Is "hard use" the new "tactical"?

[unit]

Hard use is the new tactical in the sense that it is a market trend. Not to say that there were not people using knives in a tactical or hard use manner before or after the trend runs its course...but there are MANY more that jump in because it is a trend they enjoy. Not good or bad, but very real.

Tactical has a pretty broad definition, but it now being applied to just about any knife that can be opened one handed (if it is a folder) and even remotely looks like it is designed for self defense (or offense). If this is correct, then you can see how it can be applied to almost every knife these days.

Hard use by contrast has a slightly narrower definition. Generally it includes tactical , but goes beyond to include hard uses such as percussive cutting techniques and perhaps prying.

Lets not start a fight with this one. Hard use is a trend, and a real "definition".

Like tactical, hard use is not necessarily something that everyone identifies with or wants to be associated with, but some do. Lets respect those people that do get into hard use...they spend a lot of money on knives and that helps our industry!

Feel the love brothers!

[The Deacon]

I think that the "hard use" issue is just magnified beyond what it is. A lot of threads have come up questioning the intelligence and even sanity of people who want tough, heavily built knives for their own reasons. I am one of those people who want over-engineered folders notwithstanding the trade offs.

I see the same type sentiments expressed whenever anyone asks for **** near anything. Small knife people can't understand why folks want large ones. Large knife people can't figure why someone would opt for a small one. Those content with slipjoints can't see the need for locks. "Knife is a tool" people can't understand the concept of "highly functional jewelry". The list is as long as the list of knife features and combinations thereof.

Question is more, should an existing model, which serves the needs and wants of 95% or more of those who have purchased it be re-tasked into something perhaps less suited to their needs in order to satisfy the few. Or, should that 5% be asking for something totally new and designed for them. And, if they don't account for a sufficient market to allow that, pointed in the direction of an existing something that suits their needs better.

[JNewell]

Yes.

1. It is an amorphous term of almost unlimited lexical plasticity.

2. It fuels enough meaningless and inconclusive internet traffic that it probably represents a measurable diversion of human time and natural energy resources.

[LorenzoL]

I think hard-use makes more sense than "tactical" because at least it means something. What is a tactical knife? Nobody really knows because there are so many ways you could interpret the term. Also, we now see dress tactical customs, tactical slipjoints and so on, it is almost ridiculous.
Now who said that a hard use knife has to be a poor cutter?
I think there is a misguided belief that a good cutter has to have a very thin blade. Well, I recently re-profiled a CTS-XHP XM-18 and it is one of my sharpest knives. I think extra thin blades belong in the kitchen, the last thing one needs to worry about an EDC is the blade snapping. I would not buy a folder with a blade less than 3mm/.125" and I honestly prefer 4mm/.150" or more (the original Manix is a good example).
It is not because most hard-use knives ship pretty dull from the factory/maker that they are inherently poor cutters.

And hard-use does not refer just to the blade but also to the pivot size, lock strength and the ability to perform in adverse conditions (mud, sand...).

[Reeper22]

I am one of those people who want over-engineered folders notwithstanding the trade offs.

I have jumped my post count in two forums just trying to explain what I, and others who believe as I do, want with these folders. We have been attacked for our choices. We have also been misunderstood as hating uber thin slicing tools.

Hey Chuck, personally I have no problem at all with a robust, over-built knife. I think they're great for their intended purpose. And I understand people have needs require such a knife, like you, or that's just their bag. I'm not really on either side of the fence, pure cutter vs. tank. I don't think I've ever once commented on any of those threads. I'm a buy what you like/need type guy. My problem isn't with robust folders whatsoever. My problem is with:
-The endless threads that are 12 pages long that are filled with people's bickering over the use of the term.
-People who make ad-hominem attacks on people during the discussion on one of these related threads.
-The fact that people can't agree to disagree on such asinine things.
-People who can't understand what the intended uses of a knife are by its design.

I know you are far removed from any of these categories. I was just pretty outspoken earlier in this thread and did a bit of venting. I didn't want you to feel ganged up on or that I was lumping in people like you.

[Ankerson]

A Hard Use folder is a reasonable fixed blade replacement for those times when a fixed blade can't be carried for various reasons.

Shown here various smaller fixed blades with hard use folders.

[Blue72]

I have no problem people wanting or discussing "hard use knives"

What I do find disappointing is that that they outweigh the discussions on thin razor sharp knives, Which I think should be the main focus when discussing sharp things like knives.

I think many are missing the satisfaction of super sharp knife like a caly 3 when pursing other knife aspects like "hard use". In all reality how much more abuse can a Manix handle over a caly.

[LorenzoL]

Well, everyone is entitled to their opinion. I consider the Caly useless given its size, handle shape and construction (no washers). I understand that if you are going to cut paper or open boxes you will see it differently.

Where is it written that only "thin, razor sharp knives" are worth discussing?

[Ankerson]

I have no problem people wanting or discussing "hard use knives"

What I do find disappointing is that that they outweigh the discussions on thin razor sharp knives, Which I think should be the main focus when discussing sharp things like knives.

I think many are missing the satisfaction of super sharp knife like a caly 3 when pursing other knife aspects like "hard use". In all reality how much more abuse can a Manix handle over a caly.

I don't think anyone is saying that there isn't any use for thin bladed slicers.

All knives have their uses and place.

I carry either a thin bladed slicer like my Endura or a hard use knife like my SmF depending on what my needs might be that given day, or a fixed blade if I can given my situation.

