Spyderco Forums

Doc is a 45-70 derringer really that practical? Mike thats a beautiful set up you have there. I actually prefer break top revolvers but i don't have the money for them. I'll soon be the owner of an XD 40 Or the XD 3.9 just can't seem to find one to actually hold. The local gun shop says they can't keep em on the shelf long enough

Vash, No the 45-70 derringer is not really practical, but I do have a thing for derringers. I don't carry it ever but it is a hoot to shoot. I don't carry it because it has only one barrel, the second is filled with steel to hold the recoil down...but it doesn't really help....LOL...Doc :)

Since we are now showing off our midsections I figured I post these:




First pic set up....Rock Salt, in front of a Sp101 in .357mag, Yojimbo in the pocket,with a NAA Mini mag in .22mag to keep that Yo company, Ladybug in the watch pocket and you probably can't see the Wave Endura in the back pocket that's because it's on the other side...LOL
Second Pic set up (other side of body) Yep you recognize the Ronin, followed by another Sp101 Ruger .357 mag...not seen in the pocket a Chinook II ....Forget about the Col. ...with two Janich knives on board....Mike you're my hero!!!....Doc :D

Nice Doc, remind me not to upset you... ever :-P.

As it happens, this sparks yet another question I've got which I think you might be able to help me out with. I'm in the market for a backup pistol to my S&W Mod 66. I am looking for a small frame revolver. Like you it seems, I am partial to the wheel :-D. My first instinct when I started shopping around was to look for another S&W. Problem is, I'm a bit of a thrifty shopper when it comes to handguns... and who knows how long it'll take until I happen upon a J-Frame that I want in the price range I'd like to stick with. This led me to the less pricey (but still well regarded) Ruger sp101... which I can see is a model you are pretty familiar with.

My reasoning behind a backup pistol is that the fastest reload is a second gun. By my reckoning... this goes double for revolvers. In that same vein... I've noticed that the sp101 comes in three varieties (not accounting for barrel length and grip selection... just caliber), .357 mag, .38 special, and .327 mag. I am not interested in the .38 special, and I would normally default to the .357. However, the .327 intrigues me... if for no other reason than it offers six shots instead of the standard five. I was wondering if you'd handled any chambered in the smaller magnum, and if so, whether you've noticed a drastic decrease in power, accuracy, or penetration. I have no problem sacrificing ammo capacity for take down power... I'm a good shot, I don't need to fill the air with lead. That said, if the .327 can't put the bad guys on the ground with the same (or at least close to) the consistency of .357... I don't need the extra bullet, know what I mean?

I was looking at the .327 too. The biggest turn off is ammo price and availability. The gun also weighs about the same as an SP in .357. In my mind, at least until and unless the caliber catches on and ammo becomes more widely available, I figured I might as stick with .357. Shoots tons of cheap ammo and no question about stopping power. Just my thoughts about the gun.

