Photo comparison: Strider SMF & Spyderco Tuff

[kwakster]

Just for the heck of it: a photo comparison between the Strider SMF & the Spyderco Tuff, complete with measurements taken with a digital caliper.



Specs Strider SMF:

Length open: 22,7 cm / 8.9"
Length closed: 13,2 cm / 5.2"
Blade length: 9,8 cm / 3.85"
Actual edge length: 8,0 cm / 3.15"
Blade thickness: 4,79 mm / 0.189"
Steel: CPM-S30V stainless steel
Hardness: +/- 60 HRC
Handle material: Titanium & G-10 scale with integral backspacer
Locktype: titanium framelock without insert (titanium on hardened steel)
Stabilizer: Yes, a Hinderer lockbar stabilizer/over extender safety
Lockbar thickness: 4,0 mm 0.157"
Length of the lockbar from lockface to cut-out: 6,0 cm / 2.36"
Thickness of the titanium lockbar at the cut-out: 0,99 mm / 0.039"
Weight: 177 grams / 6.24 oz


Specs Spyderco Tuff:

Length open: 22,5 cm / 8.86"
Length closed: 13,0 cm / 5.12"
Blade length: 9,5 cm / 3.74
Actual edge length: 7,9 cm / 3.11"
Blade thickness: 3,99 mm / 0.157"
Steel: CPM-3V non-stainless tool steel
Hardness: +/- 60 HRC
Handle material: Titanium & G-10 scale on steel liner
Locktype: titanium framelock with hardened steel insert ( hardened steel on hardened steel)
Stabilizer: Yes, the hardened steel lockbar insert doubles as a stabilizer/over extender safety
Lockbar thickness: 3,45 mm 0.136"
Length of the lockbar from lockface to cut-out: 3,4 cm / 1.34"
Thickness of the titanium lockbar at the cut-out: 1,35 mm / 0.053"
Weight: 178 grams / 6.28 oz

[DeathBySnooSnoo]

Interesting how they are so close in specs...

[Brock O Lee]

Whats the price-difference?

[ASmitty]

I just did a quick price comparision on one particular site and the SMFs they had in stock were around $475 while the Spyderco Tuff was priced at $260. And on top of that, the Tuff looks a lot more user friendly in terms of handle ergos IMO.

Keep in mind, that is only one retailer's prices.

[Blerv]

It's also important to keep into consideration the steel differences. CPM-S30v for many users is easier to maintain being far more corrosion resistant (solely based on what I read).

[kwakster]

CPM-3V is easier to sharpen than CPM-S30V, i sharpen both on a regular basis and the difference is noticeable.
And beadblasted S30V also has a tendency to corrode, about the same as 3V in my use.

[jossta]

The SMF also comes in 3v (also $475, if you can find one), although somewhat rare FWIW. It also comes in S35vn and CPM154. Price is pretty accurate at around $250 for the Tuff and $475 for the Strider. Strider monitors AD pricing, so if it's being sold new for under $475 from a dealer, they're either not authorized or they're soon to be getting a slap on the wrist.

Used, I've seen them as low as $300 and Tuffs as low as $180. Either way, about double the price.

Based on the measurements, it would seem like lock strength would go to the Tuff, but I'm not sure about the pivot. Also not sure about the One-piece G10 vs. the SS liner under G10. I have seen a few broken Striders and it's never been the G10, lock or pivot though. Always the blade. Never seen a 3v one broken, so hard to say what would give first.

[Blerv]

CPM-3V is easier to sharpen than CPM-S30V, i sharpen both on a regular basis and the difference is noticeable.
And when beadblasted S30V also has a tendency to corrode, about the same as 3V in my use.

Thanks for your personal experiences :) . Yea like I said just assuming as such. I know some people can rust S30v if they work at it...but they can usually rust anything. Lol.

[kwakster]

Based on the measurements, it would seem like lock strength would go to the Tuff, but I'm not sure about the pivot. Also not sure about the One-piece G10 vs. the SS liner under G10. I have seen a few broken Striders and it's never been the G10, lock or pivot though. Always the blade. Never seen a 3v one broken, so hard to say what would give first.

Right on the money i would say: the blade itself could be a (possible) weak point, and on a normal Spyderco or Strider when it would break it would start at the sharpening choil and go up through the hole.
Now look at what that genius of an Ed Schemmp did on the Tuff: he purposely strengthened the area directly around the opening hole (more meat), while at the same time redirecting a possible breakline away from it by letting the grind start way in front of the hole and angled away from it.
The only disadvantage of this is that you end up with a little less edge length, but you do get a finger choil in return.
What i mean is that even if the Strider had a blade made from 3V steel it would still be intrinsically weaker than the blade on the Tuff.

