash it lose it and afford to buy a new one or have extras (which I do) and I can play with different steels thats why its in my pocket and not a Sebenza.
You get what you pay for up to a point and I think the Sebenza is where that point stops its worth every penny. After Sebenza hype,exclusivity,gold, jewels and madness is what your paying for.
All of that is exactly why I've struggled with wanting one for so long. The reality is, I admire that level of precision but don't love the design. It's really a difficult situation for me because both aspects mean so much to me. The quality is there, the craftsmanship is second to none (honestly I don't think most customs can match the tolerances they work with) but there are design elements that I just can't live with. If Chris would make me a custom knife with a thumb hole instead of a stud, I would be all over it. I've even considered trying to have one modified but that's a huge risk on such an expensive knife.
If the design does not appeal to you then it would be difficult to try and force oneself into buying such a knife.
I would recommend going custom at that stage. There are makers that produce exceptional hand made knives (to similar tolerances) for slightly more, but I doubt you would get exactly what you are after without going full custom.
All of that is exactly why I've struggled with wanting one for so long. The reality is, I admire that level of precision but don't love the design. It's really a difficult situation for me because both aspects mean so much to me. The quality is there, the craftsmanship is second to none (honestly I don't think most customs can match the tolerances they work with) but there are design elements that I just can't live with. If Chris would make me a custom knife with a thumb hole instead of a stud, I would be all over it. I've even considered trying to have one modified but that's a huge risk on such an expensive knife.
If the design does not appeal to you then it would be difficult to try and force oneself into buying such a knife.
I would recommend going custom at that stage. There are makers that produce exceptional hand made knives (to similar tolerances) for slightly more, but I doubt you would get exactly what you are after without going full custom.
Who are they and how much is slightly more. I have had a lot of custom knives in my search for the best folding knife and would like to know who I missed someone I should try. So far over the last several years I have had and sold Lightfoot , Demko, Southard avo, A bunch of ZT, MS Bailey Bradshaw, 3 and 3.5 Hinderer XM 18, Doc Shiffer custom, Winkler F1, DPX Hest, Several Emerson, VAn Heerden, Strider, 3 Dozier's, Todd Begg field grade Bodega, tad gear Dauntless, lambert and zermeno, and several other customs I can't come up with of hand. I have not tried a custom Fellhoelter or Terzuola yet but I will bet anyone who wants to the price of each knife that there no better than a CRK in build quality and tolerance and just cost a lot more for the name or design.
No I have not. Are they good? I have heared mixed reviews and there expensive not made in USA so they go low on the list. I'm product of 80s moves and TV. Russians are still the baddies
Diamondback wrote:Me..I'd just get a Tiachung Spyderco, and call it a day. But, hey, if you want a Sebenza get one. they certainly hold their retail value.
Oh I have several, and I'm very happy with them. In a way the Southard is already everything I want the Sebenza to be, except for having a pretty thick grind. I'm mostly envious of that hollow grind that CRK does where the steel is actually thinner behind the edge than the edge is itself. I'm not particularly fond of hollow grinds anyway, but if you're going to do a hollow grind, that's the way to get it done right IMO.
No I have not. Are they good? I have heared mixed reviews and there expensive not made in USA so they go low on the list. I'm product of 80s moves and TV. Russians are still the baddies
Elishewitz custom is another I would like to try.
I'd also suggest customs by Jens Anso and Lucas Burnley.
:spyder: -Michael
"...as I said before, 'the edge is a wondrous thing', [but] in all of it's qualities, it is still a ghost." - sal
I have CRK rule when it comes to high end customs I compare them to both the Sebenza and umnumzaan (umnumzaan tanto is my favorite CRK) if there not as smooth easy to open or well designed and put together I get rid of them. So many times I order some custom that's expensive and the hot thing or maker just to be disappointed at the level of quality either in the design or the materials or both. So I'm a little gun shy now. My new rules are I have to be able to hold it or return it with no restocking fee.
Mic1 wrote:I have CRK rule when it comes to high end customs I compare them to both the Sebenza and umnumzaan (umnumzaan tanto is my favorite CRK) if there not as smooth easy to open or well designed and put together I get rid of them. So many times I order some custom that's expensive and the hot thing or maker just to be disappointed at the level of quality either in the design or the materials or both. So I'm a little gun shy now. My new rules are I have to be able to hold it or return it with no restocking fee.
Mic1 wrote:I have CRK rule when it comes to high end customs I compare them to both the Sebenza and umnumzaan (umnumzaan tanto is my favorite CRK) if there not as smooth easy to open or well designed and put together I get rid of them. So many times I order some custom that's expensive and the hot thing or maker just to be disappointed at the level of quality either in the design or the materials or both. So I'm a little gun shy now. My new rules are I have to be able to hold it or return it with no restocking fee.