Ay Jordan, Lets see what I can do for you. I am familiar with the new .327 mag, have shot the gun and I can give you my honest impressions. First off the .327mag is basically a 32.20 round. Penetration is good for using the .327 for a defensive round at the expense of having to use a 3 1/16" barrel to get the velocity up in the 1,300 fps range. It is a lighter bullet than the .357, thus out of that barrel so it can move a bit faster. This is why most shooters who use a .357 choose a bullet weight of 125 grain or better...I use and I am very happy with the penetration and speed as well as it's ability on various barriers, ie, auto bodies, glass penetration, body pentration.etc.etc. of the .145 grain Winchester Silvertip which is loaded in all my .357 mag firearms. Comparing the two guns side by side and I'm talking about a 2 1/4 Sp101 i .357 the felt recoil is just about the same. Muzzle blast is a little less in the .327, and both guns because of the great rubber grips on both models absorb the recoil to make you feel like your shooting a .38 special. Of course you know the .327 has that sixth round. So basically you are talking about moving a much lighter bullet at slightly higher velocity. Hydoshok is marketing an .85 grainer moving at 1,300 fps and Gold Dot has a 115 grain moving a little faster. One thing that is very noticeable is muzzle blast from each gun.
.327 round has a blast at 120 decibels and the .357 around 124 decibels, understanding that every 3 decibels is basically a doubling of sound, the .327 wins on that account. My impressions are: Accuracy: both guns provide about the same accuracy if the shooter does his part. Trigger pull on the .327 was a bit lighter. The. 327 because of it's bigger barrel will be a little harder to carry and a little less comfy on the hip. But then again that barrel will probably be going down inside the waistband an for most might not make a difference. The .327 won't have the power advantage over of the .357 nor will it do the damage a good .357 round does when it come to SD. I can't honestly say if penetration thru various barriers will be there either for the .327. I can say it will beat a .22mag in performance and will probably fill a niche for shooters who think they are recoil sensitive, but the difference is really negligible. The extra bullet in the .327 is nice, but at what expense do you get it. The .357 is a proven street performer, why mess with success. I suggest as a back up the Sp101 in the 2 1/4" barrel for ease of carry, I also suggest the DAO model, for two reasons. They are easier to defend in court should you have to use it a SD situation, no lawyer will ever be able to say that you cocked back the hammer and had your gun on a hair trigger and accidentally shot someone. And the fact of the matter is, in a real SD situation you would only being firing double action anyway. If you want long range accuracy, then go with the regular model. I practice a lot so I can keep all my rounds on a man size target at 100 yards with either gun in.357 mag without any problems. I won't be buying any .327 mags from Ruger...Hope this helps....Doc :D

Good points all 2cha. I have similar doubts about the cartridge myself. However, I paid a visit to my local Academy after I read about it. They carry speer, federal, and american eagle (all owned by the same company if I'm not mistaken... but it indicates their faith in the cartridge that they are producing it so enthusiastically I think) in .327 for the same price or thereabouts as .357 (by the way, you must tell me where you find cheap .357 ammo :-P). That allayed my concerns about excessive cost. Further online research revealed that the round won the golden bullseye for "Ammo of the Year" last year, and Charter Arms, Taurus, and S&W are all chambering pistols with it (as well as Ruger, of course). That diminished my concerns about availability in the future. Add that to the fact that (according to Chuck Hawk) you can shoot .32 H&R Magnum and .32 S&W Long (and regular .32 of course... although I agree with Chuck in wondering why anyone would do so), and I see a pretty flexible chambering... particularly for handloaders.

All that I really need to make a final decision is to hear how the sucker shoots, so to speak. Deep down, I'm pretty conservative about guns... I like the classics. It won't take much to scare me off of the "flavor of the month" type rounds... but, it'd be a shame to miss out by discounting an effective new round as a novelty also :) Just my humble opinion on the matter.

That was extremely informative Doc, thanks very much!

Pushes me safely back on the .357 wagon as well, if I feel the intense need to try the .327 out later... I can always opt for the blackhawk and pretend I'm buying it as a new rattlesnake gun :-P.

Jordan wrote: in .327 for the same price or thereabouts as .357 (by the way, you must tell me where you find cheap .357 ammo :-P). That allayed my concerns about excessive cost. F

I should have been more clear about the ammo--at any given time, my local gun shop will have, in stock, literally dozens of different ammos that can be fired through my .357. For practicing trigger control, I use 130 gr .38 spec. ball ammo--it is all I need for the purpose and one of the cheapest center fire ammos in the store. Last time I checked, that shop had NO .327 ammo in stock at all. I checked 2 BIG online retailers one had no .327 in stock and one had only serious SD rounds for around $2 a round--I can't practice at that price.

One of the things that attracts me to the gun is that it can be used with .32 ammo to teach physically weaker or gun shy people to shoot, can step up to a more serious round once the shooter is capable, but can also pack a serious wallop if needed for other purposes. I was really looking at it in contrast to a convertible single six .22LR/.22 Mag. Haven't really decided yet, but I'm leaning toward the .22 because my sons could shoot all day for the price of a good lunch.

