Have you been disappointed with the J.D Smith machining flaws ?

[North61]

I guess the problem is that someone plops down quite a bit of cash for something they feel will be perfect..then it isn't. High Expectations crash and buyers remorse sets in. I can see that.

Myself, I buy working knives. My biggest complaint with Spyderco is that many higher ends one I have acquired are almost too beautiful to use. My Ocelot for instance. I keep putting it back in it's case for fear of scratching it. Can't quite imagine using it hard. I was very happy to find a well used not abused combo-edged gut hook Impala. Looks like the former owner cut cement with the Spyder edge. I reprofiled it and have a great user. I am not scared to blemish it because it already is. Bring on the moose!

[Seanski]

I remember the day when every knife I bought was perfect. There wasn't anything
wrong with any of them. Then I joined a few forums and all sorts of deficiencies
started surfacing on my knives. Whats up with that? :)

[cyberspyder]

I guess the problem is that someone plops down quite a bit of cash for something they feel will be perfect..then it isn't. High Expectations crash and buyers remorse sets in. I can see that.

Myself, I buy working knives. My biggest complaint with Spyderco is that many higher ends one I have acquired are almost too beautiful to use. My Ocelot for instance. I keep putting it back in it's case for fear of scratching it. Can't quite imagine using it hard. I was very happy to find a well used not abused combo-edged gut hook Impala. Looks like the former owner cut cement with the Spyder edge. I reprofiled it and have a great user. I am not scared to blemish it because it already is. Bring on the moose!

Another Canuck? :D

+1. The problem with this is that we are currently on an international forum where anybody can post and respond. I agree that there will be people that either agree or disagree with you. Perhaps an email to Sal is in order and see what his view on this is? Whichever path he chooses IMO it'll be the best compromise and will not disappoint.

Let's put this into another perspective:

Some of you have set the bar too high IMO. I agree, to some $130 is A LOT of money (even me), but let's be brutally honest here. Why pick a 'premium' knife like the J.D Smith? Why not a cheaper, but similarly built Manix II or a Delica/Endura if cost was an issue? In the end, a knife is a knife. First and foremost, they were built to cut. I'd be happy with even a box cutter compared to no knife.

Spyderco is a production knife company let's not forget this point. CNC/machining time is expensive and there are wages to be paid and other miscellaneous costs.The quality portion is just a perk (and the company's long history of high-quality knives), and you guys are bemoaning them because of a mark on the choil (ie, one little slipup)? A wise man once said this:

IF it turns out that the knife functions better when the blade is not perfectly centered……then we don’t make it perfectly centered. Centered doesn’t mean good. Good means good. If the person that gets the knife isn’t happy with how the blade centering looks, they can send it in and we’ll make them happy. Even if in the end, the knife looks better than it works.

He refers to off-center blades, but this is a similar case of a minor flaw. Maybe that's the case with the J.D Smith, or an equipment shortcoming. If you're unhappy, send it back, but don't presume everyone else on the forums will agree with your view.

Take care, Brendan

[araneae]

I think we have strayed a bit here, but for the most part remained respectful. I guess the best advice for this situation has been offered already. If you are that picky about a production knife, you should buy it in person after a thorough inspection.

Opinions are going to vary whether this is a reasonable complaint, but they are just that- opinions. There can be no "correct" opinion.

[aj1985]

I had many paragraphs written regarding this matter, but let me just say it straight.

Quityerbitchin :p :)

I think that's sums it up best as I can.

Have fun, post pics, go cut stuff. Stop having arguments over the little stuff. It's not worth it in the long run. For the love of god use some more smileys. :D

aj

[JBE]

There isn't a production knife company in existence in which every single knife that rolls off of their line comes out perfect each and every time...It doesn't happen....Don't believe me? Spend some times perusing BladeForums or other knife manufacturer's forums and you'll see what I'm talking about - from machining marks to dull blades to stripped screws....the list is endless.

If you look hard enough at anything, you can always find something wrong, regardless if it's a $130 knife or a $130,000 car.

I have a Spyderco Military in which the blade isn't perfectly centered...Guess what? That knife is 9 years old and still locks-up and functions perfectly each and every time, which is exactly what I need it to do.

If you want closer to perfection, buy custom knives. I'd be willing to bet, however, that if you looked close enough, you could find a flaw or two in these as well.

[markg]

Not the best picture but here are the marks on mine. Apparently this is quite common, there's a thread over at BF with better pictures but it looks like that forum is down today.

If every knife has the same or similar machining or tooling marks... Then I don't care.

If only some have it, and others are "perfect" this is a quality control issue. And yes this was not the best example of quality control I have seen. If I was Spyderco I would have a nice chat with the maker in Japan.

If it is a known issue with this knife, then collector's value should not be too adversely affected. Sure "clean" examples will command better prices. But on this particular knife I don't see that a major issue.