It's good to have choices and not be limited to just one type of knife.

[Buffalohump]

Personally I think the whole 'hard-use folder' thing is like someone buying a family sedan and wanting it to handle off-road conditions as well.

A pocket folder is good for convenience and light tasks. A fixed blade is good for tougher jobs where integral strength is required.

Your environment and requirements should determine which one you carry. ****, you can even carry both if you really want to - I know I do!

[Sequimite]

I think a lot of guys "want" to have the "need" :D

It's in our DNA for guys to yearn for adventure. It may seem a little silly for me to equip myself with survival tools I may not "really" need in the same way that a sports car is unnecessary in our 60MPH USA. In both cases I think that if you can afford it there is no harm in a little fun. Of course we can't admit that we still want to play now that we're serious adults.

And some day that 9.2 earthquake that has been long predicted in our area will strike; more than enough justification to have some fun preparing in the meanwhile.

[Ankerson]

Personally I think the whole 'hard-use folder' thing is like someone buying a family sedan and wanting it to handle off-road conditions as well.

A pocket folder is good for convenience and light tasks. A fixed blade is good for tougher jobs where integral strength is required.

Your environment and requirements should determine which one you carry. ****, you can even carry both if you really want to - I know I do!

Mark,

Not everyone can carry a fixed blade as an EDC for a lot of different reasons, most of them legal reasons.

It's really not like it used to be back in the 70's and 80's when one could carry a fixed blade more often and in more places.

In today's society carrying a fixed blade will get people into trouble more times than not depending on were they live, even if it's technically legal to do so.

The fixed blade argument has no real baring in today's society for the majority of people.


Jim

[Buffalohump]

Hey Jim,

OK we dont have that kind of issue in my neck of the woods. When I say a fixed blade I'm really talking about a small fixed blade around 7-8 inches OAL. I carry one in my manbag and its really there in case I am confronted with a situation where I feel it may be pushing it to use a folder. I have no idea why a fixed blade with a 3 inch blade would pose more of a threat than a folder with the same blade length, you'll have to explain the lawmakers thinking on that one to me.

Mark,

Not everyone can carry a fixed blade as an EDC for a lot of different reasons, most of them legal reasons.

It's really not like it used to be back in the 70's and 80's when one could carry a fixed blade more often and in more places.

In today's society carrying a fixed blade will get people into trouble more times than not depending on were they live, even if it's technically legal to do so.

The fixed blade argument has no real baring in today's society for the majority of people.


Jim

[LorenzoL]

I have to agree with Jim on this, many folders can easily replace a fixed blade without all the PITA of needing a sheath etc.

[Fred Sanford]

I have no need for "hard use". If I need a "hard use" knife I grab a small prybar, hammer, axe, or pliers. About as hard use as I get is a ESEE Izula.

I like my knives to cut, and most (not all) hard use knives are not hard use at all, they are just thick. I'm not a fan of thick knives. A thick knife is about as useful as a very thin screwdriver to me.

I personally know some soldiers that carried an Emerson, or a Delica. However most that I have spoken with carry a small knife (Think Victorinox) and a multitool. They don't carry "hard use" knives.

[Ankerson]

Hey Jim,

OK we dont have that kind of issue in my neck of the woods. When I say a fixed blade I'm really talking about a small fixed blade around 7-8 inches OAL. I carry one in my manbag and its really there in case I am confronted with a situation where I feel it may be pushing it to use a folder. I have no idea why a fixed blade with a 3 inch blade would pose more of a threat than a folder with the same blade length, you'll have to explain the lawmakers thinking on that one to me.

That's the way the laws are, it's politics...

I have no need for "hard use". If I need a "hard use" knife I grab a small prybar, hammer, axe, or pliers. About as hard use as I get is a ESEE Izula.

I like my knives to cut, and most (not all) hard use knives are not hard use at all, they are just thick. I'm not a fan of thick knives. A thick knife is about as useful as a very thin screwdriver to me.

I personally know some soldiers that carried an Emerson, or a Delica. However most that I have spoken with carry a small knife (Think Victorinox) and a multitool. They don't carry "hard use" knives.

When I was in the USMC almost nobody carried any folder into the field and I mean less than 1%. But then that was back in the early to mid 80's.

Now out in town etc yeah that's different, I carried a slip joint, but it stayed in the locker when I went into the field or on deployment.

[Buffalohump]

These are two fixed blades I carry. Both are around 8 inches long in the sheath.

[bh49]

The General makes some good points...I too want a knife that cuts...isn't that what knives are for....If I want tough I use a Tomahawk or Hatchet, or Fixed blade...folders don't need to be tough..they need to cut...Doc :D

+1 on what Doc and General said

I just want my knives to be pretty, ergonomic, and sharp.

+1

basically this is it.

[LowTEC]

I consider the Caly useless given its size, handle shape and construction (no washers).

:eek: :)

[Hannibal Lecter]

My Dear Friends,

I too have seen the trend among manufacturers to produce heavier, more robust knife designs, and in many cases in doing so they manage to negate the positive characteristics of handling, weight and balance that made the original version of the knife so desirable to begin with.

Of course I encourage the development of stronger, more reliable locking systems and any additional innovations that might accompany them, but let's not get too hung up on this one singular aspect of knife design. There is a place in my collection for the SAK slipjoint and the Chinook, the Delica and the P'Kal, the overbuilt fixed blade and the lightweight folder.

Remember, my friends, that bigger and stronger is not always better...just bigger and stronger. :D

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Hannibal