That's one thing, but there is more;

Now i haven't opened up the Tuff (yet) but upon visual inspection the pivots look to be more or less comparable in size (partly based on the size of the washers), but i agree i would have to open her up and measure things to be sure.
Something i do see from the outside is that there is much more "meat" in the handle area around that pivot, in particular at the spot just above the cut-out at the lockface, but also in general.
This of course strengthens the construction as a whole.

The framelock itself is a no-contest win over the Strider imo, most importantly the combination of the shorter & stiffer lockbar with the thicker cut-out.
Add to that the hardened steel insert (steel on steel: less wear than titanium on steel) which doubles as a lockbar overextender safety, and which also does it's job in a seemingly better spot than the Hinderer lockbar stabilizer on the SMF: closer to the top of the lockbar.

I know i'm more or less preaching for the choir here, but even non-Spyderco afi's would have to admit that the Tuff could very well be a serious contender for the title "toughest usable folder currently out there", especially if you take the rather large price difference into account, as they are both still production folders, not customs.
(Do i hear "Strider-Killer" or would that be considered a breach of the shiny footprints principle ? ;-) )

Anyway, this is just my 2 cents,

[The Mastiff]

Excellent thread Kwakster. Thanks.

Length of the lockbar from lockface to cut-out: 3,4 cm
Thickness of the titanium lockbar at the cut-out: 1,35 mm

This is a significant difference and should be stronger. I'm not sure if it would flex more or less though. ? :confused:

I do believe I paid more than $475 for mine though. :p

Joe

[Alchemy1]

Wow, I did not realize that the Tuff was that big! I think the Strider looks more uncomfortable, but is comfortable in hand. Especially the larger SMF. The handle is long enough that you aren't holding a shorter handle that is jabbing into your hand.

The other thing to take into consideration is warranty. Spyderco has always taken care of me and has the same type of warranty as 75%-85% of knife companies. However, you could literally call/email Strider and say you broke the blade in half prying two 2x4's apart and they probably laugh and tell you to send it in with a $15 check for return shipping. The warranty is intact for the lifetime of the blade/company too. Doesn't matter if the blade gets sold 1000 times, you don't have a receipt, and the blade is 20 years old, your covered.

Not a knock on either company, just putting the full picture out there. And yes I have done warranty claims with both companies and both companies took care of me like a champ!

Spyderco took a para back that was 3-4 months and used. The scale was broken, I'm not sure if I did it or not. I just noticed it one day when I pulled it out to use it. Sent it into Spyderco with a $5 check and they replaced the scale/shipped it back COMPLETELY free of charge. They even sent me email updates.

I sent a Strider SnG in that had developed lock rock. I paid more to ship it in because they don't like USPS. They patched it up and got it back to me quickly for the cost of $15 in return shipping. I did not receive any updates along the way. A box just showed up on my doorstep one day.

[buferoe]

hey kwakster,

Nice thread, must say the I can't wait to get the Tuff in my collection.
Maybe when I got it I will make some Xray pictures to see ïnside".

greetz,

Werner

[Sht]

Again thanks for the comparison shots. Really makes me want to try out the tuff, for some reason I thought it was smaller than it is. @ Asmitty if you have yet to get your hands on a smf, try it out it one of the best handles out there.

[BAL]

Thanks for the pics. Maybe it's just me, but a knife doesn't interest me
unles it had a spyderhole. I have a ton of old knives (pre-spyderco)
and they drive me crazy to open. I have tried to use a few as beaters,
and I cuss every time I open one.

[Pockets]

At that weight and price, what's the appeal of those over a fixed blade?

[gull wing]

Very nice pictures, thank you.

[Pockets]

Yes, the pics are nice. Forgot to mention that :eek:

[razorsharp]

At that weight and price, what's the appeal of those over a fixed blade?

Gadget factor, fun to play with, easier to carry, can be carried where fb's cant :D

[defenestrate]

No offense intended to Strider, as many folks love their knives and if i handled one I might agree - but I concur about the Spyderhole - it just works. Only other shape I have had good luck with is the burd hole as it feels similar in use.

[JNewell]

Agreed...but the Spyderhole on my Tuff is something else entirely. I actually got a bleeding cut from the edge of the hole. I know Sal has said that sharp edges are a sign of careful machine work, but the liners on this thing are sharper than some decent knives I've bought. :spyder: