Buy Sprints, then Flip Them at a Profit?

[chuck_roxas45]

[darkstar29]

now this is funny :) I find this whole thread amusing actually....the talk of taking advantage of the "less fortunate", the immorality of selling a sprint to make a few bucks, the taking of a knife out of a potential users hands, etc etc etc. ..... that's all I'll say. "Amusing" pretty much sums it up :)

If only a 'few bucks' were the asking point. As opposed to doubling-or tripling-an investment.. Especially when the only one to set the market price is the seller.
Is it okay to make a profit? Absolutely.
But gouging the **** outta people? That practice shines a light on a persons soul.. Shows who they really are. It's a deep thing.. And I'm not even talking religiously.
I don't begrudge a man for making a profit.. within reasonable bounds.
Just because someone out there is willing to pay twice or thrice the original price doesn't make it right. Morally speaking.
A decent person is a decent person. And decent people do decent things.. And that's all I have to say on the matter.

[Slash]

There's this saying that I tell my friends when it comes to gambling and putting your money on the line.
"Scared money...don't make no money."

If it wasn't for flippers how would the guy that really wants the knife get one after they're all gone?

This is nothng new. People have been buying and selling knives for centuries.

[chuck_roxas45]

There's this saying that I tell my friends when it comes to gambling and putting your money on the line.
"Scared money, don't make no money."

If it wasn't for flippers how would the guy that really wants the knife get one after they're all gone?

This is nothng new. People have been buying and selling knives for centuries.

They wudda been able to get one if the flippers didn't take 'em all.

[jtoler_9]

Is it okay to make a profit? Absolutely.
But gouging the **** outta people? That practice shines a light on a persons soul.. Shows who they really are. It's a deep thing.. And I'm not even talking religiously.
I don't begrudge a man for making a profit..

So would you suggest what profit margin is acceptable on a Sprint so a flipper can save his or her soul? While we are at it, let's make sure people sell their homes and cars for only what they paid for them also. Or at least regulate private seller profit margin across the board. So as to be fair.

[darkstar29]

There's this saying that I tell my friends when it comes to gambling and putting your money on the line.
"Scared money, don't make no money."

If it wasn't for flippers how would the guy that really wants the knife get one after they're all gone?

Absolutely agree, Slash. And there are good people that flip. I've bought many knives from decent flippers.
The 'type' of flipper is my issue. The "Buy it now at $400" type. On a $120 knife?.. Of a recent, still in production knife?
That just Oozes slime. I don't care if it is a sprint.
Will someone buy it? Probably.. But why would anyone? It's deceitful. And it's the hidden deceit that bothers me.
I'm not religious, but I do believe in peoples' ability to be moral.

[darkstar29]

So would you suggest what profit margin is acceptable on a Sprint so a flipper can save his or her soul? While we are at it, let's make sure people sell their homes and cars for only what they paid for them also. Or at least regulate private seller profit margin across the board. So as to be fair.

I guess whatever feels right to the seller.
Homes and cars are a different beast. You can do things to them to increase resale value.
What are you going to do to knife that came out two days ago to increase it's value 200%-300%?

[jtoler_9]

What are you going to do to knife that came out two days ago to increase it's value 200%-300%?

I think I may have misunderstood. I was thinking specifically about the orange para 2 going for around 200.00 on the forums. Asuming people bought them for aprox. $150.00 thats about a 18-20% profit depending on how it's shipped. Much ado about nothing. Sorry for my confusion.

[darkstar29]

@jtoler_9. No worries, man. :)
I was talking in generalities. Broad strokes and such. Much of which is lost in translation via the interwebs.

[Fat Goat Forge]

I think I may have misunderstood. I was thinking specifically about the orange para 2 going for around 200.00 on the forums. Asuming people bought them for aprox. $150.00 thats about a 18-20% profit depending on how it's shipped. Much ado about nothing. Sorry for my confusion.

That to me seems like a fair deal. Note that although they are sold out long ago Cutlery Shoppe lists the retail price for the orange sprint as $194.95 now. http://www.cutleryshoppe.com 1st item on page upper left.

[JNewell]

And, by the way, about what you would have paid for the knife if it had been available from SFO.

Oh, wait, Spyderco must be an evil scalper, since they sell sprints and other knives way above street price! :eek: That is true, by the way...they only sell at MSRP.

I think I may have misunderstood. I was thinking specifically about the orange para 2 going for around 200.00 on the forums. Asuming people bought them for aprox. $150.00 thats about a 18-20% profit depending on how it's shipped. Much ado about nothing. Sorry for my confusion.

[Blerv]

It's all opinion because placing morality is nearly impossible. While some things go against innate human rights this is not one of them. As mentioned, since most Spyderco products (even inflated) don't surpass MSRP it's hard to call foul.

Once you determine why it's wrong you can proceed to chastise/punish those who participate. IMHO going for the morality card because you don't share the belief more or less says, "I can't tell you why but it just is."

The only sprints that are tough to get (at any reasonable price) are the ultra hyped ones such as the Military, Para2, and Manix2. All of which have awesome standard ones at a fraction of the price available almost year round. If you don't want to wait in line the night before but want a premium price on an esoteric good expectations seem out of line.

Given that you can still buy a Para2 in CTS-20cp for far less than a Sebbie how gouged is the customer? Perhaps Spyderco needs to crank up the msrp margins on select models or eliminate the middleman. I've yet to find a dealer who can reasonably meet quota on preorders.

[dbcad]

It's all opinion because placing morality is nearly impossible. While some things go against innate human rights this is not one of them. As mentioned, since most Spyderco products (even inflated) don't surpass MSRP it's hard to call foul.

Once you determine why it's wrong you can proceed to chastise/punish those who participate. IMHO going for the morality card because you don't share the belief more or less says, "I can't tell you why but it just is."

The only sprints that are tough to get (at any reasonable price) are the ultra hyped ones such as the Military, Para2, and Manix2. All of which have awesome standard ones at a fraction of the price available almost year round. If you don't want to wait in line the night before but want a premium price on an esoteric good expectations seem out of line.

Given that you can still buy a Para2 in CTS-20cp for far less than a Sebbie how gouged is the customer? Perhaps Spyderco needs to crank up the msrp margins on select models or eliminate the middleman. I've yet to find a dealer who can reasonably meet quota on preorders.

I agree on most points. Definition is the key. In my mind it's a private(non dealer) individual who has the means to purchase multiples of a sought after sprint run with the intent to sell at highly inflated prices later. To me that type of sefish greed is repugnant.

If an individual chooses to part with a duplicate model whatever the reason I see no problem. The intent is the critical question in my mind.

Individuals with an intent based on profit buy up a bunch of a highly desired piece to sell later at a very high price. That takes away the opportunity to own said piece away from folks who just want to appreciate and enjoy it at the regular price.

Then again, the most hated phrase for me is "It's not personal, it's only business", a self justification for imorality.

[darkstar29]

-snip-
Once you determine why it's wrong you can proceed to chastise/punish those who participate. IMHO going for the morality card because you don't share the belief more or less says, "I can't tell you why but it just is."
-snip-

Fair enough. It is what it is, and people make their own decisions on what is or isn't right.
Anyhow, I'm done talking about it. :)

[bh49]

I am really surprised that this thread is still going.

After reading through the thread, it has shown me the true colors of the forum and how people will not hesitate to take advantage of another person (even other fellow forum members) and bend them over without a second thought and without batting an eye. Perhaps times have changed, as coming to this forum has never made me feel this way until lately.

Jay,
I am sorry, but this is not correct. I learn my lesson in the summer of 2006, even before you joined the forum. It was summer of sprint delica ZDP. ZDP used to be hotter than M390 or any carpenter steel. Quite a few forum member, including me placed pre-orders a little late and were not able to buy knives from the first batch. People who got the knives were making comments that these Delicas cuts like lightsabers and we were dieing jealous. I was stunned to see some respectable forum members (they are not active anymore) selling these Delicas on BF and asking more than double. Since than I am placing pre-order with the same dealer as soon as I hear and I didn't miss any knives, which I wanted. But selling :spyder: with profit as I see always was.

This has been an educational thread. I've learned that buying a Spyderco knife with the intent to resell is exactly like withholding food, water, medicine and shelter from disaster victims by massively raising the prices.

I am really surprise that you learn this only now.
There are no (normal)people here, only Spydernuts.
We prefer S90V CF Military to a gallon of water in the middle of Sahara desert. :D :)

[markg]

I feel there is a deeper unspoken issue here. I believe the practice of pre-orders by knife dealers is what is the real problem. I place a pre-order with a company, and then find out that there are not enough knives to cover the pre-order and I am out of luck at that point. Worst yet, some dealers are taking a non-refundable deposit on the knives. Now consider the fact that if I cancel the pre-order I owe them $5 or so... But if they are unable to deliver the knife, do they refund my $5 and then give me an additional $5 store credit for not coming thru on their end?

This all came into being because dealers were not able to deliver, and people placed multiple pre-orders to cover their bases then left dealers in the lurch when they did not buy from all the dealers they had pre-orders with.

LE knives have been around forever, the issue of distribution and fairness has only seem to have been aggravated by the pre-order trend.

I think the best way to deal with this is for makers to tell dealers they cannot do pre-orders on their knives... Then let it roll like the old days.

[Blerv]

I agree Markg.

Dealers in my past who couldn't fulfill preorders simply said, "sorry I have no control! /blame shift Spyderco". It's annoying to think you wait for 4 months watching them to by at normal price and then scamper at the last minute. I find it hard to believe GP Knives (for example) couldnt get the 15 Dodo's they ordered. So...where did they go?

I've never not been able to get one though as SFO normally has stock. Even paying an extra $50 on eBay would do in this case. It just seems there should be a better system or at least proper disclaimers.

It's a shame you can't get on a preorder list via the forums. Even if they distribute that list to their dealers you have your name on a knife somewhere.

[Fred Sanford]

It happens all the time. It pisses me off and I will not do it. Tons of other stuff to make profit on in life. I just wish people wouldn't do it so the people that really want the knives could get one and enjoy it. I refuse to pay a premium for Sprints because of this. If other people would refuse to pay a premium nobody would buy them and these jerks would have to bring their prices down.

[chuck_roxas45]

Hhhhmmm I mentioned some time ago that there was a basic disadvantage to the pre-order thing but I was shouted down.

[jossta]

Has anyone from either side changed their mind based on this thread?