Survival Spyders

[Zdenek]

Very interesting and inspiring thread for a knife selection.
Though I haven't got a Spyderco yet, I incline to larger Manix, and to LAVA which is now in process. Surely a bigger fixed blade will be also of use.
As to survival in general, don't forget to have with you a box of matches in a water proof wrap. Fire supposedly increases the chance to survive by 80% than without it.
I will bet that majority of us if not all will be totally unprepared when an extreme situation occurs. Treacherousness of such a situation is that it is unexpected and can occur anytime and anywhere in the middle of peace when we think that nothing bad is not going to come. God forbid.

[denn]

PS. This is fun... I'm curious to see what I'm missing.

you forgot the cyanide-tablet :p

:D

denn

[Jordan]

Bah, cyanide is for cowards... if need be I will simply commit sepuku!

[zenheretic]

Bah, cyanide is for cowards... if need be I will simply commit sepuku!

Who says the cyanide is for the person humping the bug out bag (i.e. our plucky hero, me, or you)?

[zenheretic]

Like someone already said, it depends on the type of survival we are working with. In a short term disaster...I rate that a Katrina or that Asian ocean wave a couple of years ago short term disasters, you are likely going to get stuck with what you have on ya.

For the city, I am humbled by the Deacon's brilliance. Most of your obstacles will be locked doors. An actual prybar is genius for the city survivor (works good for wacking alongside the head too.) Then whatever pocket knife you have on ya. A nice lightweight FRN delica or plain salt is nice to slip in a sock if you have to go sheepletastic...who says the sheepdog can't blend with the sheep?

Rural is harder due to environment. for example what I might need in JD's cougar covered swamps might be different than Clovisc's Africa, or the Grizzly barr infested northern woods of my homeland. Good rule of thumb is one serrated edge and one plain edge.

My ears perk up when I read Clovisc's African experiences....pay attention to those IMO.

The spydersaw is the bare minimum length I would want in a saw. Consider most things needing sawing will be too big for the Spydersaw to be efficient. Don't skimp try and find a saw made in northern Europe or Canada.

For the long term, hunker down in the bunker scenario, interchangeable parts is high consideration. Probably better off with fixed blades, but if you really really want folders, get several of the same model, that you can take apart and swap parts...no spydie spa in that scenario. Or buy a 1/2 crate of PE and 1/2 crate of SE salts.

[JD Spydo]

You can never have the best gear for any type of situations and always have to compromise if you're after a "general survival kit".
My experience has taught me that above all, you need to be light weight and comfortable and therefore, as much as I appreciate fixed blades on all their qualities I wouldn't take one unless I'm going some place I know I specifically need it.
For me a good set to keep around is a Salt series knife, a swisstool (would have prefered a spydertool but it doesn't exist yet :D ), and a Spydersaw (which I think I'll get soon).
This combination is lightweight and easy to carry, low maitenance and has most of the tools you'll need IMO.

Well "i.v." that is a great point You know I should have qualified that by saying "Spyders That Are Essential or Edged Tools That Are Essential" for survival. Because when you consider what Deacon says about his situtation it clearly goes to show you that there are probably very few of us that are going to have the same needs for our own individual given situation. You being from the part of the globe you are from would lead me to believe that everyones geographical terrain along with the local "flora & fauna" would definitely give everyone their own unique set of demands to deal with.

But with that being said I still think that there is a "common denominator" of a gear list that most of us could still benefit from irrespective of our environment. Also I am very intrigued about all of the Brothers/Sisters that agree with me in the "MULTITOOL" department. Personally I have a Victorinox SWISS TOOL and a Spyderench and together with those 2 tools I can get a lot of things done. I have that set of tools in my truck all the time and then I take them with me on my ATV in the wetlands. I do agree with the one brother in his desire in hopes that Spyderco will someday also come up with a more conventional multitool. However for the time being Victorinox does have some good reliable units.

I also like the one Brother's suggestion about the Cold Steel Bushmaster. For all of you who are not familiar with that blade it is a knife with a hollowed out handle which has a lot of different possibilities. Hopefully some day Spyderco will make a fixed blade with a hollow handle in which you could store stuff. Great input folks!! :cool:

[kbuzbee]

kbuzbee,

As a knife fan I think a Busse are wonderful blades, immensely tough, great steel...

