Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:02 pm
Would you be so kind and explain ?
Would you be so kind and explain ?
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Paramilitary or Manix
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Would you be so kind and explain ?
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:21 pm
The comp lock is one of my least favorite locks for several reasons. I often wear gloves, and I have trouble manipulating the lock with gloves on. It's not ambidextrous, and I've found myself in occasional situations where I needed to open a knife with the off hand. It has no close bias, and I have (once only) found a comp lock coming open in my pocket (from interaction with other things in the same pocket, so that's really my fault). I strongly prefer the CBBL and the back lock to the comp lock, and in general I even prefer the liner lock because it's easier to use with gloves (although it shares the other features I dislike about the comp lock).
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 2:04 pm
I hear you. I also like the CBBL more than the comp lock but I like the rest the PM2 package more. Blade and handle both. I like the Manix2 quite a lot but I wish they redesign it and squeeze more cutting edge into a more neutral handle.TomAiello wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:21 pmThe comp lock is one of my least favorite locks for several reasons. I often wear gloves, and I have trouble manipulating the lock with gloves on. It's not ambidextrous, and I've found myself in occasional situations where I needed to open a knife with the off hand. It has no close bias, and I have (once only) found a comp lock coming open in my pocket (from interaction with other things in the same pocket, so that's really my fault). I strongly prefer the CBBL and the back lock to the comp lock, and in general I even prefer the liner lock because it's easier to use with gloves (although it shares the other features I dislike about the comp lock).
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 4:55 pm
That’s quite fair. If I was using a knife with gloves all day it would the Manix2 no question. Mind you the comp lock is easy to use with thin gloves, but the Manix beats it here.TomAiello wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 1:21 pmThe comp lock is one of my least favorite locks for several reasons. I often wear gloves, and I have trouble manipulating the lock with gloves on. It's not ambidextrous, and I've found myself in occasional situations where I needed to open a knife with the off hand. It has no close bias, and I have (once only) found a comp lock coming open in my pocket (from interaction with other things in the same pocket, so that's really my fault). I strongly prefer the CBBL and the back lock to the comp lock, and in general I even prefer the liner lock because it's easier to use with gloves (although it shares the other features I dislike about the comp lock).
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 5:07 pm
I'd love to see a CBBL Spyderco in the size of the Chaparral (or Native?), but it's my understanding that the engineering challenges of getting that lock into a knife that size are fairly large.
I spend quite a bit of time outdoors in winter, which means that reasonably bulky gloves are a standard feature of my life for several months every year.
I spend quite a bit of time outdoors in winter, which means that reasonably bulky gloves are a standard feature of my life for several months every year.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 6:48 pm
wouldn't bulky gloves make it difficult to use a chaparral? i would think a manix would be better for that kind of use.TomAiello wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 5:07 pmI'd love to see a CBBL Spyderco in the size of the Chaparral (or Native?), but it's my understanding that the engineering challenges of getting that lock into a knife that size are fairly large.
I spend quite a bit of time outdoors in winter, which means that reasonably bulky gloves are a standard feature of my life for several months every year.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 6:53 pm
i'm not sure you can have a cbbl without a choil though, so you have to give up a bit of edge to make room for the lock.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:13 pm
A choil is not required for a caged ball bearing lock. For example, the P’kal uses a CBBL but does not have a choil.
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Between the two knives in question, I like them both but I tend to prefer carrying the PM2. I like the way it fits in my pocket more and having more options of PM2 to choose from helps in that regard too.
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Between the two knives in question, I like them both but I tend to prefer carrying the PM2. I like the way it fits in my pocket more and having more options of PM2 to choose from helps in that regard too.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:15 pm
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 8:37 pm
Took the words right out of my mouth.
I've owned the Para 3, PM2, Shaman, Yojimbo, and have also handled various other compression lock knives, but every time they move on, it's because of the compression lock -- no matter how much I tune them, no matter how much I try to adjust to it, I just can't get the thing to close without the blade bouncing up at least half the time, which means I have to either close it with my thumb/index finger, or flick it open to try again.
Additionally, I don't like interfacing with such a small surface area in order to manipulate the lock; I don't like liner locks for the same reason.
I just feel that the CBBL lock is more intuitive to how I use a knife -- the lock is already right where I have my hands, whereas the compression lock requires a pinching gesture.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 8:58 pm
As a backpacker, one thing I keep an eye on is weight. The Manix LW can be had for a pretty amazing (considering its tall handle and blade) 2.9 oz! Even when not backpacking, the LW models feel smaller in the pocket (even though it's the same physical size as the linered G-10 Manix). Of course, if you like a heavy knife, this is of no concern.
I keep ratio scores (used to call them efficiency scores but that got so many complaints because it sounded judgmental, so... now they're just ratio scores). As far as blade:closed or edge:closed sizes, the two knives are virtually equals. As far as blade:weight and edge:weight scores, obviously the LW Manix has more efficient ratios, meaning more edge or blade for weight. But it's hardly a fair comparison, when comparing an FRCP knife to a G-10 knife.
