Advantages of MBS-26 steel?

[bchan]

Spyderco use MBS-26 in their kitchen knives. I have always wondered why didn't they use VG-10, which is also pretty corrosion resistant and used in many of their other models (and so presumably can bring on the economies of scale). Are there any other advantages of MBS-26 that I am not aware of? Thanks.

[The Deacon]

Except that the company making the MBS-26 Kitchen Sharps for Spyderco does not make any other knives for Spyderco and uses MBS-26 in many of their own branded knives. Why that's the case, I'm not sure, but it does mean the "economy of scale" argument would favor it. I do know MBS-26 dates back to before VG-10 was introduced, so it could just be "that's the way we've always done it". I'm fairly certain MBS-26 was created as a specialty steel for kitchen knives, while VG-10 was created as a specialty steel for horticultural (budding and grafting) knives. It may also be that VG-10 is available, or not as readily available rolled as thin as some of the kitchen sharps. Or, given that flexibility is an important quality in kitchen knives, it may be that MSB-26 of any given thickness is more flexible than VG-10 of the same thickness.

Also, Spyderco did offer a couple VG-10 kitchen knives, the Yin and Yang, which were made for them by a different Japanese maker a few years back.

[DerRock]

Spyderco use MBS-26 in their kitchen knives

Not only kitchen knives. Was still C17 Catcherman MBS-26.

[bearfacedkiller]

I believe it is affordable and I believe the maker is especially good at their heat treatment of it. Otherwise I believe it is a fairly ordinary steel by today's standards.

[Chris_H]

Sal also previously mentioned that the manufacturer has a refined HT protocol for MBS-26 that brings out exceptional performance in the steel.

[JD Spydo]

Not only kitchen knives. Was still C17 Catcherman MBS-26.

Yeah I've got a Catcherman in MBS-26 and it's all right>> however it's my least liked of all the Catcherman models I have. I actually now like the H-1, nuclear Green handled version the best for a lot of reasons. And I still like the older AUS-8 Catcherman models better than I do the MBS-26 versions. AUS-8 seems to take a more toothy edge and is somewhat easier to sharpen for me.

Now the H-1 Catcherman is truly the "Cat's Meow" of all of them. My only complaint is that they did not make a full Spyderedged version like they did with the older AUS-8 version. I still have my full Spyderedged AUS-8 and I use it at least 3 to 4 times a week in food prep.

I also have the original K-04 & K-05 models from the 2004-2005 era and they have held up extremely well. I don't have any trouble keeping them sharp. However I am a bit disappointed that it isn't as corrosion resistant as the H-1 is.

I've heard that they are bringing back the K-04 & K-05 models also in MBS-26. I hope someone will confirm that.

[The Deacon]

Yeah I've got a Catcherman in MBS-26 and it's all right>> however it's my least liked of all the Catcherman models I have. I actually now like the H-1, nuclear Green handled version the best for a lot of reasons. And I still like the older AUS-8 Catcherman models better than I do the MBS-26 versions. AUS-8 seems to take a more toothy edge and is somewhat easier to sharpen for me.

Now the H-1 Catcherman is truly the "Cat's Meow" of all of them. My only complaint is that they did not make a full Spyderedged version like they did with the older AUS-8 version. I still have my full Spyderedged AUS-8 and I use it at least 3 to 4 times a week in food prep.

I also have the original K-04 & K-05 models from the 2004-2005 era and they have held up extremely well. I don't have any trouble keeping them sharp. However I am a bit disappointed that it isn't as corrosion resistant as the H-1 is.

I've heard that they are bringing back the K-04 & K-05 models also in MBS-26. I hope someone will confirm that.

JD, the K04 is already back in production, in both PE and SE. And yes, they are MBS-26. Hopefully, they will sell well enough for Spyderco to put the K05 and a few of the other Kitchen Sharps back in production as well.

[Blerv]

Sal just mentioned the K05 is on the way, by Christmas iirc.

As for MBS I recall Cliff Stamp loving it. Hopefully he interjects some good info :) . Whatever the atomic structure IMO when processed by that maker the kitchen knives are insanely good .

[phillipsted]

I have used the little K09 paring knife for years as a carving knife in my woodshop. That little blade is a real trooper - the MBS blade takes a great refined edge and the thin stock really makes it a fantastic slicer. I tend to strop or microbevel it before each use just because it doesn't keep that acute edge for as long as some other steels. But it is perfect for its intended purposes...

TedP

[Cliff Stamp]

MBS-26 is in the same class as 19C27 from Sandvik. Sandvik considers it a coarse steel, suitable for when you don't need fine edge performance but are looking for edge holding in cutting abrasive materials such as ropes or cardboard. However you have to consider that their points of reference is razor blades (AEB-L).