In a survival situation I would be delighted to have one with me. Or one of the Hossums for that matter. But I would rather have 2 or 3 Ka-Bars and some extra equipment for the price. A knife can be dropped and irretrivable, and I can't afford a Busse, let alone another one for back up.
Over the last 60 years, Ka Bar have proved themselves tough enough I believe

I take your point S.J., thanks!

If I'm reading between your lines, 'if you could pack a couple Busses you would but that just isn't an option for everyone'. I gotta tell you, I went over to the Busse forum for a bit and it is down right SCARY how many Busses some of these guys own. They are as bad as we are! :D (and at 6x the cost each - at least!). Right now my fb of choice would be my M2 BM Nimravus but I'm gonna be adding something a bit more stout SOON. :D

A lot of this discussion seems to center around the size of the bugout bag. Mine holds a couple fbs and my small GB axe easily with most of the other stuff listed.

To the multi tool discussion, I prefer my LM Charge xTi. I've owned (or mostly still own) everything that's been listed and the xTi is easily the top of my list.


Ken

[Saint-Just]

Busse collectors are as bad as we are. Quite true. And the good thing is they USE their knives just like we do. Which is great because Jerry and Sal are working really hard to provide us with TOOLS rather than works of art (didn't say some weren't as well, though :D )

A small GB axe is a fantastic addition if you're out there. JD Spydo rules permitting, I would include one.

But I'll stick with my SAK. I also have a wave and a juice pro, but I only take them out occasionally. My Explorer never leaves my pocket, even when I take my LMs (nor does the Tasman, but that's another story

Who said "overkill"?

[kbuzbee]

But I'll stick with my SAK. I also have a wave and a juice pro, but I only take them out occasionally. My Explorer never leaves my pocket, even when I take my LMs

I too have a SAK, a Wave, a PST, a couple different Juice model, 2 Gerbers, a Swisstool and a SOG. They are all good but once I carried this xTi, that was it. Better steel, nice locks, one PE and one SE blade, hole open (okay, it's not round but it's "okay", pocket clip, interchangable bits, super strong etc.... I 'heard' the new one is even S30V (mine is 154CM)....

I think the thing we're not talking about here is the skills needed to effectively use all these wonderful tools. A Boy Scout knife is more effective in the hands of someone with "skills" that a Busse in the hands on someone who has no idea what to do with it.

Also the idea of "What are you planning for?" is pretty critical (Thanks Deacon for bringing this up). I did corporate disaster recovery planning for many years. Understanding the problem(s) you are trying to prepare for radically changes the solution(s).

For me, I can't imagine many "disasters" that would force me out of the house. We're not likely for "Katrina" style emergencies. For most things I think we'll be better off hunkering down here.

Great thread! Alway good to hear others thoughts on this stuff.

Ken

[shu]

Jordan, a small bottle of citric acid in your BOB can be used to neutralize the iodine taste in your water (and add some vitamin C to your diet)--just remember to wait until the iodine has done its job before adding it to your canteen.

Denn, I have not used a Spydersaw but have cut a lot of wood. IME a folding saw like this Corona will do a better job than either a large knife or a small axe, but of course your results may vary.


Personally, I have little use for a 'Rambo' knife. A mid-sized FB like the Temperance, BM 140 or 190, Bushman (or mini version), Becker Crewman, etc. is more than adequate for most uses, survival or not. Truth be told, I got a lot of service from old carbon steel Camillus, Ontario and Schrade knives 'back in the day'. As has been stated previously "it is the Indian, not the arrow".

[Halfneck]

While I really like my Spyderco Folders, and they would be comforting to have, they are not my 1st choice.

My camping cutlery selection works well for extended time in the woods and would work just as well in a SHTF situation.

1) Victorinox Rucksack - looking at getting a Victorinox OHT.
2) Fallkniven F1 - waiting on a SWKW Bandicoot LM, I just prefer Carbon steel FBs.
3) Gransfors Bruk Wilderness Hatchet or a old CS Kuhkri. Interested in the Kershaw Outcast in D2, but waiting to see the upcoming Spyderco large FBs, especially the Schempp Camp Knife.

[i.v]

But with that being said I still think that there is a "common denominator" of a gear list that most of us could still benefit from irrespective of our environment. Also I am very intrigued about all of the Brothers/Sisters that agree with me in the "MULTITOOL" department. Personally I have a Victorinox SWISS TOOL and a Spyderench and together with those 2 tools I can get a lot of things done. I have that set of tools in my truck all the time and then I take them with me on my ATV in the wetlands. I do agree with the one brother in his desire in hopes that Spyderco will someday also come up with a more conventional multitool. However for the time being Victorinox does have some good reliable units.

It's easy to see while most value multi tools in any situation, they simply offer the most versatility in the smallest package, top that off with good build quality like Victorinox or leatherman or a few others and you have a very desireable addition to any survival kit.

[JD Spydo]

I think this multitool area deserves some more looking into. The Spyderench being an ingenious invention and an extremely handy tool still comes up a bit short in some areas. That's why I always take my Victorinox Swiss Tool with me along with the Spyderench. The 2 of them really work in concert with each other.

I would like to see Spyderco make a multi-tool with more of the attributes of the main line multi-tools. It appears to me that I am hearing more and more from many Forums as to the survival value of these multi tools.

I think we've ascertained that fixed blades have a huge place in that scenerio as well. Fixed blades for the most part have a bit more muscle than the vast majority of folders.

And the Spydersaw is something that I must say that I personally never gave much thought to until Clovisc called our attention to it.

My question now to hopefully this thread on track is What other cutlery or tool related items have we not covered or not covered enough? I am personally grateful for the very valuable input that has come forth. This knowledge is extremely important to all of us. Also I am wondering what role knife lanyards could play in the suvival/preparedness picture?

[eastr]

what about a hatchet spyderco's frn and vg-10. hatchets would be very important i would think :confused: so there would be the

fixed blade
folder
saw
hatchet
multi tool

and some way to keep them sharp if you were able to fit that into your B.O.B
you with the rite mind set and will could survive anywhere. That is of corse with the other thing you mite consider a must have. :D
:spyder: rocks :cool:

[Firefighter880]

I think this multitool area deserves some more looking into. The Spyderench being an ingenious invention and an extremely handy tool still comes up a bit short in some areas. That's why I always take my Victorinox Swiss Tool with me along with the Spyderench. The 2 of them really work in concert with each other.

I would like to see Spyderco make a multi-tool with more of the attributes of the main line multi-tools. It appears to me that I am hearing more and more from many Forums as to the survival value of these multi tools.

I completely agree. I always carry my Leatherman in a Blackhawk sheath horizontal in the small-of-back, and I would definately retire that if Spyderco came out with a similar product with all of the "main-line" multi-tool attributes, especially if they can incorporate an interior or even exterior blade that can be opened with a Spyder-hole.

I'm all for it! Now we just need to get Spyderco to role with it....

[JD Spydo]

With all of these "Survival/Preparedness" websites popping up like mushrooms I think that Spyderco could be well poised to really capitilize on this market.
It's a perfect marketing scenerio because with the Spydersaw already in the line up and with the Hossums just right around the corner they could put a couple more items on the market and just clean house.

With all of the stuff on FEMA, Homeland Security and various other webpages it's just a market waiting to be tapped. I went into a store here locally that sells that type of stuff and most of what they had on the shelves was just really cheap junk. So a market for quality items is already there.

[ceya]

I took my Ceya's Scorpion and made it a field blade.

It is for a local knife shop in NYC that I designed their BOB/Prepardness bag.

S/F,
CEYA!

[clovisc]

[quote="zenheretic"] Rural is harder due to environment. for example what I might need in JD's cougar covered swamps might be different than Clovisc's Africa, or the Grizzly barr infested northern woods of my homeland. Good rule of thumb is one serrated edge and one plain edge.