Also, an issue to consider. If buying a sprint run of a discontinued knife, bear in mind there might not (actually will not) be spare parts and maybe even not spare knives to service warranty issues. If you want the knife fixed, and not a credit, then you maybe out of luck.

IMHO, Spyderco has a large collector's base. More so than many other companies. Many Spyderco knives are bought by collector's with no intention of using them. I believe this is the result of the fact that Spyderco makes a dizzying array of knives, that are unique in form and function. That being said, collectors are picky, obsessively so. One might say that sprint runs are geared towards collectors. If that is so, then expect some complaining about machining marks on exposed parts of the knife. Those tooling marks could cost a collector 5-10% of the value of the knife later. However given that these knives are made by a trusted maker in Japan, are a limited sprint run of a discontinued knife. Spyderco's hands are bit tied on this one. Everyone is just going to have to live with it.

Myself, I don't have the knife in question, however I would not mind having one. I like the knife. And if I had one with the tooling marks I would not care. That being said, I can understand some displeasure with an ELU who is not too happy about it. And I would lay money that if we were trodding the halls in Golden, we would find out they are not too happy with it either.

[gac]

Mine has a a couple small marks on the inside. They do not bother me.

I do not consider the J.D. Smith a collectible. It is a user knife. The price is the highest I have ever paid but I also figure the manufacturing process of a flat grind, that wonderfully pointy tip, G10 machining, and a limited run are what raised the price.

[MCM]

Need to say it again..........

Another thing to consider is all the various places Spyderco's are made.
This helps keep prices down and number of models up.
Few complain about that.........
Most Spyderco's are small runs. It may not seem like it, but with so many models they have to be. Its not like their cranking out Buck 110's here. What we are getting is basically limited runs at great prices for the small numbers made. I don't think any knife Co. is doing a better job than Sal & Spyderco.

Think about it. How many Knives Co's put out basically the same knife year after year with only minor changes.
What we have here is the full spectrum of design and materials at "normal" prices. To me this is Amazing. That's why as a knife enthusiast I gravitated to Spyderco after 3 decades of collecting knifes. The variety. Some do come out better than others. To me that's to be expected. I am not justifying it, but I do understand it. I have no idea what its got to be like having things made from all around the world and be responsible for every detail.
The Bushcraft UK comes to mind. Every detail planned. Perfect execution, then IMO due to many factors the wood issue. In my case, (In my mind) the cracks were due to severe climate change. My cracks have almost all healed.
But Spyderco took the hit. Just rambling some thoughts.

Just pass it on if your not 100% happy.

If you want to have your sox blown off, pick up a M4 Gayle Bradley Carbon Fiber C134CF with the funds from the JD and keep the change.

Then come back a let us know what you think.

[monsterdog]

I buy knives mainly to use and I'll be loyal to Spyderco until the day I die.

That being said, I have seen more F&F "issues" on newer Spyderco knives than I have ever seen in the past. Mostly gaps, uneven grinds, small fries really. The only time I felt the need to complain was for a lot of blade play in my S90V Manix 2, which I now understand is normal in that model for that lock when it is not fully engaged.

People are probably complaining more because they have been spoiled by the fantastic F&F of Spyderco in the past, now times are bad and Spyderco may let out more "lemons" to save on adjusting knives that do not quite pass QC but are still perfectly good for what a knife should do. Add to that the fact that Spyderco has a lot more models that cost more than in the past, and I think you have a recipe for why people feel they are not getting their money's worth.

I am not justifying the complaints, just trying to explain my idea of why they are there.

[MCM]

Some might not be happy with these grinds, but for what I paid for CF & ZDP
I am happy as heck! These are very smooth blades. Talk about a thin edge! WOW!
All I ask my dealer to check for on liner lock's is this type of engagement.
Happy as a clam. :)

[Blerv]

Some might not be happy with these grinds, but for what I paid for CF & ZDP
I am happy as heck! These are very smooth blades. Talk about a thin edge! WOW!
All I ask my dealer to check for on liner lock's is this type of engagement.
Happy as a clam. :)

Thanks for those MCM.

How do they perform? I have a ZDP Lum Chinese that's going to be one of my brothers wedding presents and it's a scary slicer.

I would imagine with the grind those would be great for office scalpels :) .

[MCM]

Personal opinion.
I much prefer these over my ZDP Lum's.
Will still keep 'em, but will use this one 10x as much.

