No holed Spyderco

[Significent]

Sal, please don’t get me wrong. I like the hole in the folders. And, I’ve tried to like the holes in the fixed blades; but, I just can’t make myself. :) In my mind, the characteristic that makes a Spyderco knife uniquely Spyderco is its quality and style, not a hole or a picture or a signature. Those that borrow the look in a cheap knock-off won’t ever get my business. I understand that the masses aren’t necessarily so discerning; so a solid trademark is necessary. You gotta do what you gotta do.

Anyway, hole or no hole, as long as Spyderco keeps making great production knives and continues to experiment with new steels and designs, I for one will keep buying them.

[sal]

Thank you.

[Slash]

I want to make a folding knife with a hole. Whose butt do I need to kiss? :)

I own some fixed blades with one or even two holes near the handle. The difference is those were put there to be functional for wrapping paracord within them. Spyderco clearly puts a hole as a trademark. Only problem with that is it's not very appealing on certain designs.

Can't we just fire the lawyers and all get along...

[DRKBC]

If you want to be negative about the hole, be negative to all of those companies that have forced us to be 100% consistent about the use of our round hole in all models.

All of those companies that choose to use a hole simply to "borrow" our "look" for their wallet

sal

I think it is really amazing what you have built. I own my own company and constantly deal with competitors that try to grow off of the back or our success. But you have proven that if you stay true to your principals and stay focused on what you do rather than what everyone else is doing or trying to do to you, that in the end it will work out. Your company inspires me.

[Razors84]

Out kitchen knives are a particular challenge because we recognize the food retention issue. We're carefully focusing on making it as easy as possibe to clean the hole. It is our hope that our customers do recognize the years of effort in our trademark and will think of that while they clean the hole. kind of like appreciating your fingernails when you trim and clean them.

sal

I should have known that y'all would be thinking about that issue on the kitchen knives. I am looking forward to these!

[SQSAR]

I also understand the need for and history behind the trademark. In the folders, the hole contributes to both form and function. But, I also wish the fixed blade knives didn't have it. IMHO, in addition to collecting debris, it takes away from the knives' "lines" that you work hard to get right. That being said, I have my first Spydie FB on pre-order: The Southfork. I definitely like the prototype without the hole better; but, I can't afford to buy one from Phil. In this case, I guess less is more. It's too bad you couldn't have an alternate trademark just for fixed blades, a spyder stamp for instance. :spyder: You could put a ring inside the body of the spyder that looks like a hole. That could make a stamp workable and would certainly make the blade uniquely Spyderco. See attached.

You know what would be beyond cool is to have the Spyderco Logo etched around the hole similar to what the illustration is showing.

[Rockcrawler]

I want to make a folding knife with a hole.

I have wondered about this before, and have seen a fair number of custom built folders by makers big and small that have "the hole". What are the thoughts on such knifes and there use of the hole? Would this be considered infringing on the trademark?

I ask this from only a perspective of curiosity.

[Slash]

I have wondered about this before, and have seen a fair number of custom built folders by makers big and small that have "the hole". What are the thoughts on such knifes and there use of the hole? Would this be considered infringing on the trademark?

I ask this from only a perspective of curiosity.

Mr. Glesser seems like a kool guy to me. If you ask him nicely, I'm sure he wouldn't mind...nor sue.

In fact I think most informed makers that use a hole ask sal prior to using it, purely out of respect for him.

[Bill1170]

On the plus side the trademarked hole in the fixed blades is just right for a forward lanyard. Spyderco has to defend their trademark, so let's find ways to "make lemonade" rather than complaining about the hole. How about a contest here on this site to come up with new practical uses for the legally necessary hole?

For the kitchen knives the hole could be used in a very clever way that I'll save for later.

[The Deacon]

I have wondered about this before, and have seen a fair number of custom built folders by makers big and small that have "the hole". What are the thoughts on such knifes and there use of the hole? Would this be considered infringing on the trademark?

I ask this from only a perspective of curiosity.

There are a few makers who use the Spyderhole illegally, but a most custom makers who use it are ethical and have obtained a license from Spyderco to use it.