In general, comparing it to steels like 440C, ATS-34, VG-10 and similar then MBS-26 has :

-increased toughness, so it responds better to a smooth steel
-higher grindability, easier to work on simpler stones
-better apex stability, higher performance at low angles/high polish
-has a lower cost, direct and indirect

[bchan]

Thank you all for the quick and informative responses. I will be looking out to buy a K05 to try out the MBS-26 steel (the serrated version), and I am interested in the forthcoming K05 as well.

[sal]

Thanx Cliff.

We have a good relationship with the maker now and will be remaking the old models and then creating the new ("2") versions from MBS-26. I think one of the "reasons" for their performance is they heat treat in lead.

sal

[NoFair]

Any chance of a MBS-26 Catcherman run Sal? Unlike JD I prefer it over the other versions

[sal]

Any chance of a MBS-26 Catcherman run Sal? Unlike JD I prefer it over the other versions

Hi Sverre,

I agree with you that the MBS version was the best for fish. I guess anything is possible.

sal

[Chris_H]

Thanx Cliff.

We have a good relationship with the maker now and will be remaking the old models and then creating the new ("2") versions from MBS-26. I think one of the "reasons" for their performance is they heat treat in lead.

sal

Very interesting! Reminds me of Thiers Issard's manufacturing for their straight razors.

[JD Spydo]

MBS-26 is in the same class as 19C27 from Sandvik. Sandvik considers it a coarse steel, suitable for when you don't need fine edge performance but are looking for edge holding in cutting abrasive materials such as ropes or cardboard. However you have to consider that their points of reference is razor blades (AEB-L).

In general, comparing it to steels like 440C, ATS-34, VG-10 and similar then MBS-26 has :

-increased toughness, so it responds better to a smooth steel
-higher grindability, easier to work on simpler stones
-better apex stability, higher performance at low angles/high polish
-has a lower cost, direct and indirect

That's extremely interesting Cliff>> I've used a lot of kitchen Spyderco blades over the years including one of my Catcherman models that also has MBS-26 and for some reason I haven't had that great of luck with the steel myself compared to many of the other blade steels that Spyderco uses. Hey but I'm not arguing with you per se because I'm now actually wondering if I'm just not sharpening the stuff right. You mentioned that it has a higher performance at low angles?? So maybe I should sharpen all my MBS-26 blades at a very low angle on a benchstone rather than using the Sharpmaker at 30 or 40 degrees let's say?

As far as VG-10 goes I've had great luck with it at just about any angle I sharpen it at. Now I do like the Spyderco kitchen blades and their overall performance with MBS-26 but most of mine are Spyderedged which tend to hold an edge better most of the time anyway. But my plain edged MBS-26 blades just don't seem to hold an edge like VG-10 or a number of others I could mention. Hey I'm all ears and I hope to learn what I'm doing wrong>> and I bet I'm not the only one with that dilema.

[NoFair]

Hi Sverre,

I agree with you that the MBS version was the best for fish. I guess anything is possible.

sal

Thanks Sal, I bring my MBS Catcherman as a kitchen knife when travelling and it does very well for most uses. It is a great filet knife when fishing where the thin flexible blade is perfect. Bit afraid of losing mine so a spare would be welcome :D

[The Deacon]

We have a good relationship with the maker now and will be remaking the old models and then creating the new ("2") versions from MBS-26.

sal

Great news, Sal! Looking forward to them. :)

[JD Spydo]

OK with H-1 being the proven winner in the Spyderedged cutlery I'm not wondering how MBS-26 stacks up against it. Especially being most of Spdyerco's MBS-26 blades are Spyderedged.

Now on plain edges I did have some decent experience at one point. I used to own one of Spyderco's older Santuko chef's knives from the 2005 era which had an MBS-26 blade steel. It had a relatively thin blade (thinner than most) but I was able to keep it pretty sharp even after using it a lot in the kitchen during food prep. I still didn't like it as much as I do VG-10 but it was all right.

Now in all fairness the older K-04 and K-05 kitchen blades used a wavy type serration pattern versus a spiky pattern like you see on many of the main line models from Japan particularly. So I'm now wondering if that is a true comparison being the patterns are significantly different? I'm trying to compare "apples to apples" so that it's a fair test.

So I'm wondering has there been any side by side tests done of the 2 blade steels in comparison and especially during hard actual use?

[Cliff Stamp]

So maybe I should sharpen all my MBS-26 blades at a very low angle on a benchstone rather than using the Sharpmaker at 30 or 40 degrees let's say?

What you have :
[INDENT]In general, comparing it to steels like 440C, ATS-34, VG-10 and similar then MBS-26 has :

-increased toughness, so it responds better to a smooth steel
-higher grindability, easier to work on simpler stones
-better apex stability, higher performance at low angles/high polish
-has a lower cost, direct and indirect

[/INDENT]


In order to see these it means you have to be doing some of the following :

-be using a smooth steel
-simpler stones
-high polish and low angles
-aiming for and keeping a high sharpness

If you are not doing these things then a higher carbide steel is more optimal.

Steels are no different than any other material in regards to fit for use. They all have specific properties and will be very good at things for which those properties are important and very poor at things where the opposite properties are needed.