[ilikeknives]

To me, personally, it comes down to consistency. I know a bit about the manufacturing industry. When one knife looks better than another, and when something has machining flaws, any mfr should clean them up during post-production QC, otherwise, they'd all have gouges and mis-matched pieces. Post-production QC is easy.
When I see pictures of certain individuals here, hanging with the owners of Spyderco at blade shows and the like, they then turning around and consistently being the first to berate people taking the time to come here concerned about what they feel are legit issues (who can say they aren't??) when items seem inconsistent, it is apparent where their loyalty is. Fine, no problem, but calling folks "unreasonable" (and other such monikers) for stating their views, in fact is unwelcomed and furthermore, a detrement to our hobby. (notice I said OUR hobby?) This brand, and the future of folks who read these forums and WON'T voice their opinion for fear of being berated, don't seem like the type who will carry this brand into the future. Its the folks who come here and get treated like worthy human beings, as ANYONE would want to be treated who qwill be the folks to buy 20 or 30 or more Spyderco's. What I am trying to say is BE FRIGGIN' NICE, cheesch. Its so easy, and it carries this brand and our hobby into the future. Not to do so, promotes an air of (false) superiority and a group of folks with a chip on their shoulder, that no one here should promote or condone. I've seen many unwarranted, even nefarious "jabs" thrown at people coming here asking questions, when, saying something well-placed and KIND would be just as easy. No one here owns this brand, and if you aren't for the future, knowing that honey attracts more newbies than vinegar, you tell me, do you think the owners of Spyderco would be happy knowing newbies are being treated like this from forum participants and dare say, long-timers, posing as either loyal or friends?? I don't think so. So, check your "chips" at the login, they aren't necessary, or I wager condoned. .
So there,,dead horse flogged enough.

[The Deacon]

Not quite.

So you're saying the opinions of those of us who own several hundred Spyderco knives, and thus have some degree of experience with what constitutes the company's normal level of fit and finish, are less valid than those of someone whose observations are based on a much smaller sampling? Sorry, you are certainly entitled to your opinion, and to your opinion of my opinion, but I think I'll keep offering my opinion when someone asks for opinions. No chips here, just an old opinionated SOB.

[Blerv]

Nobody is getting paid under the counter to say nice things, it just comes from dozens (or hundreds) of quality knives.

Maybe it's just luck (good or bad) but I think that anyone passionate about knocking quality control of a product is practicing his/her freedom of speech just as someone else who has never had a bad product. The person with 30+ knives and not a single bad one probably has a better standpoint than the guy who drew the short-straw in the pack w/o prior experience. Use the colloquial "troll" or "fanboy" as you may, it's still two people arguing with solid points. If you wish to debate or argue the goal should be to refrain from abuse and vulgarity as "playing nice" is far too subjective and idealistic.

When 600 piece sprints are made with exotic materials they simply can't throw away everyone with a blemish or slightly-off grind line. They are playing with carbon fiber and ZDP-189 when most brands mass produce aluminum handled S30v blades for the same price and consider you lucky. If they came to that stringent of aesthetic QC two things would likely happen: 1.) Kiss sprints goodbye. 2.) Increase the cost x 2.

I think the one thing we can all agree with is that people who bring up 15 month threads aren't immune to teasing. Brand loyalty or not...digging in a graveyard is never a good idea.

[jabba359]

So there,,dead horse flogged enough.

You realize this "dead horse" thread has been dead for over a year, right?

When one knife looks better than another, and when something has machining flaws, any mfr should clean them up during post-production QC, otherwise, they'd all have gouges and mis-matched pieces. Post-production QC is easy.

You have obviously never worked in QC, as it isn't easy at all. As far as large-scale production goes, usually QC doesn't inspect every single piece, but takes a sampling % that should accurately represent the whole.

No one here owns this brand, and if you aren't for the future, knowing that honey attracts more newbies than vinegar, you tell me, do you think the owners of Spyderco would be happy knowing newbies are being treated like this from forum participants and dare say, long-timers, posing as either loyal or friends?? I don't think so. So, check your "chips" at the login, they aren't necessary, or I wager condoned. .

Actually, there are more than a couple people on here that do, indeed, own the brand. Sal, Eric, Michael Janich, Kristi and others that work at and own Spyderco are on the forums frequently, and they interact, read, and moderate the comments. As for people "posing" as loyal or friends, I'd beg to differ that these people are, in fact, "posing". They really are loyal and they really are friends.

While I do see some rude comments pop up from time to time, they are few and far between and are even less often from long-time members of the forums. If you have ever used any other forum, it's unlikely you will find one as civilized and respectful as the Spyderco forum. We all have a right to an opinion and have to realize that some are going to agree and others disagree. I don't see the problem with telling people they are unreasonable when they seem to be (expecting Rolls Royce fit and finish at Toyota prices). Now if it degenerates into name calling, personal insults, and profanity (all of which rarely happen on here, and are usually quickly moderated away by Kristi), then I can see the point. But the fact is, there is far less "berating" on here than there is helpful education and information.

[Pinetreebbs]

"Another viewpoint"

You posted your opinions other posters may or may not agree with you; they may very well point out facts that are contrary to your opinion. Ranting about facts does not say much, choosing a dead thread with a negative title says a lot.

[dman62]

Nice pics guys! This may sound funny given the title of this thread but I really want one of these now.

[v8r]

Boy somebody drug up a old thread.
To me the "flaws" Are a Non issue, and I like Foliage green. I don't personally stare at the bottom of a knife blade. The top, sides, and edge are all I am concerned with, but that's just me.