Without naming names per se, I'm curious about the quality issues you've seen on custom folders. (I.e. Are you talking about fit and finish issues?). Again, I'm just curious because I've never purchased a bonifide custom knife. I'd say the closest thing I have would be a Sebenza 21. :)
:spyder: -Michael
"...as I said before, 'the edge is a wondrous thing', [but] in all of it's qualities, it is still a ghost." - sal
Mic1 wrote:I have CRK rule when it comes to high end customs I compare them to both the Sebenza and umnumzaan (umnumzaan tanto is my favorite CRK) if there not as smooth easy to open or well designed and put together I get rid of them. So many times I order some custom that's expensive and the hot thing or maker just to be disappointed at the level of quality either in the design or the materials or both. So I'm a little gun shy now. My new rules are I have to be able to hold it or return it with no restocking fee.
Without naming names per se, I'm curious about the quality issues you've seen on custom folders. (I.e. Are you talking about fit and finish issues?). Again, I'm just curious because I've never purchased a bonifide custom knife. I'd say the closest thing I have would be a Sebenza 21. :)
All of that is exactly why I've struggled with wanting one for so long. The reality is, I admire that level of precision but don't love the design. It's really a difficult situation for me because both aspects mean so much to me. The quality is there, the craftsmanship is second to none (honestly I don't think most customs can match the tolerances they work with) but there are design elements that I just can't live with. If Chris would make me a custom knife with a thumb hole instead of a stud, I would be all over it. I've even considered trying to have one modified but that's a huge risk on such an expensive knife.
If the design does not appeal to you then it would be difficult to try and force oneself into buying such a knife.
I would recommend going custom at that stage. There are makers that produce exceptional hand made knives (to similar tolerances) for slightly more, but I doubt you would get exactly what you are after without going full custom.
Who are they and how much is slightly more. I have had a lot of custom knives in my search for the best folding knife and would like to know who I missed someone I should try. So far over the last several years I have had and sold Lightfoot , Demko, Southard avo, A bunch of ZT, MS Bailey Bradshaw, 3 and 3.5 Hinderer XM 18, Doc Shiffer custom, Winkler F1, DPX Hest, Several Emerson, VAn Heerden, Strider, 3 Dozier's, Todd Begg field grade Bodega, tad gear Dauntless, lambert and zermeno, and several other customs I can't come up with of hand. I have not tried a custom Fellhoelter or Terzuola yet but I will bet anyone who wants to the price of each knife that there no better than a CRK in build quality and tolerance and just cost a lot more for the name or design.
What was the issues you had with those knives?
Some of the makers you mentioned do a lot of work by hand (drilling all holes by hand as an example). CRK has their CNCed capability perfected for their setup (not an easy thing to do in its own right running 16 pairs of handles in a machine drilling all the holes and machining handles). I am not arguing that CRK are not great products for the money and their consistency is what really boggles the mind. But there are knife makers in the $500 range that do a lot of work by hand that do make quality products. Currently in my collection I gravitate towards that, even if there is a risk the maker had a bad day or something slipped through such a scratch mark.
Everyone's mileage varies in this hobby as well as opinions on what is a better product.
Almost all my fixed blades are made by MS J. Neilson and when we are designing them I lean towards function over aesthetics. Everything J does is handmade. I understand handmade I'm a contractor most of my work is high end remodeling and I do all the carpentry myself. In my opinion to charge premium prices your product better be the best it can be no excuses I'm not paying for your bad day or your lapse in concentration or difficiency in your tooling. To say it's handmade so it has a little blade play or lock stick or something else doesn't fly with me personally.
To give an example. I have an Elgin pocket watch that was great grandfathers passed down. 118 years old 7 Jewel not their top model from that time but a good watch buy the standard of that time. It keeps exactly perfect time with my Casio Gshock which get radio signals every night to maintain its accuracy. They both do what they are intended to perfectly.
If I install a door in your house and it sticks a bit or you have to push hard to lock it. I charge you top dollar to do it. Is that okay with you? There is another guy who can install your door perfectly and charge you the same or less but he uses a machine to drill the locks.
There is this tendency to treat knife makers like celebrities and in some ways they are to us. We tend to make allowances for mistakes and bad design because we envy them. I see them no different then the subcontractors and suppliers that I work with. Great people and companies usually but at the end of the day it comes down to the product quality and what I pay for it.
The very reason we revere and covet handmade custom things is there precision and attention to detail which are supposed to be better than machine made.