My ears perk up when I read Clovisc's African experiences....pay attention to those IMO. [quote]

that's a nice compliment, zen! thanks. :D

i'd certainly agree that environment plays a big factor in what kind of survival gear... or spydies... you should carry. as does the length of time you're travelling or spending away from "civilization." lots of times environments change, too... for example, sometimes i had to travel through the bush, often on foot for great distances, to eventually end up a few days later in a big, BAD city... you transition from a very really wilderness survival situation to an urban one with an EXTREMELY different dynamic.

some of the biggest factors in my choices were...:

-- ease of sharpening

-- ease of cleaning (i'd rather not clean up a manix full of sludge at night in the land of no electricity..)

-- clip strength / retention (both walking through brush and transport on vehicles involved LOTS of brushing, bumping, and scraping around... lost a scorpius in a taxi, and a couple knives in the bush...)

-- concealability/NKP-friendly (police, paramilitaries, and soldiers aren't too friendly about you using or visibly carrying a fixed blade or a mili in public)

-- corrosion resistance (7 month rainy season... no way to avoid getting caught in torrential downpours. might have to walk for hours in a storm).

-- SD (i always carried at least two emergency SD knives while in a city... because BAD things can happen in a flash, no matter where you are or how street-smart you might be.)

-- cramped quarters (if i need a knife while crammed into a truck, for whatever reason, it's going to be a lot harder getting out my mili than getting out my dragonfly...)

not to try to sound like a mall ninja, or indiana jones, but i was pretty used to the fact that anything could go wrong at any time... and that quite often things DID go wrong, and very wrong at that. there were a couple situations where my murder seemed immanent (with thugs discussing it right in front of me, thinking i couldn't understand their language), quite a few times i was stranded in the bush when a vehicle i was on broke down, and forced to walk to find food or water, or to get to a friendly village... quite a few times i was in EXTREMELY unsafe buses and vehicles where, in the case of an accident, cutting myself out with a manix might have been necessary.

and then, perhaps most important at all, the fact that if your knife is dirty and you use it to eat, who knows WHAT is going to end-up on your food. and you might be hard-pressed to find water to clean it.

i used the manix for a while just because i liked it, but it was too heavy, it kept wanting to fall out of my pocket, it was harder to sharpen, it was a pain to clean, and... i broke the tip off.

after that, my mili and arsenal of salts did most of the work my fixed-blade didn't do. had a native i used pretty frequently. my tasman salt was phenomenally useful in the bush, and when in the "city" it was my number one SD choice. dragonfly was a great low-key knife...

and the spydersaw was always in my bag.

any knife can be useful for survival, though... if you're comfortable with it, know its limitations (breaking a knife in the bush sucks...), and you feel it meets your personal and environmental needs.

[Mobydick64]

Hello to you all.
This is the first time i'm able to participate.
My intrests in knives goes back to the days when i was 13 years old and bought my first knive wich was a Victorynox.
I still have it and i've been collecting them ever since.
I love to go out camping and hiking, often wandering of the beaten track.
When i go hiking or camping i carry several knives.
For camping i've got a Mariner CO2 (gin1 steel) Which is as any Spyderco with a serrated edge unrivalled in cutting ropes.
A Spyderco endura with a plain edge and a Victorinox multitool.
For hiking i use a Fallkniven F1 (waiting for Spyderco to make a fixed blade Manix PLEASE !!!!) which is a rather cheap blade but has up till now never failed me.
A Endura 2 C47 plain edge and in my emergency kit i've got a Cricket SS from which i removed the clip, polished one side so i can use it as a signalling mirror and on the other side i have my personals, medication and blood type laser engraved for identification if anything should happen to me.
All my knives have a leather thong trough the lanyard hole to prevent dropping or loosing it when i'm using it in the outdoors.
An SAS instructor once told me that if you loose your knive in a survival situation your chances of survival drop 50 %.

And to add to the discussion of the use of multitools in a survival situation.
Can anybody explain to me the use of a bottle opener, a screwdriver or a pair of pliers in the wildernes.

Greetings and keep on hiking,
Oscar

[Jordan]

Welcome Moby

And thanks for the tip Shu