Spyderco Forums

Besides the ones from Spydieguys a couple more showed up on eBay tonight... What were they selling for in the first place anyway?

Hoshyoto(Jeff), you got it right my friend.

That way, Spyderco doesn't get stuck with a bunch of knives that don't sell and everyone that wants one, can get one, or two or whatever.

Picked mine up at the SFO today and got to meet Mrs. Sal, Gail. She is a great person and I learned that a mutual friend of ours, Al Mar, played a signficant part in helping Spyderco get its start.

The Forum Knife is beautiful and well made, as usual. It is so pretty I am almost afraid to use it. I hope they make a full flat ground S30V knife a part of their regular lineup. Thanks to Sal, Kristi and all else involved in getting this knife made for us fortunate forum members.

b

hoshyoto wrote:Unfortunately there really is no way to keep a small limited number available for just the forum members if someone really wanted to "game" the system. Even if you limit the orders to just one apiece for the first day, there is nothing to stop someone that wanted to sell them on ebay from setting up 20 or so accounts prior to them going on sale. Believe me, it's similar to when I used to work at a TicketMaster outlet. I saw scalpers getting their hands on hundreds of hot tickets even when there would be a 4 ticket limit. I think the best suggestion I've seen for a future item like this would be to not set a hard limit on the number produced, but produce an initial amount, then take orders for a certain amount of time, say a week or two, then produce the ordered amount.

I would like to thank Spyderco for making the effort to produce something special. Even if it didn't work out quite as they had hoped, it still resulted in something far better for its customers than what most other companies would ever think of doing.

Thanks,

Jeff

I Agree!

I missed out on the sale and really wanted to have one in my Spyderco collection. Was disappointed but I guess that's the way the ball rolls. Earlier today I just happened to check the newest eBay auctions for Spyderco and saw a the Forum Native for a $68 BIN price. I guess some luck came back my way. The seller is a Spyderco forum member and was glad to see it go to another forum member. I know he could have sold it for twice as much but he was nice enough to put it up for what it would cost to buy from Spyderco. Hats off to this Spyderco fellow.

BTW, I noticed the etching on the blade actually goes down to the grind and to the very edge of the blade. If you do sharpen the knife, it etching would disappear. Not that it's a bad thing but this is one way you can tell if the knife was sharpened or not.

Things like this should happen more often! Glad you scored one.

Since trading is prohibited here, maybe next time a forum member decides to sell of them, he should put it on the knifebst site and give us a hint here :)

That way, it is more likely that a forum member will get it, and he/she even avoids ebay dues

Dennis

Murdoc wrote: Since trading is prohibited here, maybe next time a forum member decides to sell of them, he should put it on the knifebst site and give us a hint here :)

That way, it is more likely that a forum member will get it, and he/she even avoids ebay dues

Dennis

Dennis,
Agree with you.
This is good idea. Or BF. BTW, yesterday I saw one Forum Native there at fairly reasonable price.
Hopefully, I will get mine today.

hoshyoto wrote:...I think the best suggestion I've seen for a future item like this would be to not set a hard limit on the number produced, but produce an initial amount, then take orders for a certain amount of time, say a week or two, then produce the ordered amount.

I don't think it is that simple. You have fixed and variable costs in production. Your variable costs will stay the same per knife, but (part) of the fixed costs apply repeatedly to every single batch. Setup time and preparing raw materials for a run is often a substantial part of the costs. Doing 6 runs of 50 native purple handles will have a different cost then 1 x 300. For example, the machine that makes the FRN handles will need to be cleaned to make regular batches of black FRN to fullfill Wallmart orders in between. Setting up the flat grinder to do a small batch of Native blades will interfere with production of other regular flat blades, like the (para) military. Quality controlling a small batch, engraving them, packing them in boxes, printing labels all is done less efficient with 50 then with 300.

So what's suggested can be done, but for a price. The smaller the batch size, the higher the price. And my guess is that it will be a substantial higher price because material costs are only a small part of all the costs in the production of a knife.

Ted wrote:I don't think it is that simple. You have fixed and variable costs in production. Your variable costs will stay the same per knife, but (part) of the fixed costs apply repeatedly to every single batch. Setup time and preparing raw materials for a run is often a substantial part of the costs. Doing 6 runs of 50 native purple handles will have a different cost then 1 x 300. For example, the machine that makes the FRN handles will need to be cleaned to make regular batches of black FRN to fullfill Wallmart orders in between. Setting up the flat grinder to do a small batch of Native blades will interfere with production of other regular flat blades, like the (para) military. Quality controlling a small batch, engraving them, packing them in boxes, printing labels all is done less efficient with 50 then with 300.

So what's suggested can be done, but for a price. The smaller the batch size, the higher the price. And my guess is that it will be a substantial higher price because material costs are only a small part of all the costs in the production of a knife.

