SE H2 beats PE Rex121 at edge retention??

[Steeltoez83]

I generally steer clear of testing spyderedge versions of steels. The edge itself is interrupted which benefits real world use, but for semi controlled cut testing compounds too many variables. When I did test serrated k390 it did around 60-65% of what it's plain edge brothers could do. The stone was slightly more coarse than I normally test with, but it was silicon carbide and likely burnished the edge to some degree. I have strong beliefs on what attributes I believe serrated steels require but that's just another armchair quarterback with an opinion. I have cut tested rex 121 but not H2. I did plain edge H1 a few years back which scored only 55 if I remember right. Vg10 and 8cr served my serrated needs perfectly fine for when I needed them. S35vn or magnacut would be the only steels of interest to me for teeth. Maybe Aeb-l as well but I'm not looking at picking up anything soon. I'd need a different standardized test for serrations which would have to include other brands as well. I prefer to use teeth for rougher work so that is likely to reflect on cut test media and testing operations.

[Wartstein]

I generally steer clear of testing spyderedge versions of steels. The edge itself is interrupted which benefits real world use, but for semi controlled cut testing compounds too many variables. When I did test serrated k390 it did around 60-65% of what it's plain edge brothers could do.....
...
Vg10 and 8cr served my serrated needs perfectly fine for when I needed them. ....

Could you explain what you mean by "serrated K390 did around 60% of what PE could do"? I´d be truly interested.
Something like that the edge inside the scallops did not stay sharp as long as the plain edge?

/ And yes, in my admittedly limited experience especially VG10 is great in SE!

[sal]

Hi Red Leader,

I think that there is still much to learn about serrated edges. It's almost like a different class of edge. Sales of serrated edges, for Spyderco, are not as strong as one might think, given the success of many using them. Most just don't know enough to think positively of them. We introduced serrated folding knives in 1982 and I have been promoting them for more than 30 years, but it's still a hard sell. I have a number of serrated Utility knives (K04SBL) being used and tested in number of restaurants and processing of food, and I've been told by many that the performance is exceptional.

We've done and continue to do lot of testing, which confirms exceptional edge retention, but there are a few factors that few will consider;

1. The shape of the serration makes a difference in "the cut".
2. Not all company's serrations are the same or perform the same, so it is not wise, in my opinion, to paint all serrations with a broad brush.
3. Many of our "experts" do not agree on serrations. I've seen many demonstrations of the many ways to sharpen a serrated edge. Most in my opinion are not really effective. I think David sees it, which is why we stickied his post.
4. The "care and feeding"of serrated edges is different that plain edges.
5. Testing Steel and testing serrations are not the same.

We'll be testing serrated REX 121 in the future to see the results. Why Serrated H1/H2 serrated edges perform better is still a mystery. "The edge is a ghost".

When I was in school, many years ago, Clostridium Botulinem (caused Botulism) was considered one of the most dangerous bacteria to humans, and now it's used for Botox? We'll see what the future holds for teeth. They are certainly used quite a bit in Nature. I will continue to promote them.

sal
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"Continual improvement is our evolutionary obligation to humankind".

[Spyderwebs]

1. The shape of the serration makes a difference in "the cut".

Even within Spyderco you have the deep traditional scallops, and the 'new' Moki scallops that seem to be a happy mistake?

The Moki serrations on the recent Cruwear SE Ayoob and Temperance sprints are my all time favorite edge.

The shallow scallops cut aggressively like SE and almost as cleanly as PE. Not a hint of snagging in the cut. Really the best of both worlds and a special edge in my book.

Also, it may be more approachable to the masses as it looks almost PE and sharpens more like PE than the deep-scallop SE.

The deeper, traditional serrations on my K390 Delica don't flip my cookie to nearly the same degree. Still very aggressive, but snaggy, harder to sharpen, more ragged cut, and no more aggressive than the shallow moki SE.

I have minimal desire for more deep-profile SE blades, but high desire for more shallow Moki style SE. Hopefully more is in the queue!

[Bill1170]

Reading through this thread a thought occurred to me. It has to do with the work hardening of H1/H2 during grinding of serrations. Does everyone here remember the reason why H1/H2 knives from Spyderco only come hollow ground, and not full flat ground? The reason is that both sides are ground simultaneously in hollow grinding, but the sides are ground sequentially in FFG.

The H1/H2 knives aren’t practical to make in FFG because the first side’s grinding work-hardens the steel so much that the second side becomes very difficult to grind. This suggests rather strongly that the hardening extends to the other side of the blade, and these are plain edge blades under discussion.

All of this is to say that work hardening of H1/H2 is not a phenomenon magically limited only to grinding serrations. It is in the nature of the material itself.

[JSumm]

"Sales of serrated edges, for Spyderco, are not as strong as one might think, given the success of many using them. Most just don't know enough to think positively of them."

I can believe this. So many people I talk to kinda scoff when they see serrations. "You can't sharpen it right?" Was a response I got just on Christmas day after gifting a serrated bread knife. I suggested the Sharpmaker and to bring it to my house and we would do it together. But that is the kinda response I see very often. It it weren't for a few on the forum, David's great thread, and a good friend @cjk showing me Gernot's beloved Endela at Blade Show, I probably would not have given them a shot. Even though I carried a combo edge exclusively for years. They destroy boxes like a much thinner blade. They are deceiving. 4 fully SE Spyderco blades later, I'm still wanting more.

We just need to get Spyderco's serrations on Spyderco's steel SPY27!

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