****... I was hoping you had found a secret retailer selling bulk .357 on the cheap... alas, no such luck.

I also do a lot of my practicing with whatever .38 special or .357 happens to be the cheapest I can get my hands on, and I definitely see your point... everyone makes both of those cartridges, so the prices stay down. Even better, because I prefer my revolver to my autos, I don't have to worry about steel jacket not feeding with the gun I shoot the most, I can buy the REALLY cheap stuff :-P.

I would say there is a lot of merit to your thoughts on convertibles for teaching purposes... the very first handgun I got to really shoot was a ruger blackhawk convertible with a 9mm and a 357 cylinder. Graduating from being able to handle the 9mm and .38, to the .357 was a huge deal for me as a kid. The first handgun that I ever really "owned" (birthday present from the folks when I was 12 or 13 I think) was a Ruger Mk II... probably because my Dad had the same thoughts as you, put lead downrange for hours at a few pennies per round. A single-six sort of wraps those two concepts together rather nicely, I'd say.

Ruger 77 MkII V/T .25/'06 w/B&L 6-24 scope
Marlin .22 rimfire
S&W 686 stainless .357 6" bbl
Ruger .22/45

Dr. Snubnose wrote:Since we are now showing off our midsections I figured I post these:

Doc :D

"Showing off my midsection" wasn't really the point, but at least now I think I get your approach to fitness. Carry your own body weight in weapons and stay thin?

Stay safe,

Mike

I see all these wheelguns and I almost forget how much I hated cleaning mine before I got rid of it. I had a hard chromed Model 19 and loved to look at it and dry fire it but cleaning the cylinder was a major pain.

2cha wrote:What do you think of the Browning's? I'm in market for .22 auto--have a son who's 12) and wanted to get a Ruger MK, but I don't like all the crap on MKIII--loaded chamber indicator, mag safety--more moving parts = less lifespan + more maintenance. I've eyeballed the Buckmarks, but I've never fired one. Obviously, you like 'em. Will you share why?

I haven't owned a Ruger .22 so I have no direct comparison. But I've owned the Browning Buckmark Bullseye for almost 15 years now. I've shot a ton of ammo through it and it's been reliable with many thousands of rounds between cleaning. The only types of failures I've seen are ammo related with crappy bulk ammo.

Every couple years, I do a detailed inspection of all springs and parts and the only things I had to replace is rubber buffer that cushions the slide, the firing pin, and the extractor. The barrel mounting screw gets beat up after so many cleaning sessions but that's just cosmetic. The rest of the gun is amazingly durable.

I got the 2nd one a few years back to have a shorter barrel gun and to have a spare if the other one breaks but they're both going strong. I highly recommend it. The newer models have very nice ergonomic grips too.

I have a few,a few more I don't have pics of.

One or more each long gun: 12ga, 16ga, 20ga, 410, 30.06, 30-30, 223. One or more each handgun: 22 auto, 22 revolver, 9mm, 45cal, 25cal. Also a number of relatives long guns as we reside on 100 acres of productive whitetail, pheasant and turkey land.

The really good news is the number of Spydies in my collection has surpassed the number of firearms!

DONT MESS WITH SPYDERCO CARRIERS ! lol

RIOT wrote:DONT MESS WITH SPYDERCO CARRIERS ! lol

Hahaha, No **** to That!!
The great body of submissions here have been fabulous.

And J Smith -- thanks. Stunningly impressive pieces in point.
Those images are nothing short of Magnificant. / SB

That's the beauty.
You never know...................

Michael Janich wrote:"Showing off my midsection" wasn't really the point, but at least now I think I get your approach to fitness. Carry your own body weight in weapons and stay thin?

Stay safe,

Mike

Ahhhh Mike you got my secret! I'm even thingkng about Trademarks "Spydercise" and for additional weight loss try "Jenny "Carry" Craig".....Doc :p :D