I keep ratio scores (used to call them efficiency scores but that got so many complaints because it sounded judgmental, so... now they're just ratio scores). As far as blade:closed or edge:closed sizes, the two knives are virtually equals. As far as blade:weight and edge:weight scores, obviously the LW Manix has more efficient ratios, meaning more edge or blade for weight. But it's hardly a fair comparison, when comparing an FRCP knife to a G-10 knife.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 9:14 pm
As a lefty, you may want to consider the Manix 2 with the CBBL.akapennypincher wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 6:00 pmWell that is not possible as I have noTREE, just Cactus.
I am Southpaw, but both work for Lefty Carry.
TREE, just Cactus.But, if you can manipulate the Compression lock then get what is best for you.
I have both, I like them equally well for different reasons. The blades on both are very different but they are both awesome none the less. I got a Manix 2 Light LW for about $100 and that is hard to beat. So if funds are slim, there is your answer.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 9:17 pm
mongo1958 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 9:14 pmAs a lefty, you may want to consider the Manix 2 with the CBBL.akapennypincher wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 6:00 pmWell that is not possible as I have no
I am Southpaw, but both work for Lefty Carry.
But, if you can manipulate the Compression lock then get what is best for you.
I have both, I like them equally well for different reasons. The blades on both are very different but they are both awesome none the less. I got a Manix 2 Light LW for about $100 and the ergos are great, that is hard to beat. So if funds are slim, there is your answer.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:04 pm
spydergoat wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 7:52 amIf this is for everyday carry the PM2 is lighter and not as wide so it's easier to carry, while having a longer edge.
The carry-thing is rather subjective, I guess.
I fully get and respect that the a bit narrower than the Manix PM2 at their widest points is a better carry for you!
For me though the Manix carries better:
I don't mind that a bit more width (it is teally not much) in pocket at all, but appreciate that the Manix in return is a shorter carry and has a narrower, nicely rounded handle end that creates kind of a ramp for sliding the hand by the knife (I think Ladybug 93 said and described that fearure first and very well)
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:12 pm
mongo1958 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 9:14 pmAs a lefty, you may want to consider the Manix 2 with the CBBL.akapennypincher wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 6:00 pmWell that is not possible as I have no
I am Southpaw, but both work for Lefty Carry.
But, if you can manipulate the Compression lock then get what is best for you.
.....
While I think that it is a pro of the CBBL to be completely ambidextrous, I honestly still don't find a comp.lock hard to manipulate with the left hand... and I say that as a RIGHTHY.
One way is just pushing the tab with the thumb and then for example guiding the blade to close with the index finger.
Like one can do also with the right hand and actually a bit "backlock-ish" in operation.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Mon Feb 20, 2023 11:28 pm
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 4:32 am
I really don’t like the CBBL lock and prefer the comp lock. PM2 for me . Funny how everyone has different preferences. I guess that’s why Spyderco makes so many choices.
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:14 am
It kind of is, isn't it? Concerning locks, ergos, blade shapes...
But actually a good thing, makes the (knife-)world a more colorful and more exciting place to discover!
And yes, Spydercos variety definitely helps with this a lot too!!
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:39 am
Well, the Sage 3 is pretty much Native sized, right? And the Bolt Action Lock not really too different from the CBBL, generally and regarding the space it takes up in the handle? (Never had a Sage 3 in hand though, so I can´t tell with certainty)
Re: Paramilitary or Manix
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2023 5:53 am
Bolster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 8:58 pmAs a backpacker, one thing I keep an eye on is weight. The Manix LW can be had for a pretty amazing (considering its tall handle and blade) 2.9 oz! Even when not backpacking, the LW models feel smaller in the pocket (even though it's the same physical size as the linered G-10 Manix). Of course, if you like a heavy knife, this is of no concern.
I keep ratio scores (used to call them efficiency scores but that got so many complaints because it sounded judgmental, so... now they're just ratio scores). As far as blade:closed or edge:closed sizes, the two knives are virtually equals. As far as blade:weight and edge:weight scores, obviously the LW Manix has more efficient ratios, meaning more edge or blade for weight. But it's hardly a fair comparison, when comparing an FRCP knife to a G-10 knife.
Well, the imo inevitable PM2 LW could beat the Manix 2 LW in blade/edge to weight ratio (though not by much), if the weight drop from the linered G10 PM2 to a potential linerless FRN PM2 will be the same percentage wise as it is from the G10 Para 3 to the Para 3 lightweight:
Para 3 G10: 3.4 oz; Para 3 LW 2.5 oz, so a weight drop of 26 %
PM2 G10: 3.8 oz, "PM2 LW" would be 2.8 oz,if also 26% lighter than the G10 version
2.8 oz is a tad lighter than a Manix 2 LW, and the PM2 platform still offers a bit more edge/blade
Just a little thought experiment of course.