That certainly is possible. I have no idea how Spyderco has its manufacturing facility set up. However, I work in a manufacturing facility that makes high-end consumer pots and pans that, depending on the line, retail from $30 to $200 each. Ten years ago our average run was around 2000 pans before we would change to make a different pan. Today a run of 500 pans is more the average and an order of 100 is not unheard of. This isn't because business is slow. On the contrary, we have set record numbers each of the past three years for parts produced and sold.

Like I said, I don't know what the procedures are at Spyderco, and it really is none of my business, but it is just as possible that small order sizes are a minimal hassle as it is that they are a major pain.

Jeff

Ok. I've been holding my breath since i saw on the UPS website that the package was miss routed. After a slight detour by UPS. It has finally arrived and it is worth the $74 I paid for the Forum Native. I like the documentation in the box about it being a Sprint run of 300 too.

Of all the 2009 Forum Knives made my guess is Spyderco made little to no profit.

300 model sprints for $65.97 (and free shipping in some cases) is just under $20,000 of gross sales. Considering R&D, materials, QC, and the opportunity cost of not making other models in-house with bigger profit margins it was not a lucrative venture. Like they said, it was a "gesture of saying thanks".

This all is just my guess. I could be way off.

Blerv wrote:Of all the 2009 Forum Knives made my guess is Spyderco made little to no profit.

300 model sprints for $65.97 (and free shipping in some cases) is just under $20,000 of gross sales. Considering R&D, materials, QC, and the opportunity cost of not making other models in-house with bigger profit margins it was not a lucrative venture. Like they said, it was a "gesture of saying thanks".

This all is just my guess. I could be way off. Still kinda makes you wonder about some capitalistic seekers.

This is the same knife that was selling at WalMart for just under $40. Profit margin was probably pretty slim at that price but volume was probably a lot more than 300. "Street price" for Natives is in the mid $50 range now. Certainly there was the extra cost of engraving though every knife goes into the laser engraver anyhow so it was some work to set up the engraver and a little extra time per knife. Handling a small run and administering the sale was probably the biggest additional expense but running it through the normal websales route probably helped a lot, compared with previous Forum models.

When USN knives ran out, another batch was quickly produced in Japan. The harm to those who bought to collect would be minimal. It would only really hurt those who hoarded these knives for profit. I don't mind Spyderco making money off of me. I don't mind someone buying 10 knives hoping to make a few bucks. The risk of Spyderco producing another run to these entrepreneurs is their risk.

I thank Sal and crew for producing forum knives at all! It is nice of them to feed our egos and desires and we return the favor with loyalty, patronage and as ambassadors. Please produce another run! :o

spyderknut wrote: When USN knives ran out, another batch was quickly produced in Japan.

That is not true. See Tazkristi's post on USN on 7/7/2009

tazkristi wrote: The first batch of the USN Enduras will be available and live on our site on Friday, 17-Jul. We are receiving these in 2 batches of 300. So, if you don't get yours out of the first batch, please don't worry, there are more coming just a few weeks behind.

Ted, I apologize. I was misinformed and was wrong. :o

Mine arrived in NZ today, It's great.

Thank you Spyderco crew

Handling a small run and administering the sale was probably the biggest additional expense ...

Not to mention the biggest headache! I called them to talk to W&R on the day of the sale. The lady who answered the phone said she was just there manning the phones, but she normally worked somewhere else. Sounds like an "All hands on deck" situation, I'm sure.

When I called W&R again the next day, they were just as busy. All those knives to invoice, package and ship!

I bet "hectic" is most likely an understatement for those two days!

Mine arrived today...very nice...new problem...my wife wants it... :eek: :D

I have an xtra Purple Native & ZDP Delica for trade / Not for sale on Knife BST

(would not feel right selling the Purple one on the Bay)


http://www.knife-bst.com/bst/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1600

JNewell wrote:Mine arrived today...very nice...new problem...my wife wants it... :eek: :D

Ha! You too huh? My wife carries and uses a pink D4 and when I showed her the purple Native, she immediately snatched it out of my hands and started flicking it open and going on and on about how much better she liked it compared to her D4. :D Hopefully, Spyderco WILL do another run so I can get her one, but if not, I may have to get her a pink Native and have Mr. Krein perform a FFG job to it.

WOAH :eek:

Let me give some of you guys a piece of advise.

Spyderco best darn prodo company in the world bar none. We ask and if it's even remotely feasible they deliver. My lifetime prodo company for many many reasons, and that will always be the case.



A knife is a knife is a knife ( Hopefully that makes sense guys ) :p :)

Knives are just knives, but because of this forum I have gotten to know some fantastic people all across the world. Even though I may never meet them I consider many here good friends. Enjoy the community and cherish the friendships and eventually every knife you have ever wanted will come to you in time. In this forum it's not just about knives it's about a whole lot more. :)

aj