[sal]

I think it is really amazing what you have built. I own my own company and constantly deal with competitors that try to grow off of the back or our success. But you have proven that if you stay true to your principals and stay focused on what you do rather than what everyone else is doing or trying to do to you, that in the end it will work out. Your company inspires me.

Hi DRKBC,

We try to be a model company. You just keep doing the right things for the right reasons in your business. You might not be making as much profit as the thieves, but you will be able to hold your head high in all conditions. You will also help to inspire others in business.

sal

[sal]

On the plus side the trademarked hole in the fixed blades is just right for a forward lanyard. Spyderco has to defend their trademark, so let's find ways to "make lemonade" rather than complaining about the hole. How about a contest here on this site to come up with new practical uses for the legally necessary hole?

For the kitchen knives the hole could be used in a very clever way that I'll save for later.

HiBill,

We were also the first to use a "forward lanyard" on a fixed blade.

On the kitchen knives, we're working on those designs now. Looking forward to your suggestions.

sal

[gaj999]

Does the hole have to be non functional? Someone suggested a finger hole. I could see this working on a chef's knife. The bottom of the hole could also function as a finger rest. This might be a trick on a paring knife.

Gordon

[DRKBC]

Hi DRKBC,

We try to be a model company. You just keep doing the right things for the right reasons in your business. You might not be making as much profit as the thieves, but you will be able to hold your head high in all conditions. You will also help to inspire others in business.

sal

Thank you Sal it's a great way to approach life and business.

[Significent]

I never heard of a forward lanyard until just now. Googling, I found a demonstration that makes it look pretty good. I’ll have to try it with my Southfork when it comes. ( not for chopping of course :) )

As for the kitchen knives, how about designing a vertical plaque with horizontal pegs to hang the knives, point down, from “the hole”? The blades could be recessed a bit to protect the edges. The handles could be completely above the plaque. The pegs could have an up-turned crook at the end to keep the knives from sliding off. To remove a knife, you would pull it forward, rotate it 90 degrees one way or the other and then turn the surface of the blade up while lifting the knife away.

Or, you could design a knife block with all of “the holes” lined up perfectly with matching holes drilled through the block. Then with a simple locking bar or two, you could lock all of the knives into the block so that children or knife abusers couldn’t hurt themselves or the knives.

[sal]

From the "Legal" point of view on trademarks is that it cannot be only functional or they cannot be trademarks. Those were the arguments presented.

I felt that in order to follow the law, we had to have the Round Hole (shape) as a trademark in ways that were specifically non funtional. Even the forward lanyard argument, though weak, could be argued. I'm really not looking for reasons to find function for the round hole or we defeat the purpose of the round hole as a trademark. That's why we began adding the round hole to all of our models, even if there was no function, even particularly because there was no function.

Think of automobile grills. While they are functional, the shapes of the grill are trademarked. The cross on the Dodge, the diagonal line on the Volvo, etc.

Our identifiable trademark is a round hole in a certain part of the blade so that it "looks" a certain way. Most would describe it as a somewhat organic look with the round hole apearing as an "eye".

Hope that helps.

sal

[Bill1170]

HiBill,

We were also the first to use a "forward lanyard" on a fixed blade.

On the kitchen knives, we're working on those designs now. Looking forward to your suggestions.

sal

Thank you, Sal. I have been unwell and intend to share my idea with you, but not on this open forum. I can make you a functional mockup once I'm back in the workshop.

Bill

[JLS]

I have a number of older Spyderco fixed blades without the hole and a good number of newer ones with the hole. It doesn't bother me at all and as mentioned, gives a place for a forward lanyard. I strongly prefer a forward lanyard as opposed to the butt lanyard for the motion (or lack therof) of the knife when you let go. A butt lanyard allows the knife to fall and an uncontrolled edge in motion is not a good thing. With a forward lanyard, the knife moves much less when released.

I've had a number of people ask me why there is a hole there on my fixed blades. I explain that Spyderco puts a hole in all of their blades due to trademark/patent infringement and then tell them about forward lanyards. I like emphasizing that there is nearly always a functional reason for why Spyderco make something look different. Functional art is the best kind to me.